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dudeguyy    3,488

Gotta admit, I had imagined Trump's first war a lot differently...
 

 

This is horrible timing, too. The launch of the annual War on Christmas is right around the corner.

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TGHusker    1,335

Tillerson leaves certain countries off of child soldier list so that we can supply those countries wt arms.

An ethics issue at the least IMHO or law breaking according to this article.   It seems another example of

'skirting the rules' for the benefit of policy. 

 

https://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/tillerson-state-department-accuse-child-soldiers/2017/11/21/id/827358/

 

A group of about a dozen U.S. State Department officials have taken the unusual step of formally accusing Secretary of State Rex Tillerson of violating a federal law designed to stop foreign militaries from enlisting child soldiers, according to internal government documents reviewed by Reuters.

A confidential State Department “dissent” memo not previously reported said Tillerson breached the Child Soldiers Prevention Act when he decided in June to exclude Iraq, Myanmar, and Afghanistan from a U.S. list of offenders in the use of child soldiers. This was despite the department publicly acknowledging that children were being conscripted in those countries.

Keeping the countries off the annual list makes it easier to provide them with U.S. military assistance. Iraq and Afghanistan are close allies in the fight against Islamist militants, while Myanmar is an emerging ally to offset China’s influence in Southeast Asia.

Documents reviewed by Reuters also show Tillerson’s decision was at odds with a unanimous recommendation by the heads of the State Department’s regional bureaus overseeing embassies in the Middle East and Asia, the U.S. envoy on Afghanistan and Pakistan, the department’s human rights office and its own in-house lawyers.

 

“Beyond contravening U.S. law, this decision risks marring the credibility of a broad range of State Department reports and analyses and has weakened one of the U.S. government's primary diplomatic tools to deter governmental armed forces and government-supported armed groups from recruiting and using children in combat and support roles around the world,” said the July 28 memo.

Reuters reported in June that Tillerson had disregarded internal recommendations on Iraq, Myanmar and Afghanistan. The new documents reveal the scale of the opposition in the State Department, including the rare use of what is known as the “dissent channel,” which allows officials to object to policies without fear of reprisals.

The views expressed by the U.S. officials illustrate ongoing tensions between career diplomats and the former chief of Exxon Mobil Corp appointed by President Donald Trump to pursue an “America First” approach to diplomacy.

 
 
Edited by TGHusker

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Nebfanatic    1,077
11 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said:

ISIS just killed 300+ in a mosque in Egypt. 

 

I thought Trump single handedly defeated them????

I thought they just hated America and Christianity and white people??? This doesn't fit my narrative.

 

A really sad story out of Egypt, that type of coordinated attack is so scary to think about. Terrorism is not an Islamic thing, it's a terrorist thing and they do not discriminate. Anyone who doesn't subscribe to ISIS and their radical beliefs is an enemy. They attack and kill more people in their region supposedly having similar beliefs than any other group of people. Think about that before you link Islam with terrorism in the future. 

 

Edit: second paragraph was not directed at you BRB! Just a general statement on the matter. 

Edited by Nebfanatic

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VectorVictor    1,986
On 11/18/2017 at 7:39 PM, dudeguyy said:

Gotta admit, I had imagined Trump's first war a lot differently...
 

 

This is horrible timing, too. The launch of the annual War on Christmas is right around the corner.

 

Jesus, there's war in Afghanistan, war on Christmas, war on Men...remember when we simply engaged in "Police Actions"?

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dudeguyy    3,488

I know I post on here quite a bit - probably a bit too much - and there's a tendency to get hyperbolic about news stories as if they're all equally groundbreaking.

 

I feel I can safely say, without hyperbole, that this is the most f$#*ing insane story I've read in a long while. This is completely nutso.

 

 

Just look at the first paragraph:

 

Quote

The Trump administration is considering a set of proposals developed by Blackwater founder Erik Prince and a retired CIA officer — with assistance from Oliver North, a key figure in the Iran-Contra scandal — to provide CIA Director Mike Pompeo and the White House with a global, private spy network that would circumvent official U.S. intelligence agencies, according to several current and former U.S. intelligence officials and others familiar with the proposals. The sources say the plans have been pitched to the White House as a means of countering “deep state” enemies in the intelligence community seeking to undermine Trump’s presidency.

 

The CIA director is actively encouraging a program to form an extra-legal network of spies to circumvent... his own agency, whom he apparently doesn't trust.

They're enlisting Ollie North (yes, THAT Ollie North) to "lend credibility" to the project.

 

Covert ops, privatized - meaning they report only to Pompeo and Trump & share nothing with the rest of the CIA or any other intel agency.

 

And Prince's partner, John MaGuire? Apparently ex-CIA, but here's this gem he's pitched to Trump donor's looking for funding (pre-CIA involvement):

 

Quote

“[Maguire] said there were people inside the CIA who joined in the previous eight years [under Obama] and inside the government and they were failing to give the president the intelligence he needed,” said a person who was pitched by Maguire and other Amyntor personnel. To support his claim, Maguire told at least two people that National Security Advisor H.R. McMaster, in coordination with a top official at the National Security Agency, authorized surveillance of Steven Bannon and Trump family members, including Donald Trump Jr. and Eric Trump. Adding to these unsubstantiated claims, Maguire told the potential donors he also had evidence H.R. McMaster used a burner phone to send information gathered through the surveillance to a facility in Cyprus owned by George Soros.

 

Seems like a stable guy.

 

There's just so dang much to unpack. What the heck is even going on with this story? I feel like I'm reading the Onion. But the Intercept is legit.

I know I throw out this comparison a lot, but designing a parallel, off-the-books spy network to subvert the CIA & try to snuff out "deep state enemies" is some Nixon-level paranoia.

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BigRedBuster    8,064

@GBR0988...this is the type of thing that is totally unacceptable.  We have our longest and strongest ally (England) telling Trump he is not welcome.  The SOS is having to go around to our allies calming them down about worries about this guy.

 

 

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TGHusker    1,335
On 12/5/2017 at 5:50 AM, commando said:

trumps version of the brownshirts?  

yes - what could go wrong with that :dunno:sarcasm.  I wonder if they have a special name for it like ....   Subversive Service

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TGHusker    1,335

In another CF move,  Trump has riled up another whole area of the world by one simple proclamation -- Trump says he will move the embassy to Jerusalem. 

This has friends and foes up in arms from Turkey to Saudi Arabia.  So much for his early 2017 feel good Middle East tour.  He just destroyed it with this ill advised

move.  Yes the Israel loves it and I would support it myself in principle AT THE RIGHT TIME but this isn't the right time.   The idiot should work on the

peace process first and then use the embassy move as a bone thrown to Israel to counter a  concession given to the Palestine leaders.    So much for being the

great negotiator - you've played away one of the biggest chips before you needed to.    (Such a bad move I wonder if Putin is pulling the strings in order to increase Russian influence in the area. :o)

 

https://www.newsmax.com/politics/ml-trump-jerusalem/2017/12/06/id/830149/

Quote

 

While Israel welcomed the news, Palestinian officials declared the Mideast peace process "finished" and Turkey announced it would host a meeting of Islamic nations next week to give Muslim countries' leaders an opportunity to coordinate a response.

The harsh global reaction cast questions about the feasibility of a brewing U.S. peace plan that is expected to be presented by the White House in the near future.

The Palestinians seek east Jerusalem as the capital of a future independent state and fear that Trump's declaration essentially imposes on them a disastrous solution for one of the core issues in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.

"There is no way that there can be talks with the Americans. The peace process is finished. They have already pre-empted the outcome," said Palestinian official Hanan Ashrawi. "They cannot take us for granted."

The U.S. decision "destroys the peace process," added Palestinian Prime Minister Rami Hamdallah. Top Palestinian officials were meeting Wednesday to plot their course forward.

 

 

Edited by TGHusker

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TGHusker    1,335
On 12/5/2017 at 0:30 AM, dudeguyy said:

I know I post on here quite a bit - probably a bit too much - and there's a tendency to get hyperbolic about news stories as if they're all equally groundbreaking.

 

I feel I can safely say, without hyperbole, that this is the most f$#*ing insane story I've read in a long while. This is completely nutso.

 

 

Just look at the first paragraph:

 

 

The CIA director is actively encouraging a program to form an extra-legal network of spies to circumvent... his own agency, whom he apparently doesn't trust.

They're enlisting Ollie North (yes, THAT Ollie North) to "lend credibility" to the project.

 

Covert ops, privatized - meaning they report only to Pompeo and Trump & share nothing with the rest of the CIA or any other intel agency.

 

And Prince's partner, John MaGuire? Apparently ex-CIA, but here's this gem he's pitched to Trump donor's looking for funding (pre-CIA involvement):

 

 

Seems like a stable guy.

 

There's just so dang much to unpack. What the heck is even going on with this story? I feel like I'm reading the Onion. But the Intercept is legit.

I know I throw out this comparison a lot, but designing a parallel, off-the-books spy network to subvert the CIA & try to snuff out "deep state enemies" is some Nixon-level paranoia.

Dude - this action alone should be impeachment material. This is very dangerous, sets a very bad precedence and is set up for no good reason other than to protect a president with Nixon like (or worse) paranoia as your post noted.   You know I'd rather our country become 100% Democrat in the Senate, House and WH and maintain constitutional rule of law vs going down this path of protecting  a psyco republican president.  I'd rather take the excesses of liberalism (and I say that as a moderate conservative) than go down the path of the alt-right, fascism,  and neo-nazi like behavior of this president.  Strong words for someone who has voted Repub in presidential elections since 1976. (I've voted for dems in state, local, and federal elections however - and will probably do so again in the next election)

Edited by TGHusker

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commando    1,626
46 minutes ago, TGHusker said:

yes - what could go wrong with that :dunno:sarcasm.  I wonder if they have a special name for it like ....   Subversive Service

that comparison is much better than mine.   the brownshirts were the guys beating up protesters at hitler/trump rallys.   the subversive service would take on the ss role better than the brownshirts did/would

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dudeguyy    3,488
2 hours ago, TGHusker said:

Dude - this action alone should be impeachment material. This is very dangerous, sets a very bad precedence and is set up for no good reason other than to protect a president with Nixon like (or worse) paranoia as your post noted.   You know I'd rather our country become 100% Democrat in the Senate, House and WH and maintain constitutional rule of law vs going down this path of protecting  a psyco republican president.  I'd rather take the excesses of liberalism (and I say that as a moderate conservative) than go down the path of the alt-right, fascism,  and neo-nazi like behavior of this president.  Strong words for someone who has voted Repub in presidential elections since 1976. (I've voted for dems in state, local, and federal elections however - and will probably do so again in the next election)

 

Bravo, man. Well said. I just want to get back to both parties being healthy instead of this insane march to doom the current GOP seems to be doing behind Trump. We need independent, responsible minds in Congress, not craven yes men (and women) out solely to maintain power and their Congressional paycheck.

 

I'd take Pence in a heartbeat. Then instead of worrying about the sheer moral soul of America disintegrating by the day I could just complain about how awful his policies are. :P

 

Also, on the story I posted, I should point out for those who don't know that Erik Prince's company, Blackwater, had a long and murky history of playing very fast and loose with accountability and human life in their private security ventures around the world.

Also he is the brother of current Secretary of Ed Betsy Devos. They were both born into massive wealth, being children of the dude who founded Amway.

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TGHusker    1,335

Makes you wonder how you go from Amway baby to Blackwater secret agent?  Too many game sets as a kid and he took it global.  :dunno

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dudeguyy    3,488

No kidding. The guy likes playing commando, that's for sure. The lack of oversight with his "teams" and with the entire concept in general is really pretty disturbing.

 

That other story you posted on Israel is kind of a huge deal. I'm not sure the U.S. attempting to fork Jerusalem over to Israel is the best route to peace in the Middle East. I really think Trump is going to regret this decision. Just needlessly stirring the pot.

On the other hand, how could you NOT trust THIS GUY?!

 

people-are-ragging-on-jared-kushner-for-

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dudeguyy    3,488

Looks like the adults in the room didn't want to go down this road. I'm guessing Trump sided with Kushner, Sheldon Adelson and the corrupt Bibi Netanyahu.
 

 

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TGHusker    1,335
20 minutes ago, dudeguyy said:

Looks like the adults in the room didn't want to go down this road. I'm guessing Trump sided with Kushner, Sheldon Adelson and the corrupt Bibi Netanyahu.
 

 

The adults better take charge of this mess very soon, including Pence and Kelly besides Mattis and Tillerson.  Speaker Ryan tweeted in favor of the announcement - so no help there. Trump acting as the lone wolf of  foreign policy is destroying all credibility.  So when does he unilaterally announce the war against NK?  He has ticked off England, the whole MidEast, insulted and then caved into China, has a twitter war wt Fat Boy, ticks off our partners in Canada and Mexico over trade (haven't heard much on that lately - we ran a Yuge traded deficit this last month. )

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zoogs    6,367

If only we could have seen this obvious trainwreck coming and not elected someone so staggeringly incompetent when there was a clearly highly capable alternative.

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BigRedBuster    8,064

Funny thing.

 

I wanted to read more on the letter from the Diplomat.  So, I googled "US Diplomat Letter".  I had a number of well known media outlets come up.  But....I noticed one was missing.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Foxnews.  I can't find it anywhere on their front page.

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