Recruiting Tangent Thread

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Welp another thread gone to s#!t.

[StPaulHusker]

3 minutes ago, Thanks_Tom RR said:

Nope, but I am sure you don’t mean to say that experience and stats are meaningless unless they occur in the B1G. The new defense is built on takeaways, so they get a guy with 4 INT at the JUCO level last season. I don’t see how this is a hill you want to die on.

 

S#!tting on the old staff is warranted and relevant because (1) they were terrible and (2) it was last season. I doubt that is a hill you want to die on, either. Still, the point about Jackson’s stats is the need to have players that can create turnovers.

Comparing what a JUCO player did against JUCO players to what P5 players did against other P5 players and inferring that the JUCO is better is nonsense.  That is what I am saying.  

[StPaulHusker]

Should start day 1, in my opinion.

[Thanks_Tom RR]

19 minutes ago, StPaulHusker said:

Comparing what a JUCO player did against JUCO players to what P5 players did against other P5 players and inferring that the JUCO is better is nonsense.  That is what I am saying.  

Well, then don't infer that from what I said. My point is Nebraska got a guy who had a fair number of INTs last season. The "square peg, round hole" issue is that takeaways are necessary in the new defense, and last season, our CBs had zero INTs. It would be a (welcomed) surprise that Jackson gets 4 INTs next year, but the fact is he has the capacity to create turnovers.

[Moiraine]

I'm starting to wonder if Frost wronged StPaulHusker in some way. I don't spend a ton of time on the recruiting forum but this seems to happen in every single topic. There seems to be something wrong with every offer and every commit.

[The Murphinator]

23 minutes ago, Moiraine said:

I'm starting to wonder if Frost wronged StPaulHusker in some way. I don't spend a ton of time on the recruiting forum but this seems to happen in every single topic. There seems to be something wrong with every offer and every commit.

 

Frost must have taken his lunch money

[Huskers93-97]

24 minutes ago, Moiraine said:

I'm starting to wonder if Frost wronged StPaulHusker in some way. I don't spend a ton of time on the recruiting forum but this seems to happen in every single topic. There seems to be something wrong with every offer and every commit.

St. Paul husker= Damon benning 

[Huskers93-97]

Seriously though, I by no means intend to defend St. Paul cause I believe frost 100% knows what he is doing and can spot talent. But so far this class commits have been slightly underwhelming. 

 

I only say that because we saw how he closed the last class on like 45 days and he pulled down Martinez and Washington- a .92 and .95 player in that short time and we havmt seen any serious interest or a commit yet for that caliber of player. I thought we would blow up this years class. 

 

Guessing 20 class may be that way after on field results? 

[Mavric]

39 minutes ago, Huskers93-97 said:

Seriously though, I by no means intend to defend St. Paul cause I believe frost 100% knows what he is doing and can spot talent. But so far this class commits have been slightly underwhelming. 

 

I only say that because we saw how he closed the last class on like 45 days and he pulled down Martinez and Washington- a .92 and .95 player in that short time and we havmt seen any serious interest or a commit yet for that caliber of player. I thought we would blow up this years class. 

 

Guessing 20 class may be that way after on field results? 

 

Not going to disagree with you there.  We are all hoping this staff can spot some talent.  But that doesn't mean we can't also hope for some guys who have more of a consensus from recruiting services that they are a little farther up the list.

 

Here's my read on the situation for now.  We don't really know if much of this is true ... we'll have a better idea in February but probably won't really know for another year or two.  But this is how I see the situation at the current juncture:

• This staff has worked together and has a pretty good plan in place for how to find talent and recruit it once they find it.
• Despite the "Frost doesn't like to recruit" narrative that was circulating a bit when he was hired, I think it's pretty obvious the opposite is true.  There have been many recruits that have comments about how involved Frost is once a target is identified, and the inference is that's not how it is with a lot of other schools.  Once they lock in on a guy, they really get after them.
• They did an incredible job in a short amount of time with the 2018 class.  They were able to find guys they like and, in particular, guys who were ripe for the picking because of their situation.  Most of our highest-rated guys were snagged out of a JUCO where they weren't being recruited up to their rating (Woodyard, Bell, Honas, Williams), their previous commitment had issues (Martinez and Tannor) or they had other issues that scared other schools away (Washington).  That's being very resourceful with what they had to work with.
• I think they are casing a pretty wide net with the 2019 class.  They were a long ways behind most everyone else with this class so they have some ground to make up.  Because of that - and because they are recruiting to a school that went 4-8 last year - I think they realize that they aren't going to get as much traction with the big fish right off the bat.  They're still working on them but it's going to take some on-field success to really get in the door with a lot of them.  Because of that, they're working overtime to get a lot of guys who might otherwise be a Plan B in our corner now.  Knowing we'll have another big class in terms of number of commitments, we are fine to get a good start on this class with some guys who they think are under-valued while they work their way up the list with the four-stars.  
• I don't see this a panic at all.  I see it as pragmatic.  Everyone wants the best guys they can get.  But I think they are securing the base of this class with guys who they think are great fits and have potential to be solid contributors.  They don't want to get caught waiting on the big fish only to have the season not go very well and have nothing else built up behind it.  That's what happened to the previous staff all too often.  By doing it this way, they'll have guys they like recruited if they need more of the Plan B guys later.  But they'll be saving plenty of spots for the Plan A guys for when the season gets here and they can (hopefully) show what's happening on the field and get them here to visit for a game.
• Another reason why I think the recruiting style we're seeing right now will diminish in future years is that they've already been hard at work on the 2020 class but we aren't seeing anywhere near the number of "Plan B" offers for that class.  They are really after the big fish there.  I would posit that's because they are betting on themselves to be able to build more relationships with those guys because they have a lot more time to work with.  They also have a lot more time to get those guys to campus and (again, hopefully) show them the progress being made on the field as a selling point.
• These guys have a lot to sell.  They are still the hot commodity right now.  Everyone knows that they went undefeated and beat Auburn last year.  They also have their own history in playing and coaching to sell.  This stuff means a lot to a lot of recruits.
  • Frost won a national championship as a player, coached in a national championship game at Oregon and played several years in the NFL
  • Walters played in the NFL
  • Chinander has coached in the NFL
  • Austin coached in a national championship game at Oregon and also coached in the NFL
  • Dawson coached in the NFL
  • Fisher played in the NFL
  • Held has a lot of pull in the JUCO world
  • Ruud played in the NFL

Again, none of that means anything until the results show up.  But they haven't really had much time to produce any results yet.  So until proven otherwise, I see a lot of reasons for optimism and not many reasons for doubt. 

 

Time will tell.

[Huskers93-97]

4 minutes ago, Mavric said:

 

Not going to disagree with you there.  We are all hoping this staff can spot some talent.  But that doesn't mean we can't also hope for some guys who have more of a consensus from recruiting services that they are a little farther up the list.

 

Here's my read on the situation for now.  We don't really know if much of this is true ... we'll have a better idea in February but probably won't really know for another year or two.  But this is how I see the situation at the current juncture:

• This staff has worked together and has a pretty good plan in place for how to find talent and recruit it once they find it.
• Despite the "Frost doesn't like to recruit" narrative that was circulating a bit when he was hired, I think it's pretty obvious the opposite is true.  There have been many recruits that have comments about how involved Frost is once a target is identified, and the inference is that's not how it is with a lot of other schools.  Once they lock in on a guy, they really get after them.
• They did an incredible job in a short amount of time with the 2018 class.  They were able to find guys they like and, in particular, guys who were ripe for the picking because of their situation.  Most of our highest-rated guys were snagged out of a JUCO where they weren't being recruited up to their rating (Woodyard, Bell, Honas, Williams), their previous commitment had issues (Martinez and Tannor) or they had other issues that scared other schools away (Washington).  That's being very resourceful with what they had to work with.
• I think they are casing a pretty wide net with the 2019 class.  They were a long ways behind most everyone else with this class so they have some ground to make up.  Because of that - and because they are recruiting to a school that went 4-8 last year - I think they realize that they aren't going to get as much traction with the big fish right off the bat.  They're still working on them but it's going to take some on-field success to really get in the door with a lot of them.  Because of that, they're working overtime to get a lot of guys who might otherwise be a Plan B in our corner now.  Knowing we'll have another big class in terms of number of commitments, we are fine to get a good start on this class with some guys who they think are under-valued while they work their way up the list with the four-stars.  
• I don't see this a panic at all.  I see it as pragmatic.  Everyone wants the best guys they can get.  But I think they are securing the base of this class with guys who they think are great fits and have potential to be solid contributors.  They don't want to get caught waiting on the big fish only to have the season not go very well and have nothing else built up behind it.  That's what happened to the previous staff all too often.  By doing it this way, they'll have guys they like recruited if they need more of the Plan B guys later.  But they'll be saving plenty of spots for the Plan A guys for when the season gets here and they can (hopefully) show what's happening on the field and get them here to visit for a game.
• Another reason why I think the recruiting style we're seeing right now will diminish in future years is that they've already been hard at work on the 2020 class but we aren't seeing anywhere near the number of "Plan B" offers for that class.  They are really after the big fish there.  I would posit that's because they are betting on themselves to be able to build more relationships with those guys because they have a lot more time to work with.  They also have a lot more time to get those guys to campus and (again, hopefully) show them the progress being made on the field as a selling point.
• These guys have a lot to sell.  They are still the hot commodity right now.  Everyone knows that they went undefeated and beat Auburn last year.  They also have their own history in playing and coaching to sell.  This stuff means a lot to a lot of recruits.
  • Frost won a national championship as a player, coached in a national championship game at Oregon and played several years in the NFL
  • Walters played in the NFL
  • Chinander has coached in the NFL
  • Austin coached in a national championship game at Oregon and also coached in the NFL
  • Dawson coached in the NFL
  • Fisher played in the NFL
  • Held has a lot of pull in the JUCO world
  • Ruud played in the NFL

Again, none of that means anything until the results show up.  But they haven't really had much time to produce any results yet.  So until proven otherwise, I see a lot of reasons for optimism and not many reasons for doubt. 

 

Time will tell.

I agree

[Scarlet Overkill]

7 hours ago, StPaulHusker said:

It is pointless.  What he did versus JUCO players has nothing to do with what our DB's did or didn't do.  It's just your way of s#!tting on the last coaching staff.  And that gets old.

 

But from now on I will do backflips for every unrated player that Frost and Co gets to commit.  Apparently that is the only acceptable opinion allowed on this board.

 

 

[StPaulHusker]

14 hours ago, Moiraine said:

I'm starting to wonder if Frost wronged StPaulHusker in some way. I don't spend a ton of time on the recruiting forum but this seems to happen in every single topic. There seems to be something wrong with every offer and every commit.

I have no problem with Scott Frost.  He's proven to be a very good coach.

 

A lot of the players he is currently recruiting and are committing to Nebraska aren't to the standard of CFP teams.  And that concerns me.  

 

If he can develop everyone of these players that are unrated and unknown into a CFP team, I'll eat my crow.  But Saban and Meyer have drawn the blueprint.  And that is where Nebraska should be looking, in my opinion.  

 

We need guys that can step in and play and compete right now.  Especially if there are up to 6 more players leaving the team as is being rumored.

[Moiraine]

22 minutes ago, StPaulHusker said:

I have no problem with Scott Frost.  He's proven to be a very good coach.

 

A lot of the players he is currently recruiting and are committing to Nebraska aren't to the standard of CFP teams.  And that concerns me.  

 

If he can develop everyone of these players that are unrated and unknown into a CFP team, I'll eat my crow.  But Saban and Meyer have drawn the blueprint.  And that is where Nebraska should be looking, in my opinion.  

 

We need guys that can step in and play and compete right now.  Especially if there are up to 6 more players leaving the team as is being rumored.

 

 

 

That blueprint might work for us if Nebraska was in a recruiting hotbed. It's not. If we are consistently in the top 20 in recruiting and Frost can do more with less, we are in a good position. We are likely never going to recruit at the same level as Ohio State or Alabama or even Michigan or Penn State. People like to downplay geography and population, but they are being very unrealistic when they do so. It's an extremely important variable.

[StPaulHusker]

1 minute ago, Moiraine said:

 

 

 

That blueprint might work for us if Nebraska was in a recruiting hotbed. It's not. If we are consistently in the top 20 in recruiting and Frost can do more with less, we are in a good position. We are likely never going to recruit at the same level as Ohio State or Alabama or even Michigan or Penn State. People like to downplay geography and population, but they are being very unrealistic when they do so.

I think geography plays a big role.  But that doesn't mean Nebraska should be recruiting unrated players this early in the recruiting cycle and Husker fans be excited about it.

[Moiraine]

4 minutes ago, StPaulHusker said:

I think geography plays a big role.  But that doesn't mean Nebraska should be recruiting unrated players this early in the recruiting cycle and Husker fans be excited about it.

 

 

What if Nebraska is just the first team to discover them? You've argued against it before, but Nebraska will behind for one more recruiting cycle when it comes to building relationships with players. That should be obvious when you see how many teams offer 2-3 years in advance.

 

And on jucos it really doesn't matter, especially if they only have 2 years left and we're horribly thin at the position. There are almost no repercussions to getting another body in there.

 

I think you're overreacting instead of assuming this is a method by the new coaching staff to patch up its team in its first season. If this were year 3 you might have good points in the multiple recruiting threads you've complained in.