BIG 12 NORTH PRESEASON FORECAST

[HuskerGBR]

Aight guys take it easy on Jayhawker...he is only defending his beloved team. Kansas has some talent no doubt. We can't take that away from them and there are always people that breakout during the season. I have to say that Nebraska is on their way to building a monster of a team. I say that because of the 50 players we redshirted last year. Pelini took a gamble and it really paid off. Honestly we could have used quite a few of those guys last year, but we pushed through it and 9-4 is pretty much a miracle in my opinion. That's why I think Nebraska fans are excited and very optimistic about this year. Also the morale of the team was amazing and they kept showing they would keep fighting no matter what.

I am with Jayhawker here...Kansas does have talent, but the question we always go back to is are they going to be able to learn quick enough? They have some young'uns just like we do. I know us Husker fans question our inexperience in certain positions...are they going to catch on to schemes, etc. I still think we win of course, but it could very well come down to which team gets into the best groove by then.

 

[jayhawker]

You sure about that? Total D-NU 55th in the nation KU 90th, Scoring D-NU 81st KU 83rd, Rush D-NU 22nd KU 28th, Pass D-NU 89th KU 115th.

LOL. look at the numbers behind those rankings

Total D

Plays

Nub 803

KU 927 ( This is the big difference.)

Total yards

Nub - 4548 - 350ypg

KU - 5157 - 397ypg

Yards Per Play

Nub - 5.66

KU - 5.56

Rushing D

Nub - 114.46pg

KU - 123.08pg

TD's

Nub - 49

KU - 50

INT

Nub - 12

KU - 15

Fumbles Recovered

Nub - 5

KU - 10

Scoring D

Nub - 28.54 ppg

KU - 28.85 ppg

Looks to me in 2008 (a year in which NU fielded one of the thinnest and most untalented defenses they've ever had) KU's D was ranked lower in EVERY statistical category than NU. Yeah, I'm really hating that! :sarcasm

Untalented ?

Recruiting rankings

2004

Nub 34

KU 56

2005

Nub 10

KU 57

2006

Nub 29

KU 47

2007

Nub 21

KU 78

2008

Nub 21

KU 49

 

[jayhawker]

Aight guys take it easy on Jayhawker...he is only defending his beloved team. Kansas has some talent no doubt. We can't take that away from them and there are always people that breakout during the season. I have to say that Nebraska is on their way to building a monster of a team. I say that because of the 50 players we redshirted last year. Pelini took a gamble and it really paid off. Honestly we could have used quite a few of those guys last year, but we pushed through it and 9-4 is pretty much a miracle in my opinion. That's why I think Nebraska fans are excited and very optimistic about this year. Also the morale of the team was amazing and they kept showing they would keep fighting no matter what.

I am with Jayhawker here...Kansas does have talent, but the question we always go back to is are they going to be able to learn quick enough? They have some young'uns just like we do. I know us Husker fans question our inexperience in certain positions...are they going to catch on to schemes, etc. I still think we win of course, but it could very well come down to which team gets into the best groove by then.

I would be excited also if I was a husker fan. Looks to be a good team. But an injury here or there and both KU and UNL could be looking at 6-6 or 7-5 seasons. Both

 

[knapplc]

Jayhawker, if you continue to refer to NU as "Nub" you will not make many friends here. It's not funny. If you want some respect for your school, show some respect for ours.

 

[caveman99]

I agree with the off-season sentiment, the offseason is killing most of us. My main point in this thread has been about the questions regarding both of the lines on KU vs. units of relative strength for NU. I am firm believer in the lines dictate how good a team ultimately is. You pointed out stats that show KU's D was close to NU in scoring, the most important stat, but NU was dominate on the D-Line. That alone was good enough to shut down the run and force teams to be one dimensional against NU.

--My Comparison was D-Line to D-Line and previous posts were about NU's returning O-Line vs. KU's returning O-Line. In those comparisons, NU is clearly ahead right now. Granted it is pre-season, but KU has a TON of questions on both units where as NU doesn't. Line play is the key to successful teams, HUGE advantage to NU. But since you made this into a compare 2008 to 2008 stats eval, here we go:

Really?

Rushing D

#3 Nub 116.46 pg or 3.62avg

#4 KU 123.08 pg or 3.94avg

--NU was still better and ranked 21st nationally vs. KU 28th nationally. Also if this is all about KU vs. NU matching up in a game, NU has a decided advantage based on 2008's contest. KU got 118 rushing yards on 39 carries for a 3.03 yds/rush average. NU got 167 yards on 35 carries for a 4.77 yds/rush average. This was a key reason for NU's win, the Blackshirts were able to pin their ears back and go after Reesing to the tune of 5 sacks. This was my point in the previous post. Also NU held the ball for over 34 minutes in the 2008 contest, a result of a good running game along with the control passing game. This means less opportunities for Reesing and long drives for NU, both good things for NU and clearly reflected on the scoreboard.

That eventually leads to sacks, NU's D-Line was pretty good at getting them last year, which leads to shorter fields for the NU O.

Sacks you say?

#3 Nub 2.69pg (35 total)

#10 KU 2.23pg (29 total)

--Those 6 sacks are a huge difference, whether you want to see it or not. That sack average for NU was good enough to be tied for 14th nationally whereas KU was tied for 40th. Like it or not, NU has a big advantage in the Sack department as it has 3 players returning on the D-Line who should get 5+ sacks this year in Allen, Suh, and Turner. Also in looking at KU vs. NU in 2008 as a parrallel to 2009's contest, KU got 2 sacks vs. NU's 5 sacks. Advantage clearly for NU again.

Tackles for Loss?

#4 Nub 82

#4 KU 82

--I didn't specifically say TFL, I was more concerned with sacks as they are considered the bigger play due to the emotional lift they also provide but point taken. Incidently this was only good enough for both teams to rank 40th nationally.

Turnovers gained?

#5 KU 25

#8 Nub 17

--I never specifically said turn overs, I said sacks lead to opportunities for the Offense. More commonly because it usually means the Offense will get the ball back and also could create short field advantages for the Offense. Turnovers were a huge liability for NU last year, NU ranked 107th nationally with a -0.85 turnover margin. KU ranked 45th nationally with a 0.23 turnover margin. NU also lossed the TO battle vs. KU last year 1 to 4. Also NU was 97th in the nation in turnovers gained with only 17 vs. KU gaining 25 and ranking 42nd nationally. Based on that advantage KU, but last year's Blackshirt team was not indicative of what a Bo Pelini defense typically does after time to develop in the system. Here is a list of his previous team's results in turn overs gained over his tenure:

 

LSU

2007 - 3rd nationally with 36 turnovers gained and 2nd nationally in T/O margin at 1.43

2006 - 78th nationally with 21 turnovers gained and 58th nationally in T/O margin at 0.0

2005 - 111th nationally with 14 turnovers gained and 99th nationally in T/O margin at -0.69

 

This trend should concern you, the Blackshirts will be much improved in getting turnovers in 2009. Without the -3 turnover margin for NU in the 2008 contest, I think NU blows out KU. I would be willing to bet that NU wins the turnover battle in 2009 vs. KU. Advantage NU.

Combine that with NU's ability to run effectively and pass protect well and you have a great mixture to turn opportunity into points. It is still true that nothing opens the playbook on O more than an effective run game.

Here is where questions about your O come in. Who is going to be the big play WR? or for that matter the second or third WR?

--Oh I agree, Holt is a returning starter at WR but he wasn't one of the top two options. Going back to the battles are won in the trenches theme, NU should have a pretty good ground game in 2009. Even better than what KU saw in 2008, this improvement will make up part of any drop in passing game production. Add to that opportunities made in the passing game by play action pass set up by a strong running game and I think that NU will be able to move the ball effectively through the air.

The scoring D stat alone doesn't inicate that this was the case for NU, but you have to take out the games NU was never really in such as Mizzou and OU to see that. For all 13 games, NU averaged 28.54 points/game against ranking 80th nationally in this category. In the 11 competitive games, NU's scoring D average was 23.36 points a game, which would have put NU 50th nationally. 50th isn't great, only upper half, but it is 30 spots better than where NU actually ended up and not coincidently NU went 9 and 2 in those games.

Ok, doing the same for KU for the TT and OU games.

KU would end up with a scoring D of 20.00 ppg. Good enough for 24th overall. KU was 8-3 in the other games. You see how Baylor is the only difference in records last year?

--Hhhhmmmm, I think you need to relook your math. According the NCAA official stats, KU gave up 375 points over 13 games NCAA 2008 Scoring Defense National Rankings. Taking those 2 games out of it, TT scored 63 points and OU scored 45 points, leaves 267 points over 11 games for a 24.27 points/game average. This would be good enough to rank 58th nationally and NU averages nearly a point per game less against. Either way you look at it, NU had the better scoring Defense. Maybe a better way to look at how the team may do this year is look at the last half of the season. Taking the last 6 games, including the bowl game, for both NU and KU and you see a better scoring D by NU. NU gave up 197 points over those 6 games to average 32.8/game. KU gave up 222 points over that stretch to average 37/game, over 4 points per game higher than NU. Add to it that NU returns a great D-line and almost the entire secondary, only loss is Murillo, and NU should improve on that. KU has some questions on the D-Line, all new LB's, and Stuckey as the play maker at Safety, oh and a new scheme to have to implement. Advantage NU.

I know you can't just take out those games as a season is a result of every result, but I think it shows the D that KU faced isn't as bad as you think it was. NU's D should be even better this year, and I think it is safe to say the KU won't be able to blow the doors off of NU like MU or OU did last year. That all being said, NU's lines will win the day.

See. Not that much difference.

--Look again.....

 

[caveman99]

You sure about that? Total D-NU 55th in the nation KU 90th, Scoring D-NU 81st KU 83rd, Rush D-NU 22nd KU 28th, Pass D-NU 89th KU 115th.

LOL. look at the numbers behind those rankings

Total D

Plays

Nub 803

KU 927 ( This is the big difference.)

Total yards

Nub - 4548 - 350ypg

KU - 5157 - 397ypg

Yards Per Play

Nub - 5.66

KU - 5.56

Rushing D

Nub - 114.46pg

KU - 123.08pg

TD's

Nub - 49

KU - 50

INT

Nub - 12

KU - 15

Fumbles Recovered

Nub - 5

KU - 10

Scoring D

Nub - 28.54 ppg

KU - 28.85 ppg

--See my defensive breakdowns above. Also one stat you haven't brought up is Redzone D. NU was 19th in that regard giving up points 76% of the time. KU was 45 giving up points 80% of the time. Small difference, but a difference none-the-less. The key part to this stat though is in the number of points given up. In 49 opportunities, NU gave up 223 points ranking 69th nationally. In 54 opportunities, KU gave up 281 points ranking 107th nationally. When push came to shove, NU stiffened up a lot more often than KU. This indicates the overall toughness of a Defense. NU needs to improve on not giving up the big plays, with another year in the system, I fully expect vast improvement in the big play department from NU.

Looks to me in 2008 (a year in which NU fielded one of the thinnest and most untalented defenses they've ever had) KU's D was ranked lower in EVERY statistical category than NU. Yeah, I'm really hating that! :sarcasm

Untalented ?

Recruiting rankings

2004

Nub 34

KU 56

2005

Nub 10

KU 57

2006

Nub 29

KU 47

2007

Nub 21

KU 78

2008

Nub 21

KU 49

--I agree NU has talent, which is why a lot of us are really excited about 2009 and 2010. The issue last year was that injuries ravaged the NU Defense last year. At one point 5 walk ons were playing on that side of the ball. While true that many talented players are walk ons, if you field an entire team, or half of the team in this case, with them and try to compete with good teams you will have issues. Bo and Co were able to identify diamonds in the ruff and maximize the talent he had on the field. The other issue you are negating is the coaching change and subsequent system change. The players were under some of the absolute worst coaches around for 4 years. Breaking them of all of the their bad habits and tendencies was not an easy process and we didn't really get glimpses of just how good these players could be until very very late in the year. Comments came out this offseason like Marvin Sanders, the DB coach, saying he couldn't believe the technique backs were using to backpeddle. Also the former defensive coaches like a read and react approach, but failed to teach it properly. What resulted was a defense sitting on its heals passively and waiting for things to come to them. Bo's approach is much more aggressive and requires an agressive mindset as all good Defenses do. Expect even more out of this group in year 2.

 

[JGS30]

Good grief. My heads hurting after reading all this abck and forth bickering over who's better. Husker fans are right, Suh is a DT and they're not supposed to get a whole lot of sacks....it's amazing that Suh got over 5! He is IMO the best DT in college football. On the flipside, Jake Laptad IMO is ready for a break out year and will likely have 10 plus sacks. The kid only started half the season...that's right husker fans, half. Jayhawker is right....he was mostly double teamed while producing 7 sacks. Jake will be a force this year and if Woods is as good as everyone is saying he is then look out. KU's d-line is a strenght, when last year it was easily a weakness.

One of the husker fans on here said that Lee was more talented than Ganz!! LOL. That's the funniest thing I've heard! I'm pretty sure Bo would have started Lee over Ganz if he thought he was the more talented player. Bo had NO loyalty to Ganz. He could of discarded him, along witht he other players who quit on the team, but he didn't becasue Ganz was the more talented player. What a comment! LOL.

Replacing QB and ALL your skill positions will be the Huskers doom in the pass happy Big 12. Book it.

 

[carlfense]

Good grief. My heads hurting after reading all this abck and forth bickering over who's better. Husker fans are right, Suh is a DT and they're not supposed to get a whole lot of sacks....it's amazing that Suh got over 5! He is IMO the best DT in college football. On the flipside, Jake Laptad IMO is ready for a break out year and will likely have 10 plus sacks. The kid only started half the season...that's right husker fans, half. Jayhawker is right....he was mostly double teamed while producing 7 sacks. Jake will be a force this year and if Woods is as good as everyone is saying he is then look out. KU's d-line is a strenght, when last year it was easily a weakness.

One of the husker fans on here said that Lee was more talented than Ganz!! LOL. That's the funniest thing I've heard! I'm pretty sure Bo would have started Lee over Ganz if he thought he was the more talented player. Bo had NO loyalty to Ganz. He could of discarded him, along witht he other players who quit on the team, but he didn't becasue Ganz was the more talented player. What a comment! LOL.

Replacing QB and ALL your skill positions will be the Huskers doom in the pass happy Big 12. Book it.

Ummmm....Helu/Castille?

 

[Scarlet Overkill]

Good grief. My heads hurting after reading all this abck and forth bickering over who's better. Husker fans are right, Suh is a DT and they're not supposed to get a whole lot of sacks....it's amazing that Suh got over 5! He is IMO the best DT in college football. On the flipside, Jake Laptad IMO is ready for a break out year and will likely have 10 plus sacks. The kid only started half the season...that's right husker fans, half. Jayhawker is right....he was mostly double teamed while producing 7 sacks. Jake will be a force this year and if Woods is as good as everyone is saying he is then look out. KU's d-line is a strenght, when last year it was easily a weakness.

One of the husker fans on here said that Lee was more talented than Ganz!! LOL. That's the funniest thing I've heard! I'm pretty sure Bo would have started Lee over Ganz if he thought he was the more talented player. Bo had NO loyalty to Ganz. He could of discarded him, along witht he other players who quit on the team, but he didn't becasue Ganz was the more talented player. What a comment! LOL.

Replacing QB and ALL your skill positions will be the Huskers doom in the pass happy Big 12. Book it.

the Husker fan knows of what he speaks. There's a little matter of learning the playbook - Ganz knew it inside, outside, backwards and forwards and was called "a coach on the field". He'd seen this playbook for 5 years, and worked his a$$ off for his chance. Lee is far more gifted physically than Ganz. That's not me knocking Ganz, because I loved that guy, but it is what it is. We've heard Lee has taken a big step forward with the mental aspect now that he appears to be "the man". We shall see if he's really ready soon enough, but yeah, he's got the physical tools to be better than Joey was.

 

[caveman99]

Good grief. My heads hurting after reading all this abck and forth bickering over who's better. Husker fans are right, Suh is a DT and they're not supposed to get a whole lot of sacks....it's amazing that Suh got over 5! He is IMO the best DT in college football. On the flipside, Jake Laptad IMO is ready for a break out year and will likely have 10 plus sacks. The kid only started half the season...that's right husker fans, half. Jayhawker is right....he was mostly double teamed while producing 7 sacks. Jake will be a force this year and if Woods is as good as everyone is saying he is then look out. KU's d-line is a strenght, when last year it was easily a weakness.

One of the husker fans on here said that Lee was more talented than Ganz!! LOL. That's the funniest thing I've heard! I'm pretty sure Bo would have started Lee over Ganz if he thought he was the more talented player. Bo had NO loyalty to Ganz. He could of discarded him, along witht he other players who quit on the team, but he didn't becasue Ganz was the more talented player. What a comment! LOL.

Replacing QB and ALL your skill positions will be the Huskers doom in the pass happy Big 12. Book it.

the Husker fan knows of what he speaks. There's a little matter of learning the playbook - Ganz knew it inside, outside, backwards and forwards and was called "a coach on the field". He'd seen this playbook for 5 years, and worked his a$$ off for his chance. Lee is far more gifted physically than Ganz. That's not me knocking Ganz, because I loved that guy, but it is what it is. We've heard Lee has taken a big step forward with the mental aspect now that he appears to be "the man". We shall see if he's really ready soon enough, but yeah, he's got the physical tools to be better than Joey was.

:yeah I think he was referring to one of my posts where I stated Lee has more talent than Ganz and it is absolutely true. Lee is MUCH MUCH faster than Ganz and has a stronger arm by far than Ganz, rumor has it he has thrown a ball 70 yards. Oh and Lee is 6' 2" tall vs. 6' for Ganz and Lee was a 4 Star recruit. Lee is just a better athlete than Ganz, but Got Carl said it all, Ganz was the better QB for 2008 because he was better prepared. Lee was a RSo. and only had 1 year in the program going into 2008 because he was a JUCO transfer. I love Ganz, but Lee's ceiling is much higher and if the reports we have heard out of Spring Ball and the evidence of the Spring Game is to be believed, Lee has stepped up as a leader of the O and has a firm grasp on the O now. He spent a ton of time with Watson getting ready, hopefully it all pays off this year. JGS I think you need to research a bit before you go flying off the handle with comments like that.

 

[caveman99]

Good grief. My heads hurting after reading all this abck and forth bickering over who's better. Husker fans are right, Suh is a DT and they're not supposed to get a whole lot of sacks....it's amazing that Suh got over 5! He is IMO the best DT in college football. On the flipside, Jake Laptad IMO is ready for a break out year and will likely have 10 plus sacks. The kid only started half the season...that's right husker fans, half. Jayhawker is right....he was mostly double teamed while producing 7 sacks. Jake will be a force this year and if Woods is as good as everyone is saying he is then look out. KU's d-line is a strenght, when last year it was easily a weakness.

One of the husker fans on here said that Lee was more talented than Ganz!! LOL. That's the funniest thing I've heard! I'm pretty sure Bo would have started Lee over Ganz if he thought he was the more talented player. Bo had NO loyalty to Ganz. He could of discarded him, along witht he other players who quit on the team, but he didn't becasue Ganz was the more talented player. What a comment! LOL.

Replacing QB and ALL your skill positions will be the Huskers doom in the pass happy Big 12. Book it.

JGS30, below is my rebuttle to KU having a very strong D-Line this season. Bottom line I agree that Laptad appears to be a special player, but the DT's are suspect and to rely on a recruit without any time in the program other than Spring Ball and Fall Ball, 4 Star JUCO or not, to be dominate enough right away to keep double teams away from Laptad is a stretch IMO.

I do honestly think that KU will have a very talented team this year, this is an excerpt from an article about the DL.

"Jake Laptad, defensive end. Laptad showed flashes of getting to the quarterback last year with seven sacks. He shouldn't really be double-teamed too much with the presence of junior college transfer Quintin Woods on the other end, and Caleb Blakesley and Jamal Greene controlling the middle. Defensive line could be an overlooked strength of the Jayhawks' defense next season. With that in mind, Laptad could be a breakout candidate to approach 10 sacks. "

How many sacks did Suh have last year?

imagine what KU will do to UNL IF the DL plays up to these expectations.

I really do believe the season hangs on the OL.

article here

Regarding KU's D-line play, I think outside of Laptad I am not sure why you are so excited. Your comments about Laptad getting 7 sacks vs. Suh's 7.5 sacks last season doesn't make sense because Suh is a DT not a DE. Really good DE's are supposed to put up those numbers, Suh was doing it from the inside. I agree that Laptad is a special player, but that is why I disagree with the writer's assessment that he shouldn't see a lot of double teams. The two returning DT's for KU had 2.5 sacks and 43 tackles COMBINED last season. Suh had 7.5 sacks and 76 tackles by himself, his counterpart inside last year, Steinkuhler, had 2.5 sacks and 48 tackles by himself last year. Those are numbers that prevent your DE's from getting doubled and indeed NU got 11.5 sacks from DE's last year and over 100 tackles. KU doesn't have anything close to that returning outside of Laptad. Quintin Woods was a great 4 Star JUCO recruit, but this is still his first year playing big time College Football. Just like any other big time recruit, until they prove it on the field they are just that, big time recruits. Time will tell whether or not Woods is all that and a bag of chips, but until then I would fully expect teams to put their priorities into stopping Luptad. You would be dumb not to, he is the only proven commodity on that line.

 

[JGS30]

Good grief. My heads hurting after reading all this abck and forth bickering over who's better. Husker fans are right, Suh is a DT and they're not supposed to get a whole lot of sacks....it's amazing that Suh got over 5! He is IMO the best DT in college football. On the flipside, Jake Laptad IMO is ready for a break out year and will likely have 10 plus sacks. The kid only started half the season...that's right husker fans, half. Jayhawker is right....he was mostly double teamed while producing 7 sacks. Jake will be a force this year and if Woods is as good as everyone is saying he is then look out. KU's d-line is a strenght, when last year it was easily a weakness.

One of the husker fans on here said that Lee was more talented than Ganz!! LOL. That's the funniest thing I've heard! I'm pretty sure Bo would have started Lee over Ganz if he thought he was the more talented player. Bo had NO loyalty to Ganz. He could of discarded him, along witht he other players who quit on the team, but he didn't becasue Ganz was the more talented player. What a comment! LOL.

Replacing QB and ALL your skill positions will be the Huskers doom in the pass happy Big 12. Book it.

the Husker fan knows of what he speaks. There's a little matter of learning the playbook - Ganz knew it inside, outside, backwards and forwards and was called "a coach on the field". He'd seen this playbook for 5 years, and worked his a$$ off for his chance. Lee is far more gifted physically than Ganz. That's not me knocking Ganz, because I loved that guy, but it is what it is. We've heard Lee has taken a big step forward with the mental aspect now that he appears to be "the man". We shall see if he's really ready soon enough, but yeah, he's got the physical tools to be better than Joey was.

:yeah I think he was referring to one of my posts where I stated Lee has more talent than Ganz and it is absolutely true. Lee is MUCH MUCH faster than Ganz and has a stronger arm by far than Ganz, rumor has it he has thrown a ball 70 yards. Oh and Lee is 6' 2" tall vs. 6' for Ganz and Lee was a 4 Star recruit. Lee is just a better athlete than Ganz, but Got Carl said it all, Ganz was the better QB for 2008 because he was better prepared. Lee was a RSo. and only had 1 year in the program going into 2008 because he was a JUCO transfer. I love Ganz, but Lee's ceiling is much higher and if the reports we have heard out of Spring Ball and the evidence of the Spring Game is to be believed, Lee has stepped up as a leader of the O and has a firm grasp on the O now. He spent a ton of time with Watson getting ready, hopefully it all pays off this year. JGS I think you need to research a bit before you go flying off the handle with comments like that.

Ganz, rumor has it he has thrown a ball 70 yards. I betcha I can throw a football over them there mountains! -Uncle Ricco :laughpound

Oh and Lee is 6' 2" tall vs. 6' for Ganz and Lee was a 4 Star recruit. Another bad example from the caveman. Reesing is 5'8 on a good day, and is one of the top 10 QB's in the nation. Height doesn't mattter much in college my friend. If you followed it as much as you say you would know that. And congratulations on Lee being a 4 star recruit! LOL :laughpound I wouldn't bet the farm on his star ranking being accurate. Most of the time Rivals is wrong. I can name you 20 guys from KU in the past 5 years that didn't compare to their star ranking.

I guess our definition of talent is different. My definition of talent is his overall skill level...that includes his football mentallity, physical ability, field awareness, everything. That defines a kids talent. If youw ant to just go off the fact that he's bigger, stronger and faster, then maybe you need to watch track cause football is not your sport my friend.

Do you really believe that if Ganze was back at Nebraska this year you would want Lee as the starter over him?? That's basically what you've said, without even saying it! I know we'll never agree on one single thing......ok, maybe a few minor ones.....but remember this going into 09: Lee will have a learning curve. And if you think he'll come out gunz blazing, you're absolutely crazy. And about your comment on Woods...if you're dogging me about relying on the reports I heard from spring ball and this summer on him, then you're basically bashing yourself about Lee. I'm going off the same darn team reports as you are my friend.Neither Lee or Woods have proven anything in college. But I'd take Woods experience over Lee's any day. Woods has at least played at a high level against good competition for the last two years in juco. And if you think the competition is down in juco, you're crazy! Where do you think all those highly regarded kids from the state of Florida/California and Texas go when they can't score high enough on the ACT??? Answer: JUCO. :clap

 

[knapplc]

But I'd take Woods experience over Lee's any day. Woods has at least played at a high level against good competition for the last two years in juco. And if you think the competition is down in juco, you're crazy! Where do you think all those highly regarded kids from the state of Florida/California and Texas go when they can't score high enough on the ACT??? Answer: JUCO.

Zac Lee led his team to the JUCO championship game. What did Quinton Woods do?

 

[jayhawker]

But I'd take Woods experience over Lee's any day. Woods has at least played at a high level against good competition for the last two years in juco. And if you think the competition is down in juco, you're crazy! Where do you think all those highly regarded kids from the state of Florida/California and Texas go when they can't score high enough on the ACT??? Answer: JUCO.

Zac Lee led his team to the JUCO championship game. What did Quinton Woods do?

here is a pretty good article on the subject of the DL and the D as a whole

Here you go

 

[knapplc]

But I'd take Woods experience over Lee's any day. Woods has at least played at a high level against good competition for the last two years in juco. And if you think the competition is down in juco, you're crazy! Where do you think all those highly regarded kids from the state of Florida/California and Texas go when they can't score high enough on the ACT??? Answer: JUCO.

Zac Lee led his team to the JUCO championship game. What did Quinton Woods do?

here is a pretty good article on the subject of the DL and the D as a whole

Here you go

How does linking to an article I read two weeks ago prove that Zac Lee's JUCO year was not as good as Quinton Woods? The sum total of discussion about Woods in that article is, "And I expect junior college transfer Quinton Woods to be an immediate force on the other side." Further, this is an opinion piece and provides zero stats to back up any claim made by the writer. So what's your point here?