Iran

[huskertim]

I can't believe no one has started this thread, so I figured I'd have a go at it.

 

IMCO the prez is in a no win situation here. If we interfere, then the Iranian Supreme Council will have the bad guy they always want to rally around. If we do nothing, the people may see us as the paper tiger that so many extremists believe us to be and, furthermore, it will seem a tacid approval of Iran's oppression. Words alone may not be enough and promises unkept will haunt us to no end.

[SOCALHUSKER]

I can't believe no one has started this thread, so I figured I'd have a go at it.

 

IMCO the prez is in a no win situation here. If we interfere, then the Iranian Supreme Council will have the bad guy they always want to rally around. If we do nothing, the people may see us as the paper tiger that so many extremists believe us to be and, furthermore, it will seem a tacid approval of Iran's oppression. Words alone may not be enough and promises unkept will haunt us to no end.

 

That's what years of an interventionist foreign policy will bring about.

[HuskerExpat]

I can't believe no one has started this thread, so I figured I'd have a go at it.

 

IMCO the prez is in a no win situation here. If we interfere, then the Iranian Supreme Council will have the bad guy they always want to rally around. If we do nothing, the people may see us as the paper tiger that so many extremists believe us to be and, furthermore, it will seem a tacid approval of Iran's oppression. Words alone may not be enough and promises unkept will haunt us to no end.

 

I guess it shouldn't surprise me, since it just political maneuvering, but I am surprised that so many politicians on the right are saying Obama should support Moussavi in Iran. Hello, he's not that much of a change from the current guy. Moussavi had the job in the 80s, and Iran wasn't exactly our friend back then either...

[huskertim]

Of course the conservatives would support just about anyone who wasn't Ahmadinejad, but your right, do you prefer the devil we know to the devil we don't. More importantly though I think we have a real opportunity to connect with the people of Iran if we can find a way to play the empathy card and yet keep our distance.

[strigori]

I think Obama has played it about as well as he could. Going full on for Moussavi just gets us labeled as interfering in Iran's internal issues, and they would have a point with it, and odds are Ahmadinejad will still be the pres and be who Obama has to deal with make it even more pointless. Just calling for an end to the violence is about all he can do

[sarge87]

Who is saying anything about supporting Mousavi? Any quotes from Conservatives saying they love Mousavi? I believe there were just as many Democrats expressing concerns on this issue also.

 

Anyone have a guess why protest signs were written in English? Maybe looking for a little moral support from abroad?

 

I guess shooting unarmed students in a Tienanmen Square-esque style warrants a no response. The fact the Iranian government is charging a $3,000 bullet fee to parents picking up their dead from the morgue warrants a no response.

 

The students are using the election as a platform to rise up against an oppressive regime for just a few freedoms. I don't think making a statement that you support the student's right to peaceably assemble is going to throw the world into turmoil. Nobody is calling for an armed conflict here.

 

The Iranian government labeled this unarmed woman as a terrorist after she was shot by a Basiji Sniper. (Graphic)

CfrfEtW2aT4

Iran’s regime has issued a ban on memorials for a young woman whose death has become the focal point of protests against the clerical regime. Neda Agha Soltan, 27, was dubbed the Angel of Freedom after a video which appeared to show her being shot by a government sniper was posted on the internet.

 

 

“It’s not productive given the history of U.S.-Iranian relations to be seen as meddling.” - Barack Obama

The Chinese used much of the same phrase when U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton on the 20th anniversary of the Tienanmen Square massacre called on China to release all those still imprisoned in connection with the protests, to stop harassing those who took part and to begin a dialogue with the victims' families. China denounced the comments as "crude meddling."

 

“I think it’s important that, moving forward, whatever investigations take place are done in a way that is not resulting in bloodshed and is not resulting in people being stifled in expressing their views,” - Barack Obama

 

The English, French and Germans - two of the latter are trading partners with Iran - had no such reservations about strongly condemning the targeting of unarmed protesters.

 

 

 

Oh, and SoCal, if it weren't for an interventionist foreign policy thanks to the French, we would still be under British rule.

 

Flame away, I'll be in Denver for a couple days but I'll get around to responding.

[huskertim]

I can't believe no one has started this thread, so I figured I'd have a go at it.

 

IMCO the prez is in a no win situation here. If we interfere, then the Iranian Supreme Council will have the bad guy they always want to rally around. If we do nothing, the people may see us as the paper tiger that so many extremists believe us to be and, furthermore, it will seem a tacid approval of Iran's oppression. Words alone may not be enough and promises unkept will haunt us to no end.

 

I guess it shouldn't surprise me, since it just political maneuvering, but I am surprised that so many politicians on the right are saying Obama should support Moussavi in Iran. Hello, he's not that much of a change from the current guy. Moussavi had the job in the 80s, and Iran wasn't exactly our friend back then either...

 

 

This is way beyond support for Moussavi, these kids are risking their lives for the freedoms we take for granted. After the way this has played out, we must be stronger in our condemnation and be willing to show we are behind these protestors. I don't think the Irainian people are going to buy the whole US is satan crap at this point, things have changed quickly and whereas we might suffer down the road for a strong stance now we will certainly suffer for a weak one.

 

The climate is changeing and we must change with it.

[huskerjack23]

Who is saying anything about supporting Mousavi? Any quotes from Conservatives saying they love Mousavi? I believe there were just as many Democrats expressing concerns on this issue also.

 

Anyone have a guess why protest signs were written in English? Maybe looking for a little moral support from abroad?

 

I guess shooting unarmed students in a Tienanmen Square-esque style warrants a no response. The fact the Iranian government is charging a $3,000 bullet fee to parents picking up their dead from the morgue warrants a no response.

 

The students are using the election as a platform to rise up against an oppressive regime for just a few freedoms. I don't think making a statement that you support the student's right to peaceably assemble is going to throw the world into turmoil. Nobody is calling for an armed conflict here.

 

The Iranian government labeled this unarmed woman as a terrorist after she was shot by a Basiji Sniper. (Graphic)

CfrfEtW2aT4

Iran’s regime has issued a ban on memorials for a young woman whose death has become the focal point of protests against the clerical regime. Neda Agha Soltan, 27, was dubbed the Angel of Freedom after a video which appeared to show her being shot by a government sniper was posted on the internet.

 

 

“It’s not productive given the history of U.S.-Iranian relations to be seen as meddling.” - Barack Obama

The Chinese used much of the same phrase when U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton on the 20th anniversary of the Tienanmen Square massacre called on China to release all those still imprisoned in connection with the protests, to stop harassing those who took part and to begin a dialogue with the victims' families. China denounced the comments as "crude meddling."

 

“I think it’s important that, moving forward, whatever investigations take place are done in a way that is not resulting in bloodshed and is not resulting in people being stifled in expressing their views,” - Barack Obama

 

The English, French and Germans - two of the latter are trading partners with Iran - had no such reservations about strongly condemning the targeting of unarmed protesters.

 

 

 

Oh, and SoCal, if it weren't for an interventionist foreign policy thanks to the French, we would still be under British rule.

 

Flame away, I'll be in Denver for a couple days but I'll get around to responding.

+1

 

although, you mentioned how england, france, and germany condemned iran for this, but it seems like that iran hates us the most, so any condemnation coming from us would be a slap in the face to the nth degree to them. it's a no-win situation for america, not anyone else.

[SOCALHUSKER]

 

Oh, and SoCal, if it weren't for an interventionist foreign policy thanks to the French, we would still be under British rule.

 

Flame away, I'll be in Denver for a couple days but I'll get around to responding.

 

Would we? And you know this how?

 

Yes, maybe the Brits would've hung on to the colonies for a few more years, but as with every empire in history, government meddling and economic problems cause the expansion to come crashing down and the British reign was no exception.

 

An interventionist foreign policy always leads to "blowback" and that is nothing a free society should, wants, or can deal with.

[huskerjack23]

that's why they've been able to hold on to australia and canada for so long.

[SOCALHUSKER]

that's why they've been able to hold on to australia and canada for so long.

 

What???

[huskerjack23]

well get it? they still have australia and canada. apparently they don't care about living under a monarchy.

[sarge87]

Who is saying anything about supporting Mousavi? Any quotes from Conservatives saying they love Mousavi? I believe there were just as many Democrats expressing concerns on this issue also.

 

Anyone have a guess why protest signs were written in English? Maybe looking for a little moral support from abroad?

 

I guess shooting unarmed students in a Tienanmen Square-esque style warrants a no response. The fact the Iranian government is charging a $3,000 bullet fee to parents picking up their dead from the morgue warrants a no response.

 

The students are using the election as a platform to rise up against an oppressive regime for just a few freedoms. I don't think making a statement that you support the student's right to peaceably assemble is going to throw the world into turmoil. Nobody is calling for an armed conflict here.

 

The Iranian government labeled this unarmed woman as a terrorist after she was shot by a Basiji Sniper. (Graphic)

CfrfEtW2aT4

Iran’s regime has issued a ban on memorials for a young woman whose death has become the focal point of protests against the clerical regime. Neda Agha Soltan, 27, was dubbed the Angel of Freedom after a video which appeared to show her being shot by a government sniper was posted on the internet.

 

 

“It’s not productive given the history of U.S.-Iranian relations to be seen as meddling.” - Barack Obama

The Chinese used much of the same phrase when U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton on the 20th anniversary of the Tienanmen Square massacre called on China to release all those still imprisoned in connection with the protests, to stop harassing those who took part and to begin a dialogue with the victims' families. China denounced the comments as "crude meddling."

 

“I think it’s important that, moving forward, whatever investigations take place are done in a way that is not resulting in bloodshed and is not resulting in people being stifled in expressing their views,” - Barack Obama

 

The English, French and Germans - two of the latter are trading partners with Iran - had no such reservations about strongly condemning the targeting of unarmed protesters.

 

 

 

Oh, and SoCal, if it weren't for an interventionist foreign policy thanks to the French, we would still be under British rule.

 

Flame away, I'll be in Denver for a couple days but I'll get around to responding.

+1

 

although, you mentioned how england, france, and germany condemned iran for this, but it seems like that iran hates us the most, so any condemnation coming from us would be a slap in the face to the nth degree to them. it's a no-win situation for america, not anyone else.

So you are saying that we shouldn't give a damn about human rights abuses as long as we have something to gain from it?

 

Is it a win if you give up your principles to achieve that win?

[SOCALHUSKER]

well get it? they still have australia and canada. apparently they don't care about living under a monarchy.

 

Because the British are ruling either???? Did it ever occur to you that the monarchy's of both are more about tradition than government rule. What policy is the Queen implementing? Last time I checked the United States had a far greater role influencing government policy in both Canada and Australia than Britain does. So who really rules either?

[huskerjack23]

just saying that they are still under empirical rule