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Drop Examples of Indisputable Proof That Systemic Racism Still Exists in Here


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Here, let me give you one: Whites were much more likely to be found fighting for the freedom of African Americans than African Americans themselves. Although this is true, does it really say anything of interest? If not, why not?

 

You should probably explain this instead of just dropping it out there. Because my interpretation of your comment is that Whites are more likely to be in the U.S. military than Blacks. It took me about a minute of google searching and a minute of calculating to show that you're wrong, if that's what you're arguing. But you're so vague here I'm not sure where you are coming up with your statement.

 

Anyhow, here you go:

 

Whites make up 63.7% of the U.S. population.

Whites make up 74.6% of Active Duty.

0.746/0.637 = 1.17

 

Blacks make up 12.2% of the U.S. population.

Blacks make up 17.8% of Active Duty.

0.178/0.122 = 1.46

 

 

Whites are 1.17 times as likely as all races in the U.S. to be on Active Duty.

 

Blacks are 1.46 times as likely as all races in the U.S. to be on Active Duty.

 

Blacks are more likely than Whites to be on Active Duty.

 

This data was from the 2010 census and the first link in my search: http://www.statisticbrain.com/demographics-of-active-duty-u-s-military/

 

(The active duty data is from 2016. Black birth rate is slightly higher so we might see a slight difference, but Blacks would still be more likely to be part of the active duty military than Whites).

 

 

Research suggests that racial minorities, particularly African Americans (and especially African American women) are more likely to choose military service than their white counterparts because they see the military as a meritocratic institution that offers them greater opportunity than they would find in higher education or the civilian labor market.

 

https://www.princeton.edu/futureofchildren/publications/docs/Chapter%201.pdf

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Do stories count?

 

When I was in college, it was very easy to be substitute teacher. Just had to have a pulse. I was an Engineering major and thought this would be easy. One of the first classes I had to sub was world history. First page of the chapter shows FDR/Churchill/Stalin at Yalta split with Hitler/Mussolini/Tojo. I asked "Can anyone tell me anything about WWII?"

 

A boy's hand shoots up and I thought he was going to lose it. I call on him and I can still hear the response "My dad says the Holocaust is a conspiracy created by...". I never expected that kind of response.

 

Anyway, I've been telling this story for years. Last summer I was telling it to a neighbor that was formerly a VP at one of the wealthier High Schools near Denver. I told him the story. He laughs and says "Only one, huh? I had to deal with dozens of those a semester. It's gotten worse last few years."

 

What blows me away is how highly educated, well-off people in a mostly progressive environment can believe something like the Holocaust conspiracy.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Ben & Jerry's coming out in support of Black Lives Matter today:

http://www.vox.com/2016/10/7/13199288/ben-jerrys-black-lives-matter

 

Their 7-point list on systemic racism:

http://www.benjerry.com/whats-new/systemic-racism-is-real

 

This is pretty impressive. We've known Ben & Jerry's to be socially engaged, but it's still amazing reading this and thinking, "This is on the website of an ice cream company."

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Ben & Jerry's coming out in support of Black Lives Matter today:

http://www.vox.com/2016/10/7/13199288/ben-jerrys-black-lives-matter

 

Their 7-point list on systemic racism:

http://www.benjerry.com/whats-new/systemic-racism-is-real

 

This is pretty impressive. We've known Ben & Jerry's to be socially engaged, but it's still amazing reading this and thinking, "This is on the website of an ice cream company."

 

They are definitely a socially progressive corporation. They could have been way more aggressive in the language & stats. Taking a moderate stance really underscores how much bias there is in some of these sectors.

 

I was part of an analysis project during the mortgage crises. One small aspect was the breakdown of subsidized mortgages in several of the more populous states based on EEO & fair lending requirements. It was interesting how even subsidized loan programs awarded higher mortgage values to whites than non-whites with similar credit scores, income bracket, work history, etc. Unfortunately, instead of expanding this analysis to the general market, this piece was basically scrapped. The reason was the requirement "wasn't identifying anything new"...

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I've been as vocally upset about unwarranted police violence, particularly "low intensity" harassment, as anyone on the board, but the premise of this thread may not be fair.

 

Especially if the question is asked in the converse: why are murders where police are the victim disproportionately carried out by African Americans? Is that a function of racism?

 

Id say no. It's a function of economics.

 

Also, it's important to note that much of the stricter drug laws, both in terms of enforcement and length of incarceration, were advocated by minority community leadership. That's who supported, for example, harsher sentencing laws for crack versus cocaine.

 

Were their misguided positions motivated by racism?

 

I doubt it very much.

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Also, it's important to note that much of the stricter drug laws, both in terms of enforcement and length of incarceration, were advocated by minority community leadership. That's who supported, for example, harsher sentencing laws for crack versus cocaine.

 

Were their misguided positions motivated by racism?

 

I doubt it very much.

 

 

I doubt it too, but that doesn't make the actual laws not be racist.

 

If something disproportionately affects a certain race, that 'thing' is racist. That thing is prejudice on the basis of race in action, even if the thing was (mistaken or not) supported by that race, even if the thing doesn't have conscious agency, even if the thing has overlap in being discriminatory based on economics.

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I disagree with your way of defining "racism."

 

To me, racism implies a certain mens rea.

 

Most Chinese restaurants are owned by people of Chinese descent. That doesn't mean Chinese restaurants are an example of racism.

 

We can have misguided policies that result in bad outcomes, but that's much different than a claim that one group is being actively oppressed by another.

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"Especially if the question is asked in the converse: why are murders where police are the victim disproportionately carried out by African Americans? Is that a function of racism?"

 

 

That's a dense question. I'd say there's at least an element of residual consequences from the history of racism in our country that contributes, yeah. Of course that's not the whole story and no person or persons are entirely carte blanche victims or oppressors, so ownership of wrongdoing is important, but it'd pretty hard to deny that the racial inequality of our country since foundation hasn't had a huge role to play in being at least one underlying cause of higher levels of violence, criminality, and poverty (which leads to violence and criminality) in black communities.

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Do Chinese restaurants oppress others based off their race?

No, of course not. And that's the beauty of a free functioning market. If I'm a yankee (or Canadian even - eek) who is good at cooking BBQ, I can start my restaurant and compete even with people who are traditionally better at it than me.

 

But you responding that way seems to indicated that we agree: terming something as "racist" goes beyond identifying a disparity of outcome. It imputes a bad intent on the supporters of the system.

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"Especially if the question is asked in the converse: why are murders where police are the victim disproportionately carried out by African Americans? Is that a function of racism?"

 

That's a dense question. I'd say there's at least an element of residual consequences from the history of racism in our country that contributes, yeah. Of course that's not the whole story and no person or persons are entirely carte blanche victims or oppressors, so ownership of wrongdoing is important, but it'd pretty hard to deny that the racial inequality of our country since foundation hasn't had a huge role to play in being at least one underlying cause of higher levels of violence, criminality, and poverty (which leads to violence and criminality) in black communities.

I don't disagree with you. I think we agree that economic oppression is the issue, whether racially motivated or not.

 

I was speaking to a man at a wedding this weekend. He grew up as a young black man in alabama in the 50s. He talked about, in a positive way, how white people used to come to his neighborhood to buy booze (it was a dry county). "The only time white people and black people got together was for this type of thing." He related a funny story about taking his store manager to his neighborhood on this kind of run.

 

He was generally positive about everything (said other areas of Alabama were much worse).

 

But I couldn't help but think about how narcotics and inner city drug markets are playing the same role today.

 

Is it that black people are inherently criminal types? Heck no. It's that when you have a system that restricts people's ability to participate in mainstream economies, of course they will resort to black markets. You'd be irrational not to.

 

The sad thing is, it was Jim Crow 60 years ago that restricted participation. Now it's labor protectionist practices, including national minimum wage, and a screwed up welfare system that does this.

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It imputes a bad intent on the supporters of the system.

 

 

I disagree, and I think I've clarified that something being racist doesn't necessarily impute bad intent.

 

Something is racist if it adversely affects a people group based off of their race while benefitting others. A Chinese restaurant doesn't do that, but there are things that do do that that aren't nefarious white supremacists too. Most of the systemic racism in our country comes from sources somewhere in between those two, imo.

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