Jump to content


Osborne at Big Red Breakfast


Mavric

Recommended Posts


"...including Frank Solich."

 

Dr. Tom will never stop believing that giving the reins to Frank Solich was the right thing to do.

 

I don't know what Tom saw in Frank. But Frank was not capable of running that team the way it needed to be run. And as Tom's players matriculated out of the program, that became more and more obvious.

  • Plus1 3
  • Thanks 1
  • Fire 1
Link to comment
6 minutes ago, knapplc said:

"...including Frank Solich."

 

Dr. Tom will never stop believing that giving the reins to Frank Solich was the right thing to do.

 

I don't know what Tom saw in Frank. But Frank was not capable of running that team the way it needed to be run. And as Tom's players matriculated out of the program, that became more and more obvious.

 

Well said. 

Link to comment
12 minutes ago, knapplc said:

"...including Frank Solich."

 

Dr. Tom will never stop believing that giving the reins to Frank Solich was the right thing to do.

 

I don't know what Tom saw in Frank. But Frank was not capable of running that team the way it needed to be run. And as Tom's players matriculated out of the program, that became more and more obvious.

 

Tom's a real loyal guy; I'm not surprised he's still Stanning for Frank. But you are correct: Frank was never going to lead the program to the heights achieved by Devaney and TO.

Link to comment
19 minutes ago, knapplc said:

"...including Frank Solich."

 

Dr. Tom will never stop believing that giving the reins to Frank Solich was the right thing to do.

 

I don't know what Tom saw in Frank. But Frank was not capable of running that team the way it needed to be run. And as Tom's players matriculated out of the program, that became more and more obvious.

 

I'll agree with you partially there. The other piece of this is that Solich was loyal to Osborne coaches to a fault.

 

Case-in-point: Craig Bohl was not, by any stretch, a good DC. And when McBride retired, Solich tried to promote from within, when the best move may have been to bring some fresh blood from the outside. Plus, we also lost our main Sports Psychology head at that time (99 or 00, IIRC) which also showed on the field (e.g. the Massacre in Boulder). 

 

I don't know if getting a more competent DC and maintaining our excellent Sports Psychology department would have been enough to mask over the other deficiencies in Solich's program, but it could have (at least) bought him a few more years to figure s*** out. 

  • Plus1 1
Link to comment

18 minutes ago, knapplc said:

"...including Frank Solich."

 

Dr. Tom will never stop believing that giving the reins to Frank Solich was the right thing to do.

 

I don't know what Tom saw in Frank. But Frank was not capable of running that team the way it needed to be run. And as Tom's players matriculated out of the program, that became more and more obvious.

 

3 minutes ago, VectorVictor said:

 

I'll agree with you partially there. 

 

The other piece of this is that Solich was loyal to Osborne coaches to a fault. Case-in-point: Craig Bohl was not, by any stretch, a good DC. And when McBride retired, Solich tried to promote from within, when the best move may have been to bring some fresh blood from the outside. Plus, we also lost our main Sports Psychology head at that time (99 or 00, IIRC) which also showed on the field (e.g. the Massacre in Boulder). 

 

I don't know if getting a more competent DC and maintaining our excellent Sports Psychology department would have been enough to mask over the other deficiencies in Solich's program, but it could have (at least) bought him a few more years to figure s*** out. 

 

Agree with both of these.  I don't think Solich was a great head coach.  But I think there's also something to the assistants not being as young as they used to be, especially on the recruiting front.

 

Solich's biggest fault (IMO) was he shouldn't have tried to also be the OC.  He really had no feel for play-calling and putting a game plan together.  Perhaps if he'd let Gill or Brown be the OC and Solich be more of a CEO it would have helped.  But I think Solich thought he could do it like Tom did.  He couldn't.

  • Plus1 1
Link to comment
40 minutes ago, knapplc said:

"...including Frank Solich."

 

Dr. Tom will never stop believing that giving the reins to Frank Solich was the right thing to do.

 

I don't know what Tom saw in Frank. But Frank was not capable of running that team the way it needed to be run. And as Tom's players matriculated out of the program, that became more and more obvious.

 

I have to respectively disagree with you knapplc.  I believe Frank Solich and Bo Pelini get a bad rap in Husker Nation for their coaching abilities (here I am not considering behavior or off-field issues), not because they were inferior coaches, but rather because they were coaching in the shadow of one of, if not the, greatest coach of all time Tom Osborne.  Another contributing factor is that fans have become much more impatient after the instant success of coaches like Urban Meyer at Florida, and Nick Saban at Alabama.

Frank Solich                        Bo Pelini               Tom Osborne    Nick Saban (Alabama)

1998 9-4                               2008 9-4               1973 9-2-1           2007 2-6

1999 12-1                            2009 10-4            1974 9-3               2008 12-2           

2000 10-2                            2010 10-4            1975 10-2            2009 14-0

2001 11-2                            2011 9-4               1976 9-3-1           2010 10-3

2002 7-7                               2012 10-4            1977 9-3               2011 12-1

2003 9-3                               2013 9-4               1978 9-3               2012 13-1           

 

Looking at just each coaches first 6 years, the only one that really stands out is Nick Saban, but otherwise these records are all fairly good, both Frank Solich and Tom Osborne inherited National Championship caliber teams their first year, and they both only got 9 wins.  Although there are a lot of variables I would AT LEAST try to make the case that Frank Solich's future at Nebraska could have had the same trajectory as Tom Osbornes' if we would have had more patience.  The same with Bo Pelini.

Just my two cents, there is no way to prove it one way or another, but I like these kind of debates.

  • Plus1 3
Link to comment
9 minutes ago, JKinney said:

 

I have to respectively disagree with you knapplc.  I believe Frank Solich and Bo Pelini get a bad rap in Husker Nation for their coaching abilities (here I am not considering behavior or off-field issues), not because they were inferior coaches, but rather because they were coaching in the shadow of one of, if not the, greatest coach of all time Tom Osborne.  Another contributing factor is that fans have become much more impatient after the instant success of coaches like Urban Meyer at Florida, and Nick Saban at Alabama.

Frank Solich                        Bo Pelini               Tom Osborne    Nick Saban (Alabama)

 

1998 9-4                               2008 9-4               1973 9-2-1           2007 2-6

 

1999 12-1                            2009 10-4            1974 9-3               2008 12-2           

 

2000 10-2                            2010 10-4            1975 10-2            2009 14-0

 

2001 11-2                            2011 9-4               1976 9-3-1           2010 10-3

 

2002 7-7                               2012 10-4            1977 9-3               2011 12-1

 

2003 9-3                               2013 9-4               1978 9-3               2012 13-1           

 

Looking at just each coaches first 6 years, the only one that really stands out is Nick Saban, but otherwise these records are all fairly good, both Frank Solich and Tom Osborne inherited National Championship caliber teams their first year, and they both only got 9 wins.  Although there are a lot of variables I would AT LEAST try to make the case that Frank Solich's future at Nebraska could have had the same trajectory as Tom Osbornes' if we would have had more patience.  The same with Bo Pelini.

Just my two cents, there is no way to prove it one way or another, but I like these kind of debates.

Wow...is it the off season again already so we are having this discussion?

 

It's appropriate to point out that all of those records were in the first 6 years of a coach's HC career....except Saban.

 

I don't have a problem with TO appointing Solich as HC.  I have a bigger problem with him not being able to hire his own staff.  THAT was the biggest screw up in the deal.

 

Without that ability, I'm not going to judge too harshly Solich's HCing ability.

 

 

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
7 minutes ago, JKinney said:

 

I have to respectively disagree with you knapplc.  I believe Frank Solich and Bo Pelini get a bad rap in Husker Nation for their coaching abilities (here I am not considering behavior or off-field issues), not because they were inferior coaches, but rather because they were coaching in the shadow of one of, if not the, greatest coach of all time Tom Osborne.  Another contributing factor is that fans have become much more impatient after the instant success of coaches like Urban Meyer at Florida, and Nick Saban at Alabama.

Frank Solich                        Bo Pelini               Tom Osborne    Nick Saban (Alabama)

 

1998 9-4                               2008 9-4               1973 9-2-1           2007 2-6

 

1999 12-1                            2009 10-4            1974 9-3               2008 12-2           

 

2000 10-2                            2010 10-4            1975 10-2            2009 14-0

 

2001 11-2                            2011 9-4               1976 9-3-1           2010 10-3

 

2002 7-7                               2012 10-4            1977 9-3               2011 12-1

 

2003 9-3                               2013 9-4               1978 9-3               2012 13-1           

 

Looking at just each coaches first 6 years, the only one that really stands out is Nick Saban, but otherwise these records are all fairly good, both Frank Solich and Tom Osborne inherited National Championship caliber teams their first year, and they both only got 9 wins.  Although there are a lot of variables I would AT LEAST try to make the case that Frank Solich's future at Nebraska could have had the same trajectory as Tom Osbornes' if we would have had more patience.  The same with Bo Pelini.

Just my two cents, there is no way to prove it one way or another, but I like these kind of debates.

The records may be similar but the caliber of teams they were beating are not.  In year one alone, Osborne beat #10 UCLA, #14 NCST, #18 KU, #17 CU and #8 TX.  Solich and Pelini were never going to come close to reaching that trajectory.  They beat a buncha patsies and lost to most teams with a pulse.

  • Plus1 1
Link to comment

4 minutes ago, RedSavage said:

The records may be similar but the caliber of teams they were beating are not.  In year one alone, Osborne beat #10 UCLA, #14 NCST, #18 KU, #17 CU and #8 TX.  Solich and Pelini were never going to come close to reaching that trajectory.  They beat a buncha patsies and lost to most teams with a pulse.

 

1974 Osborne played 3 ranked teams... #13 Kansas (finished 4-7), #1 Oklahoma (undefeated), #18 Florida (finished 8-4)

1999 Solich played 5 ranked teams...#18 Texas (finished 9-5), #21 Texas A&M (finished 8-4), #5 K-State (finished 12-1), #12 Texas (2nd time finished 9-5), #6 Tennessee (finished 9-3)

2009 Pelini played 5 ranked teams...#13 VTech (finished 10-3), #24 Missouri (finished 8-5), #20 Oklahoma (finished 8-5), #3 Texas (finished 13-1), #22 Arizona (finished 8-5)

 

This is the 2nd year, I think they look fairly comparable if you go over their whole body of work.  You are entitled to your opinion, and I was certainly not alive to judge the caliber of teams Osborne played in the 70s for myself.

 

14 minutes ago, ADS said:

Will this offseason ever end?

 

To me it's fun to debate this topic.  That's all.

  • Plus1 1
Link to comment
19 minutes ago, Crusader Husker said:

Frank and Bo were not in the same realm as Coach Osborne.  Should he have gotten more time, sure, but results for both Bo and Frank away from Nebraska have been average at best.  They are both at schools now with medium expectations and are good fits.  Coach Osborne evolved.  I don't think Frank and Bo are capable of changing.

 

I agree with your assessment, and it does put a big damper on my argument.  Out of curiosity, do you believe that had Tom Osborne been fired after the 1976 season, as he himself has stated the boosters were considering if he lost in the Bluebonnet bowl, he would have been just as successful at another school? 

 

I tend to think it's kind of a mix, a lot is the talent and ability to learn that the head coach possesses, but some might be the fit of the right school with the right work ethic, recruiting, etc.

Which may explain how a coach could do good things at one school and be mediocre at another.

Link to comment
10 minutes ago, JKinney said:

 

1974 Osborne played 3 ranked teams... #13 Kansas (finished 4-7), #1 Oklahoma (undefeated), #18 Florida (finished 8-4)

1999 Solich played 5 ranked teams...#18 Texas (finished 9-5), #21 Texas A&M (finished 8-4), #5 K-State (finished 12-1), #12 Texas (2nd time finished 9-5), #6 Tennessee (finished 9-3)

2009 Pelini played 5 ranked teams...#13 VTech (finished 10-3), #24 Missouri (finished 8-5), #20 Oklahoma (finished 8-5), #3 Texas (finished 13-1), #22 Arizona (finished 8-5)

 

This is the 2nd year, I think they look fairly comparable if you go over their whole body of work.  You are entitled to your opinion, and I was certainly not alive to judge the caliber of teams Osborne played in the 70s for myself.

 

 

To me it's fun to debate this topic.  That's all.

That's fair.  I suppose they don't look that different in the beginning but as has been discussed pretty much ad naseum, once the recruits from Osborne and Callahan ran out, you started to see a decline.

Link to comment

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...