RedRedJarvisRedwine
All-American
This list has me excited and nervous! As have a lot of other lists! Trepidation is a b!^@h!
College Football's 10-Win Club
- Thread starter zoogs
- Start date
Landlord
Banned
Here's an honest question that I asked in bowl season and we didn't discuss that much - who are coaches that are comparable to Pelini? Coaches that had decent success considering their expectations, but are several years into their jobs not taking that next step or DID take the next step but it came sometime after year five or six.
Pinkel and Gundy are the only ones that I can think of, and they are at schools that don't have the history or resources we have, but do have the recruiting talent nearby, so maybe those are close to a wash? Idk.
Pinkel and Gundy are the only ones that I can think of, and they are at schools that don't have the history or resources we have, but do have the recruiting talent nearby, so maybe those are close to a wash? Idk.
zoogs
Assistant Coach
Kirk Ferentz is an interesting case study. For purposes of this post, a 'drought year' is one that lacks all of the following: 1) a conference championship, 2) a BCS bowl berth, and 3) a top-10 finish in at least one of the AP and Coaches polls.
3-year drought
3-year top 10 finish streak (1 BCS bowl)
4-year drought
1-year BCS bowl
4-year drought.
John Cooper is another good one that Ulty brought up a few days ago. He was Ohio State's head coach before Jim Tressel.
5-year drought
3-year Top 10 finishes
3-year BCS bowl streak
2-year drought
For Bo, it's currently a 6-year drought, but Bo could bank some Ferentz-like good will with a few good years. Then again, Cooper had four straight 11-win seasons, culminating in a 3-year BCS bowl string. Then he sputtered to 6-6 and 8-4 and was fired. Miami's Larry Coker won a BCS national championship in 2001, followed that up with two more BCS bowls, two 9-3 seasons, and was fired for going 7-6 in 2006. Bobby Bowden's utterly ridiculous hall of fame career didn't save him from a four-year drought (despite making 15 BCS bowls in the previous 19 seasons), although they merely pushed him out and he was already near retirement age anyway, and they had a 'head coach in waiting.'
So it's not unprecedented for schools to move quickly to fire coaches, even when they have a lot of prior success. Whether that next hire is Jim Tressel or Randy Shannon, you just don't know. Many others, like Iowa, prefer to have a lot more patience with their guys, and I suppose you could say he rewards them now and again.
3-year drought
3-year top 10 finish streak (1 BCS bowl)
4-year drought
1-year BCS bowl
4-year drought.
John Cooper is another good one that Ulty brought up a few days ago. He was Ohio State's head coach before Jim Tressel.
5-year drought
3-year Top 10 finishes
3-year BCS bowl streak
2-year drought
For Bo, it's currently a 6-year drought, but Bo could bank some Ferentz-like good will with a few good years. Then again, Cooper had four straight 11-win seasons, culminating in a 3-year BCS bowl string. Then he sputtered to 6-6 and 8-4 and was fired. Miami's Larry Coker won a BCS national championship in 2001, followed that up with two more BCS bowls, two 9-3 seasons, and was fired for going 7-6 in 2006. Bobby Bowden's utterly ridiculous hall of fame career didn't save him from a four-year drought (despite making 15 BCS bowls in the previous 19 seasons), although they merely pushed him out and he was already near retirement age anyway, and they had a 'head coach in waiting.'
So it's not unprecedented for schools to move quickly to fire coaches, even when they have a lot of prior success. Whether that next hire is Jim Tressel or Randy Shannon, you just don't know. Many others, like Iowa, prefer to have a lot more patience with their guys, and I suppose you could say he rewards them now and again.
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Guy Chamberlin
Heisman Trophy Winner
Who's mocking the mid-majors? Is the Nebraska the only team on that list that plays lower-level competition?
zoogs
Assistant Coach
The mid-majors ... on the one hand, they're in nobody conferences playing nobody teams. On the other hand, they're also a nobody team.
So, they're sort of in a different situation than big conference schools like Nebraska, but remember, we're comparing achievements, not teams. There's no implication that a 12-win Northern Illinois team stands a chance against a less successful Big 12 school, but that doesn't make their success any less legitimate.
Nebraska and other schools in certain conferences also benefit in these broad-picture views: while we have similar resources, national expectations, and following as any other major BCS program, we don't play the brutal SEC conference schedule. The B1G especially of late hasn't fared too well in outputting elite teams.
So, they're sort of in a different situation than big conference schools like Nebraska, but remember, we're comparing achievements, not teams. There's no implication that a 12-win Northern Illinois team stands a chance against a less successful Big 12 school, but that doesn't make their success any less legitimate.
Nebraska and other schools in certain conferences also benefit in these broad-picture views: while we have similar resources, national expectations, and following as any other major BCS program, we don't play the brutal SEC conference schedule. The B1G especially of late hasn't fared too well in outputting elite teams.
Landlord
Banned
I would modify that last sentence to say that the B1G hasn't fared too well in the perception of outputting elite teams.
We were not quite as good but pretty close to as good as South Carolina and Georgia in the Capital One Bowl two years running - both "elite" top 10 schools. Michigan was every bit as good as South Carolina in 2012. Michigan State went 13-1 and beat "elite" Stanford in the Rose Bowl. Ohio State was still right there with "elite" Clemson even after the hopes of their entire season left them with a lack of motivation. Iowa hung right in there with LSU. Michigan State beat Georgia in 2011. Wisconsin lost to "elite" Oregon by a touchdown that same year, then went back to the Rose Bowl and lost to "elite" Stanford by a single score too, despite being an 8-6 team.
Are we as good as the SEC? No. Are we comparable to any other BCS conference? Absolutely. At least I think so.
carlfense
Heisman Trophy Winner
I agree with this. Minor fluctuations each year but I think that this is basically accurate.
Scratchtown
All-Conference
I know you have quotations around the word, but Clemson was not elite. I don't care what their record is even if its 12-1 and that one loss was by 35+....they or whoever are NOT elite.
Elite teams do not get blown away
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Landlord
Banned
I guess I disagree. I consider 2004 Oklahoma elite and they got trounced in the championship game, same with 2011 LSU who got shutout by Bama. Just as two examples.
zoogs
Assistant Coach
2013
ACC 2, BigXII 2, B1G 2, SEC 4
2012
ACC 2, BigXII 1, B1G 1 (which we didn't even play, despite our CCG appearance), SEC 5
2011
ACC 1, BigXII 1, B1G 3, SEC 4
Totals
ACC 5, BigXII 4, B1G 6, SEC 13
These are # of 11-win or more teams in the three years since we switched conferences. I guess that's what I mean. Maybe I shouldn't have focused on the B1G especially, but the competition SEC teams have in their conference schedule is just at another level.
ACC 2, BigXII 2, B1G 2, SEC 4
2012
ACC 2, BigXII 1, B1G 1 (which we didn't even play, despite our CCG appearance), SEC 5
2011
ACC 1, BigXII 1, B1G 3, SEC 4
Totals
ACC 5, BigXII 4, B1G 6, SEC 13
These are # of 11-win or more teams in the three years since we switched conferences. I guess that's what I mean. Maybe I shouldn't have focused on the B1G especially, but the competition SEC teams have in their conference schedule is just at another level.
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Saunders
Heisman Trophy Winner
uh, playing an FCS school once a year (like everyone but Notre dame and USC does) is much different than playing in the old MAC, WAC, and MW and a$$ pounding the directional schools for 10 of your games.
Saunders
Heisman Trophy Winner
Both have had worse seasons than Bo, and Gundy at least went to a BCS bowl and won.
Bo is an enigma.
Saunders
Heisman Trophy Winner
Part of that is the SEC's depth, and part of it is scheduling shenanigans. It's happened a few times over that period where the division winner didn't play the top 3 teams in the other division, and vice versa. Look for it to continue with 14 teams.
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