When will Trump get impeached?

[Landlord]

6 hours ago, GBR0988 said:

4. See my response to #3. Also while I don’t support torture, constitutional rights only apply to Americans.

 

 

This entire post of yours is bulls#!t, but this part takes the cake. Tons of American citizens and legal migrants/green card holders have been unconstitutionally affected and discriminated against because of Trump's muslim ban. I know this factually and anecdotally - I was at O'Hare airport with friends who are lawyers when this happened. Saw the faces of and heard the voices of dozens of American muslims who were illegally detained. 

 

Anyways, is there any chance you can stick to the topic of the thread, and the topic of the question you brought up, instead of sliding around to Obama/Trump's supposed accomplishments/Hilary Clinton/etc.?

[Guy Chamberlin]

14 hours ago, GBR0988 said:

Not a huge fan of Trump, the person, but I am a fan of government de-regulation and a rising gdp. This is not an original question, but what has Trump done that violates constitutional rule of law and the norms of American governance?

 

I appreciate your willingness to engage, and while your question is a bit loaded I'll grant you some honest answers.,

 

Actually, let's ignore constitutional rule of law and norms of American governance for a moment and concentrate on the economic beliefs that I'm presuming guide your vote to the Republican side. At this moment, the so-called "small-government, lower-taxes, de-regulation, pro-business" party line that kinda sounds good on paper has become so corrupted by the GOP, empowered with Trump at the helm, that it violates its own intentions and pretty much everything that made America great.

 

The ACA was written and approved by the for-profit insurance industry, following an old Republican blueprint as the alternative to socialized medicine. It helped millions, hurt few, and it's imperfections were far outweighed by the option of doing nothing: the pre-existing heathcare crisis was doing plenty of jobs-killing itself. The ACA works better with a bigger buy-in. It betrays our values no more than the shared risk and actuarial sciences of the auto insurance industry. The only reason for opposing it was to deny Barack Obama legislative success. Trump only added to this pathological behavior. My family is currently on Obamacare. Losing it will be a huge hit to us. That's why I sincerely want people who blindly oppose it to f#*k themselves.

 

The Federal Budget/Tax Reform. This has gone beyond the norms of pro-business and the American spirit itself. It is a cynical bald-faced giveaway to the wealthy. Trump's first federal budget tried to justify it's theoretical windfall to the general public by spending two trillion dollars of money upfront that it hadn't earned yet -- if it ever does.. It was the kind of accounting trick that would get you an "F" in Econ 101 and a massive fine from the SEC. The current Tax Reform bill is as horribly designed as you would expect from a 500 page document that the GOP doesn't want anyone to read. In addition to being loaded with incredibly selective goodies for very few, it adds a trillion dollars to the deficit — betraying the very spirit of the conservative deficit-hawks. Hard-working Trump voters will be hit the hardest, and find a way to blame the liberals. This is all built on the back of Supply Side Economics, a theory that has actually been given a real-world experiment for the past 30 years and proven itself unable to deliver the benefits as promised, while creating the dangerous concentration of wealth and decline of the middle class that critics had long warned against.

 

This isn't the cry of butthurt libtards: every self-respecting economist and mathematical formula warns that it's not gonna work. It's short term, reactionary, and poorly supported — the opposite values I'd assign to a true conservative. 

 

Now about those norms of American governance?

 

Let's just say that the President shouldn't be engaging in Twitter feuds with celebrities at 3 in the morning, nor should he be revealing major policy directives via 141 character missives, nor should his Tweets directly contradict his other public pronouncement, or hang his own staff and cabinet out to dry and force them to explain the childish mood swings of the most powerful man on Earth. 

 

The President probably shouldn't give away classified military secrets to foreign heads of state through casual bragging. Trump's done that more than once.

 

If the 17 U.S. intelligence agencies charged with protecting our country are unanimous in their assessment that Russia interfered with the U.S. election, but you believe Vladamir Putin's denial instead, you probably shouldn't be the President of the United States. 

 

If you were clutching your pearls about Hillary Clinton using a private email server, you should probably make sure your own staff isn't doing the same (they are!)

 

If you already have the failed Yemen raid and Niger fiasco on the books 7 months into your term, it's only fair to reflect on all the years spent screaming BENGHAZI!

 

If your claim to fame is American businessman and builder, and you propose building a 2,000 mile border wall with Mexico using a flimsy estimate, no accounting for the new layer of Big Government it adds, and undertaking no serious cost-to-benefit analysis, you're a con man. 

 

If you appoint cabinet members and lifetime judges with little experience and open contempt for the institution, you're just a spiteful prick. 

 

If you have 500 pending lawsuits from contractors that Trump Hotels & Resorts refused to pay knowing they could outlast the legal challenge, you're just a spiteful prick. (But a tip of the hat on convincing hard-working blue-collar America that the billionaire Manhattan prick is on their side — no idea how you pulled that off, other than the subliminal racist narrative) 

 

You do know that you can engage in some incredibly unethical behavior and do tons of damage without technically violating the constitution, right?

 

If you want to talk about how liberals conveniently ignore some of Barack Obama's under-publicized choices, that's a pretty interesting conversation itself. It generally points to the fact that Obama was far more moderate and pro-business than either side likes to admit.  

[TGHusker]

As a conservative leaning voter the only thing I would add to the above, is that I believe Trump is clearly unfit for the office.   It was debated before the election and has been proven true practically every day.  Regardless of his legislative agenda (pro or con), Trump stands on his own in regards to his fitness for office.  As a student of history and esp presidential history, I'm appalled that someone of this character is sitting in the WH (yes I'd be appalled wt Clinton #2 as well and that goes without saying that other presidents have done some appalling things while in office).  However Trump's tweets, his bashing people without cause, his grandstanding etc all point to an unstable, narcissistic personality that in of itself warrants a look at Amend 25, Article 4.  However, I don't think it will come to that as the cabinet  and VP have not shown the willingness to stand up to Trump much less recommend his removal on psyco issues.  A few notable ones  have left the admin.  I think impeachment will come down to Flynn and what he reveals -notwithstanding Ty Cobb's (Trump's lawyer and not the BB player) denials.

[Big Red 40]

Impeachment is a political process  , and as long as the Republicans have the majority it wont happen regardless of proof of wrongdoing.

Edited December 5, 2017 by Big Red 40

[BigRedBuster]

@GBR0988,  I'm one of the most conservative that is a regular on this part of the board.  I've never voted for a Democrat for President and was a life long Republican up till a few years ago.  I'll piggy back onto everything Guy and TG have said.  

 

This pathetic little man is completely unfit to hold the office of President of the United States and it is a complete embarrassment that he sits in the oval office.

The Republican party left me a few years ago and that's why I dropped my registration as a member.  However, just think for a minute how amazing (in a not good way) it is that this party and this President are endorsing a known child molester for Senate.  On top of that, the President did NOT want to condemn Nazis marching in the streets of the US along side the KKK.  He finally did...sort of.....after catching a lot of crap for not doing so.  Meanwhile, he has NO problem condemning a few football players doing a non-violent protest about what is happening in neighborhoods across the US.  

 

Just think about that for a minute.  Millions of people died along with over 300,000 Americans fighting the ideology behind the Nazi flag.  The President thinks there are "good people" under that flag.  Meanwhile, demonizes Americans in a nonviolent protest.

As a Republican....can you honestly tell me you are OK with that?  Which one is really more disrespectful to American military personnel that died fighting for our freedom?

 

This is what that party has become and there needs to be a reckoning with reality

Edited December 5, 2017 by BigRedBuster

[TGHusker]

33 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said:

@GBR0988,  I'm one of the most conservative that is a regular on this part of the board.  I've never voted for a Democrat for President and was a life long Republican up till a few years ago.  I'll piggy back onto everything Guy and TG have said.  

 

This pathetic little man is completely unfit to hold the office of President of the United States and it is a complete embarrassment that he sits in the oval office.

The Republican party left me a few years ago and that's why I dropped my registration as a member.  However, just think for a minute how amazing (in a not good way) it is that this party and this President are endorsing a known child molester for Senate.  On top of that, the President did NOT want to condemn Nazis marching in the streets of the US along side the KKK.  He finally did...sort of.....after catching a lot of crap for not doing so.  Meanwhile, he has NO problem condemning a few football players doing a non-violent protest about what is happening in neighborhoods across the US.  

 

Just think about that for a minute.  Millions of people died along with over 300,000 Americans fighting the ideology behind the Nazi flag.  The President thinks there are "good people" under that flag.  Meanwhile, demonizes Americans in a nonviolent protest.

As a Republican....can you honestly tell me you are OK with that?  Which one is really more disrespectful to American military personnel that died fighting for our freedom?

 

This is what that party has become and there needs to be a reckoning with reality

BRB - proof positive that the Repub party has lost it's soul.  Tolerating this president is symptomatic of the diagnosis. 

[RedDenver]

1 hour ago, BigRedBuster said:

@GBR0988,  I'm one of the most conservative that is a regular on this part of the board.  I've never voted for a Democrat for President and was a life long Republican up till a few years ago.  I'll piggy back onto everything Guy and TG have said.  

 

This pathetic little man is completely unfit to hold the office of President of the United States and it is a complete embarrassment that he sits in the oval office.

The Republican party left me a few years ago and that's why I dropped my registration as a member.  However, just think for a minute how amazing (in a not good way) it is that this party and this President are endorsing a known child molester for Senate.  On top of that, the President did NOT want to condemn Nazis marching in the streets of the US along side the KKK.  He finally did...sort of.....after catching a lot of crap for not doing so.  Meanwhile, he has NO problem condemning a few football players doing a non-violent protest about what is happening in neighborhoods across the US.  

 

Just think about that for a minute.  Millions of people died along with over 300,000 Americans fighting the ideology behind the Nazi flag.  The President thinks there are "good people" under that flag.  Meanwhile, demonizes Americans in a nonviolent protest.

As a Republican....can you honestly tell me you are OK with that?  Which one is really more disrespectful to American military personnel that died fighting for our freedom?

 

This is what that party has become and there needs to be a reckoning with reality

Makes me so happy to know there are conservatives out there that can see the Republican party for what it's become and put America and our fellow citizens first. I hope more will join you.

[deedsker]

Looks like Trump may just break the GOP in two. I have seen talk that there is more and more of a divide between old conservatives and Trumpkins. Talk of the town is that as the process of impeachment, which is all but inevitable, there will be those that go with Trump and will see this as a take down and those that will try to go back to what the old conservative rank and file of the 80's. The end of the GOP, is it coming?

 

https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/12/05/donald-trump-inside-campaign-corey-lewandowski-david-bossie-interview-podcast-216010

 

“I’m going to win. And second, if the Republican Party is going to run away from me, then I will take you all down with me. But I’m not going to lose.”

 

Loyalty, they say, is all the president ever wants, whether from Democrats who won’t sign on to his agenda or from former White House press secretary Sean Spicer, who told reporters in the closing days of the election that Trump would lose and was already starting to look for TV work on that contingency.

 

Note: I believe the TV part they are talking about is the propaganda channel Trump has since ended up with called "Real News" on Facebook.

[Danny Bateman]

Well, this pretty much confirm what any logical person has known for a while. Good to have confirmation, though.

 

 

[Fru]

The GOP is backing a child molester for Senate. Does anyone really think they'd lead impeachment proceedings?

[commando]

2 minutes ago, Fru said:

The GOP is backing a child molester for Senate. Does anyone really think they'd lead impeachment proceedings?

no...but maybe after the midterms the dems can get control and possibly get some traction on it.

[Guy Chamberlin]

Hey, I didn't mean to drive GBR away.

 

I just wanted him to question his entire belief system.

[Moiraine]

I think if the Democrats win the House, Trump will probably get impeached about a month after Mueller gives them everything he has. All that's required for impeachment is a simple majority in the House. I'm sure they'll want to do it before then but they need to be patient, imo.

But it won't mean much if they can't convince some Republican senators to convict him.