.500

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unlfan said:
Not arbitrary. Erickson won a higher % of his games as head coach at Oregon State than Riley did.

That is a very relevant statistic when comparing two coaches. Who is a better coach? Urban Meyer or John Cooper? Well lets see they both coached at Ohio State and John Cooper won 71% of his games there and Urban Meyer has won 92% of his games there.

You think that is arbitrary?
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Erickson also didn't coach as many games as Riley at Oregon St.

DE finished 14 games above 500

MR finished 13 games above 500

 
unlfan said:
If he had a better winning percentage between the two at Michigan and the best season between the two at Michigan, yes I would say he was a better coach. That is TBD, obviously, becuase Harbaugh's tenure is not over.
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So far, Hoke has had the best season. Harbaugh has the better winning percentage. I agree it's mostly TBD.

I don't want to put too much into the Harbaugh comparison. I just don't think the DE comparison has much if any value and I think we're trying to draw too many conclusions from mostly incomparable data points, but I won't beat a dead horse anymore.

 
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unlfan said:
Not arbitrary. Erickson won a higher % of his games as head coach at Oregon State than Riley did.

That is a very relevant statistic when comparing two coaches. Who is a better coach? Urban Meyer or John Cooper? Well lets see they both coached at Ohio State and John Cooper won 71% of his games there and Urban Meyer has won 92% of his games there.

You think that is arbitrary?
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Arbitrary because they weren't the same games, against the same teams, in the same conditions. 

Head to head > arbitrary data points

But keep on truck'n brotha, it's entertaining like a drunk falling on the dance floor at a wedding.

 
unlfan said:
You are making my point for me. I am saying DE had BOTH (1) the best season between the two AND (2) the better winning percentage when compared to Riley. Your comparison is not analogous because no coach in your example can claim they have BOTH (1) best season AND (2) best winning percentage.

Please, point to the coach in your example that has BOTH the best winning percentage AND the best season.
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You have already mentioned that you believe Dennis Erickson is a bad coach.  Do you also believe Jimmy Johnson to be a bad coach?  Dennis Erickson at the Miami Hurricanes had both a better winning percentage and best season(s) than Jimmy Johnson at the Miami Hurricanes.  Dennis Erickson still holds the highest winning percentage record for the Miami Hurricanes. 

There are a lot of good coaches who may or may not have a very good winning percentage or win a NC.  There are also a lot of bad coaches who have had at times a good winning percentage and won a NC.  A lot of things go into every situation.  Even most Oregon State fans agree that Riley laid the foundation for Erickson to even have any success in his short stint at Oregon State.   

 
TonyStalloni said:
You have verbalized exactly what I have been thinking for a long time.  I fail to understand the "gotta turn the program around in 6 weeks crowd."  Tom O wasn't an instant success at Nebraska even tho he was the OC for Bob D.  It took him awhile (21 years) to establish what he wanted, find the right players, create a system where he could be more effective and win the Natl Championship Game.  His offenses were meteoric but his D was often lacking.  They finally figured it out by going to the 4-3 with more speed.  Mike R is bringing in some quality offensive and defensive skill players but so far the line recruits haven't caught up.  If we don't get our panties in a bunch, success will come.
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Actually no - It may have taken him 21 years for the NC but not for conference championships, not for top consistent 10 rankings, not for national prestige and respect,  not for top tier O and yes even top tier D (his Ds faded when speed became the issue in late 80s and early 90s - until he reinvented the D). But overall, I hope MRs approach will eventually turn the table and get us to the top.  

 
Wait, we're not going to mention that Erickson's 11-1 season came on the heels of Riley injecting new blood into the program, and came with Riley's players? And also count it against Riley that he left because he got offered an NFL head coaching job?

Erickson is actually a great example of an otherwise career .500 coach having the potential to do much better when given tremendous resources and support. 

His career record at Miami is 63-9. His career record in the FBS outside of Miami is 84-72.

He definitely deserves credit for that 11-1 season, the best in OSU's history, but if we want to say that he's such a better coach than Mike Riley, why does the trend and aggregate of all the seasons blend together so seamlessly? Riley came back and picked up right where Erickson left off, going 8-5, 7-5, 5-6, then 10-4.

 
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unlfan said:
With your logic, you can't say Tom Osborne is a better college head coach than Bill Callahan because (1) they didn't play head to head and (2) they didn't play the same teams.

"They never played head to head, so HOW CAN YOU SAY TOM IS BETTER?!?!"

Sane people would point to the fact that TO won 255 games and win % of 83% comapred to Callahan's 27 and win % of 55%.

"BUT THEY DIDN'T PLAY THE SAME TEAMS, THAT ARGUMENT DOESN'T COUNT!"

you don't see the foolishness in that?
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I think it's foolishness to think that because a coach had one season in which he only lost one game should somehow make him a better overall coach than someone else.  

Dennis Erickson walked into a goldmine at Miami and just kept the train going that Jimmy Johnson and Howard Schnellenberger built.

Everywhere else he is a 500 coach.  One 11-1 season doesn't make him better

marko polo said:
A 9 win one
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Yeah.  That got us how many championships?

 
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StPaulHusker said:
I think it's foolishness to think that because a coach had one season in which he only lost one game should somehow make him a better overall coach than someone else.  

Dennis Erickson walked into a goldmine at Miami and just kept the train going that Jimmy Johnson and Howard Schnellenberger built.

Everywhere else he is a 500 coach.  One 11-1 season doesn't make him better

Yeah.  That got us how many championships?
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You asked the question

I answered

and as far as the championship part I am fairly confident that number will be equal

 
unlfan said:
.650 coach at Oregon State. Riley was a .530 coach.

I don't think DE is a better coach because of one season. I think he is a better coach comparing both of the entire tenures at Oregon State.
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One 11-1 season doesn't make him that much better.  He was fortunate for one season

 
unlfan said:
.650 coach at Oregon State. Riley was a .530 coach.

I don't think DE is a better coach because of one season. I think he is a better coach comparing both of the entire tenures at Oregon State.
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You're allowed to think that, but your perspective lacks proper nuance.

First of all, 4 seasons is a much smaller sample size than 14, and it goofs with the numbers.

Second, Corvallis is Mike Riley's hometown, and he was there for 14 years. He trended down over the last few years, but the circumstances regarding the expectations, the pressure and the longevity are very different than they were for Erickson's short stint building off what Riley had laid the groundwork for. 

 
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unlfan said:
.650 coach at Oregon State. Riley was a .530 coach.

I don't think DE is a better coach because of one season. I think he is a better coach comparing both of their entire tenures at Oregon State.
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And because you're completely willing to ignore Riley holds a winning record over Erickson in head to head meetings.  lol

 
unlfan said:
I also love how it always gets glossed over by the "you can't win in Corvallis" folks that it just so happens there has been an 11-1 season in recent history by a coach that was there for 4 years. So, it is possible to win big in Corvallis, Mike Riley was just unable to do it.
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I remember that team well and that type of season has been done once.  That team also had a lot of questionable sorts that were junior college transfers.  Though the dominant win over Notre Dame was fun, it also embarrassed the university and alums like me.  18 penalties.  Most were of the 15 yard type.  We looked less like a college football team and more like the "Mean Machine" prison team from an old Burt Reynolds movie.  You won't see those types of kids at OSU ever again.  Administration won't allow it.     

 
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