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Trump's America


zoogs

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The confederate statues were not erected in most cases until 50-100 years after the Civil War.  There was a spike in building them after Jim Crow laws were enacted as well as around 1960 during the Civil Rights battle.  Its easy to believe that many were built to send a message...
 

Spoiler

 

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13 hours ago, zoogs said:

This isn't history and these are not artifacts. They're present day, wholly elective representations of our values as a society. 

 

A people choose their own symbols of reverence and remembrance. History stands regardless. Frankly, history is warped by the mythology we choose to indulge in to justify keeping these things around. We have to convince ourselves that they are something they are not. If history is the patron saint of this discussion, it should be an easy call.

Everything is history. And we're talking about remembrance not reverence. We can remember that those statues represented something awful. History isn't about forgetting the things that were bad or horrific.

 

Great graphs, Red Five. One thing I'd support is putting some of these statues in a museum with these graphs next to them to remember that the Civil War did not magically end racism.

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13 hours ago, zoogs said:

This isn't history and these are not artifacts. They're present day, wholly elective representations of our values as a society. 

 

A people choose their own symbols of reverence and remembrance. History stands regardless. Frankly, history is warped by the mythology we choose to indulge in to justify keeping these things around. We have to convince ourselves that they are something they are not. If history is the patron saint of this discussion, it should be an easy call.

WOW!

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RedFive - great graphs.  Pretty enlightening.  NAACP was formed and a huge spike in statues followed.    Then we have fairly recent history ( I can say that due to my age ;)) of the 50s and 60s starting wt Brown v Board and the civil right laws beginning under Eisenhower and then LBJ.   If they are going to be torn down, I think they should go into a museum that tells the full story of our history.  The Good, The Bad, The Ugly.  Our history tells us why we are who we are today and gives us guidance on how we can improve.  Rwanda has some museums that are pretty graphic (bones and bones stacked on top of each other) that my son saw when he was there that drove him to tears.  It is to remind the people of the 1990s and not to ever go back to that kind of hatred.  A reconciliation process developed in that country that healed many of the wounds.  We need our wounds healed.  Identity politics doesn't help in that healing.

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19 hours ago, commando said:

do you really believe trump is capable of feeling shame?

Actually no he isn't capable -he is a narcissistic person.  So, I think it is psychologically impossible for him to do so.   He proved it by doubling down on his Saturday statement - by again blaming both sides.  Shame means he lost, he's a looser, he's fired, he's not great, on the top. 

He is actually running from shame to be honest with you. He's been doing it his whole life. The hyperbole that he speaks with, the rudeness, the over the top statements are all evidence that he is running from his shame.  He can never admit fault, take blame, or asked forgiveness - that would be shameful and prove that he is less than what he sees himself as.   

 

I wonder what it was like growing up under his dad and even worse what it was like growing up under Trump himself - I pity his 10 year old son and his wife.

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I never really got much into politics before last weekend as I found them a big waste of time and depending on what news station you watch they're gonna push their agenda on you. The events of this past weekend have piqued my interest in whats going on now. I knew there were issues in the USA but it just baffles me that there are people who view the rallies in Charlottesville as the right thing to do. I've basically lost all hope that Trump knows how to fix this issue and thats a scary thought. Forget N. Korea we've got plenty of issues in our damn country to figure out first. 

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30 minutes ago, wiuhusker said:

I never really got much into politics before last weekend as I found them a big waste of time and depending on what news station you watch they're gonna push their agenda on you. The events of this past weekend have piqued my interest in whats going on now. I knew there were issues in the USA but it just baffles me that there are people who view the rallies in Charlottesville as the right thing to do. I've basically lost all hope that Trump knows how to fix this issue and thats a scary thought. Forget N. Korea we've got plenty of issues in our damn country to figure out first. 

Welcome Wiu -   Hope you stick around this forum.  

 

With all this maddness I do think the one positive that comes of this time in history is that many of us are getting better educated, up to date and involved with politics.  

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