Bernie vs Cruz

[RedDenver]

Anybody else looking forward to the debate/townhall tonight?

[Danny Bateman]

I'll be tuning in.

I don't know that they could've picked two people more diametrically opposed in politics today. Should be interesting.

 

I guess it's going to focus on the ACA? That gives Bernie an advantage in my mind. Imagine being a Republican stuck in a spotlight for 90 minutes being asked about their replacement plans.

[The Big Nebrowski]

Bernie will kick his ass, but to no avail: facts don't matter anymore in America.

[RedDenver]

I didn't realize it was focused on the ACA. Hopefully it'll be more expansive and cover some other policies. I was hoping the sharp contrast between them would lead to good debate, but we'll see.

[Danny Bateman]

Any thoughts so far Red?

[RedDenver]

Any thoughts so far Red?

It started strong, waned right after the first break, but got stronger before the second break. Overall, I think Cruz is doing better than I thought he'd do. He hurt Bernie on the woman who's business can't afford healthcare for her employees. Bernie has missed opportunities to parse Cruz's words until he hit him with the "access" comments.

[RedDenver]

Cruz has made some good points. He also does a good job of dodging a question. CNN has followed up a couple times to try and get an answer.

 

Bernie is not a good debater, or at least not as smooth at it as Cruz. Some of his points have been muddled and unclear.

 

Ultimately, the only working solutions to healthcare found so far are either by the government (many nations) or a non-profit system of heavily regulated insurance companies (only Switzerland?). So Bernie should have the edge in this debate, but I thought it was fairly even, maybe slightly in Bernie's favor. Credit to Cruz's speaking skills.

[The Big Nebrowski]

I press mute whenever Cruz opens his mouth, can't stand that guy. He typically tows the right wing party line: privatize and profit--everything.

 

The med system in the US is completely out of control as to cost. Blame big pharma and the insurance co.s mostly.

 

Bernie has the typical democratic socialist approach and the single payer plan would work quite well. But, as he said, it's a matter of social ethos: should health care be a right, like public education. Who doesn't want single payer? Insurance co.s and Big Pharma, of course.

 

Over time, Bernie's msg may sink in to main steam America, alotta people hurting out there.

[AR Husker Fan]

Fact-checking clearly shows - no surprise - that Cruz is a habitual liar, while Sanders is almost entirely truthful.

 

 

[The Big Nebrowski]

Fact-checking clearly shows - no surprise - that Cruz is a habitual liar, while Sanders is almost entirely truthful.

 

 

https://twitter.com/cnnpolitics/status/829322014183813121

Yep. Well, when I didn't have him on mute, perhaps the main goal for Cruz last night was to attack the FDA, which he did repeatedly. Cui bono from less FDA? Big Pharma, of course. Surely they have Lil Teddy in their hip pocket, bought and paid for, and that's why he's out there shilling for them.

[The Big Nebrowski]

P.S., Obamacare would work much better, but like everything, it's a numbers game. It needs large numbers of people using it, increase volume and therefore bring down the cost. If, say, 200 million people would signed in, it would bring the cost down so as to be what it is designed to be: affordable. As it is now, the middle class is footing the bill for all the poorer people to be on it, or Medicaid, for little to no cost.

 

It's still nvr going to be as good as what single payer could be because the insurance co.s, in Obamacare, still write most the rules and they are in it for their bottom line.

[VectorVictor]

Fact-checking clearly shows - no surprise - that Cruz is a habitual liar, while Sanders is almost entirely truthful.

 

 

 

That's because facts are part of the Liberal Agenda?

 

---

 

The debate was good and needed, and Sanders (and by extension, the ACA) had an overwhelmingly good night. Only problem was the small business question that someone already brought up in the thread...but Cruz really didn't seize on that opportunity all that well. Thought there was a great opening for him to discuss...as well as a place for Sanders to discuss social morality in regards to business ownership.

 

...but it's funny/sad that Cruz, a supposedly devout "Christian", is debating that Health Care isn't a universal right when the Bible itself instructs its followers to care for the sick as if they are your own.

 

At least the debate was rather civil, to an extent. Forgot what seeing a real debate was like after seeing Der Orangenfuhrer crap the bed time and again the past 1.5 years.

[The Big Nebrowski]

 

 

Fact-checking clearly shows - no surprise - that Cruz is a habitual liar, while Sanders is almost entirely truthful.

 

 

https://twitter.com/cnnpolitics/status/829322014183813121

That's because facts are part of the Liberal Agenda?

 

---

 

The debate was good and needed, and Sanders (and by extension, the ACA) had an overwhelmingly good night. Only problem was the small business question that someone already brought up in the thread...but Cruz really didn't seize on that opportunity all that well. Thought there was a great opening for him to discuss...as well as a place for Sanders to discuss social morality in regards to business ownership.

 

...but it's funny/sad that Cruz, a supposedly devout "Christian", is debating that Health Care isn't a universal right when the Bible itself instructs its followers to care for the sick as if they are your own.

 

At least the debate was rather civil, to an extent. Forgot what seeing a real debate was like after seeing Der Orangenfuhrer crap the bed time and again the past 1.5 years.

Who needs facts when you can have Fake News, right?

 

And, "Der Orangenfuhrer", beautiful, I love it!

[RedDenver]

Looking at the fact-checking today, Cruz got clobbered. Unfortunately, not everyone who saw the debate will check the facts afterward. CNN could probably put together a good show the day after the debate just on fact-checking and follow-ups.

EDIT: here's a good summary of the facts: http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2017/feb/07/fact-checking-ted-cruz-bernie-sanders-health-care-/

[Moiraine]

CNN is liberal so their facts slant the wrong way or something.