Adrian Martinez

Hilltop said:
Comparing Adrian's starts year to year is crap and any objective fan knows that.

The difference in supporting cast is so drastically different I can't believe anyone is taking the time to debate.  He is a good QB who can make dynamic plays.  Even more so when the players around him don't suck.  
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Drastically? Zavier Betts, Omar Manning, Austin Allen, Jaquez Yant, Rahmir Johnson, Connor Culp, Travis Vokolek, Oliver Martin, William Przystup, Wan'dale Robinson, and most of the offensive line were also on the team with Adrian when we sucked last year. Every player currently on the team was on the team when we sucked balls against Illinois just a few weeks ago, a game in which Adrian also sucked.  

We might be seeing an entire team finally get the focus, discipline, and team chemistry thing down, with Frost and Chinander finally making the adjustments to match the personnel. Adrian Martinez is just one of the players who has really improved his discipline, but he's the most important one.  

We also might be making wayyyyyy too much about one very satisfying win.

But I'm feeling really good about our chances of taking Michigan down. 

 
Guy Chamberlin said:
Drastically? Zavier Betts, Omar Manning, Austin Allen, Jaquez Yant, Rahmir Johnson, Connor Culp, Travis Vokolek, Oliver Martin, William Przystup, Wan'dale Robinson, and most of the offensive line were also on the team with Adrian when we sucked last year. Every player currently on the team was on the team when we sucked balls against Illinois just a few weeks ago, a game in which Adrian also sucked.  

We might be seeing an entire team finally get the focus, discipline, and team chemistry thing down, with Frost and Chinander finally making the adjustments to match the personnel. Adrian Martinez is just one of the players who has really improved his discipline, but he's the most important one.  

We also might be making wayyyyyy too much about one very satisfying win.

But I'm feeling really good about our chances of taking Michigan down. 
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So do you really think the guys mentioned played at the same level last year?  Seriously guy, your take are usually good but this post is a stretch.  Those guys may have been on the team but they weren't the same players.

Of course Adrian's play has changed.  All players go through ups and downs... That said, it isn't fair to evaluate his play alone without taking the play around him into context.  Nobody knows how he would have done if he had receivers actually running the routes called or an o line blocking for him, and the running backs.  

I'll ask again 2 years later, how would Adrian look with Ohio State receivers to throw to, their running backs doing their part, and their o line to protect him?  Easy answer is better.  His over starts being just better places him in a very elite category at the college level.  He isn't perfect but he is easily one of the best to ever wear the Nebraska uniform.  

Nebraska fans have a strange habit of being overly critical in the moment with their quarterbacks.  We are almost never satisfied even when we have one of the best in college football.  Been guilty myself...  We are, and have been, lucky to have him.  Our mediocre to poor record is not in him in my opinion.

 
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Mavric said:
Also, his QBR was significantly better last year than his freshman year.  Those are the stats I've posted twice.

His rushing yards were better as a freshman because he played in four more games.  His yards per game were better last year by a noticeable amount.
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I'm seeing Martinez's freshman QBR at 139.5, and last year's at 135.  That would be slightly worse rather than significantly better. I believe QBR is heavily influenced by yards per attempt and TD/INT ratios. Maybe you found a different metric. He definitely had a better per carry rushing average last year, but in the spirit of this discussion, wouldn't leading the NCAA in fumbles two years in a row be a pretty huge factor in figuring a player's progress?  

 
Guy Chamberlin said:
Drastically? Zavier Betts, Omar Manning, Austin Allen, Jaquez Yant, Rahmir Johnson, Connor Culp, Travis Vokolek, Oliver Martin, William Przystup, Wan'dale Robinson, and most of the offensive line were also on the team with Adrian when we sucked last year. Every player currently on the team was on the team when we sucked balls against Illinois just a few weeks ago, a game in which Adrian also sucked.  

We might be seeing an entire team finally get the focus, discipline, and team chemistry thing down, with Frost and Chinander finally making the adjustments to match the personnel. Adrian Martinez is just one of the players who has really improved his discipline, but he's the most important one.  

We also might be making wayyyyyy too much about one very satisfying win.

But I'm feeling really good about our chances of taking Michigan down. 
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You're feeling good cause of the option baby!! Go huskers!

 
Another way to consider Adrian that isn't a huge stretch...  Where would he be in the Heisman standings if our special teams was good and we were 5-0?  At minimum in the conversation...  

 
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Guy Chamberlin said:
He definitely had a better per carry rushing average last year, but in the spirit of this discussion, wouldn't leading the NCAA in fumbles two years in a row be a pretty huge factor in figuring a player's progress?  
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Only if his role was equal to those he was measured against.  He was our offense...  Alone for a while.  

 
It's really weird to me that discussions about Adrian usually turn into some weird seesaw-like balancing act of trying to prove he's better/worse than what we think. I guess it's only natural as fans, but man... Adrian has had some rough and spotty moments as Nebraska's starting quarterback. There's a lot of evidence to support that and it's not wrong to point it out. He's also had some really amazing moments and it's not wrong to point that out either. Right now, he's doing a lot of things right and that's deserving of a lot of praise.

But I don't like the frequency in which the "well, if he had a better supporting cast..." argument comes up any time AM comes under criticism for mistakes he has made or games they lost. A better supporting cast would help any quarterback. I don't mean to disregard the argument entirely because it certainly has validity to it, but it just seems like some of us have a hard time accepting when AM hasn't been good.

 
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Enhance said:
It's really weird to me that discussions about Adrian usually turn into some weird seesaw-like balancing act of trying to prove he's better/worse than what we think. I guess it's only natural as fans, but man... Adrian has had some rough and spotty moments as Nebraska's starting quarterback. There's a lot of evidence to support that and it's not wrong to point it out. He's also had some really amazing moments and it's not wrong to point that out either. Right now, he's doing a lot of things right and that's deserving of a lot of praise.

But I don't like the frequency in which the "well, if he had a better supporting cast..." argument comes up any time AM comes under criticism for mistakes he has made or games they lost. A better supporting cast would help any quarterback. I don't mean to disregard the argument entirely because it certainly has validity to it, but it just seems like some of us have a hard time accepting when AM hasn't been good.
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That's a fair message and point.  I guess my point is, if the supporting cast, or rather the whole team, were better, his mistakes or bad plays would be forgiven to the point he would be held in a much different light ( likely also a lot fewer mistakes and turnovers)... Even if his numbers, and individual plays were the same.

 
Hilltop said:
So do you really think the guys mentioned played at the same level last year?  Seriously guy, your take are usually good but this post is a stretch.  Those guys may have been on the team but they weren't the same players.

Of course Adrian's play has changed.  All players go through ups and downs... That said, it isn't fair to evaluate his play alone without taking the play around him into context.  Nobody knows how he would have done if he had receivers actually running the routes called or an o line blocking for him, and the running backs.  

I'll ask again 2 years later, how would Adrian look with Ohio State receivers to throw to, their running backs taking again of the paint game, and their o line to protect him?  Easy answer is better.  His over starts being just better places him in a very elite category at the college level.  He isn't perfect but he is easily one of the best to ever wear the Nebraska uniform.  

Nebraska fans have a strange habit of being overly critical in the moment with their quarterbacks.  We are almost never satisfied even when we have one of the best in college football.  Been guilty myself...  We are, and have been, lucky to have him.  Our mediocre to poor record is not in him in my opinion.
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Everyone plays better with better players around him. Adrian put up good numbers and got Heisman hype his freshman year throwing to Stanley Morgan, Jr., JD Spielman, and Jack Stoll. His performance dropped the next year throwing to the same JD Speilman and Jack Stoll, plus gamebreaker Wan'dale Robinson, and underused pro-style WR Kanawaii Noa. That same year Dedrick Mills and Maurice Washington averaged 5.2 and 6.0 yards a carry respectively. The same Rahmir Johnson got 21 carries but didn't distinguish himself. Nebraska won one more game than the previous year, but nobody was happy. We weren't wrong to be upset by the lack of progress. 

So yes, Adrian Martinez had ups and downs, and his sophomore year was a down year.  I'm willing to write off 2020 as a bad dream with a lot of culprits. But even removing the haters and trolls, I don't recall a single educated fan disagreeing that Adrian Martinez had taken a step back since his Freshman season, and we were all waiting for him to regain his mojo. 

Until this week for some reason. 

Actually, six weeks ago HuskerBoard was unanimously appalled by the talent level of this team across the board.

What do you suppose happened? 

 
Hilltop said:
Only if his role was equal to those he was measured against.  He was our offense...  Alone for a while.  
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The role of turnover ratio in wins and losses is pretty huge. Every quarterback handles the ball every play, and there are plenty of other running QBs in the NCAA. 

That's what made the Northwestern game so thrilling: no turnovers and almost no penalties.

We sucked as a team and now maybe we thrive as a team.

Same talent. Better discipline, more passion, smarter schemes. 

 
Hilltop said:
Another way to consider Adrian that isn't a huge stretch...  Where would he be in the Heisman standings if our special teams was good and we were 5-0?  At minimum in the conversation...  
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He would be the talk of college football and most definitely in the conversation.

If Nebraska beats Michigan and Adrian has a game similar to the last three weeks, he starts making some Heisman short lists.

Not many people watching the OU game would pick Spencer Rattler over Adrian Martinez. 

 
Nebraska55fan said:
Those numbers would be awesome- but can we really extrapolate the top paragraph  4 opponents to the ones on the bottom- probably not. 
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The crazy thing is he hasn't even put up insane numbers yet, in any of those games (passing wise) - just really good ones.

He'll probably have at least one 325+ yard game this season with a few scores. He also won't be out of any of those games with 20 gameclock minutes left to play, and also might be down more thus forcing more passes and aggressive calls. I think there's a reasonable chance the averages come out at least close in the ballpark.

 
Guy Chamberlin said:
He would be the talk of college football and most definitely in the conversation.

If Nebraska beats Michigan and Adrian has a game similar to the last three weeks, he starts making some Heisman short lists.

Not many people watching the OU game would pick Spencer Rattler over Adrian Martinez. 
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Heisman discussion, sure. Actually candidate, no. Too many losses already for that.

 
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