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New York City mosque


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I hesitate to call it the Ground Zero mosque even though the media has chosen that name because it's not actually at Ground Zero . . . it's a few blocks away.

 

What are your thoughts? Why do you think that?

 

Here are mine: I think that the Islamic group that is funding this mosque is making a terrible decision from a PR standpoint. This will only stir animosity against their religion and many people who should probably know better will react in a hateful manner. Basically . . . I think that they should build elsewhere.

 

That said, I do NOT think the government should interfere in this in any way. The same people saying that the government should step in and tell this landowner what to do with their property are the ones who cry about how the government is too involved in our daily lives. In the case of places of worship (particularly!) the government should not tell landowners what to do with their own personal property. Period.

 

 

Anyways. My guess is that the mosque will be built and people will hate Islam more than ever.

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I support the effort to construct the mosque 100%. The area they are building it in is a historic Arabic neighborhood that used to be known as "Little Syria". They are totally within their rights to construct this facility and I despise the so-called "real Americans" who want to take away their liberties. It's just bigotry, really. Few people who live in the area (literally, the area, not white bread Long Island shmucks weighing in on this) care about this because nobody has ever had problems with the Arabic community in New York. Suddenly this is national news and some bigots from east bum-f#*k Wyoming think they understand the situation. These people aren't violent. They're my freaking neighbors that I see everyday and it is extremely insulting to me how this is being handled. Even my parents in the suburbs - well to do Jewish people - are raising a stink about it. It really makes me angry. Bunch of hypocrites and bigots. That's all this is.

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I support the effort to construct the mosque 100%. The area they are building it in is a historic Arabic neighborhood that used to be known as "Little Syria". They are totally within their rights to construct this facility and I despise the so-called "real Americans" who want to take away their liberties. It's just bigotry, really. Few people who live in the area (literally, the area, not white bread Long Island shmucks weighing in on this) care about this because nobody has ever had problems with the Arabic community in New York. Suddenly this is national news and some bigots from east bum-f#*k Wyoming think they understand the situation. These people aren't violent. They're my freaking neighbors that I see everyday and it is extremely insulting to me how this is being handled. Even my parents in the suburbs - well to do Jewish people - are raising a stink about it. It really makes me angry. Bunch of hypocrites and bigots. That's all this is.

I understand some of the sentiment. However, there are "reports" that the Imam (sp?) of this mosque has ties to terrorist groups. Is that true, IDK?

 

I don't think that it is gov't's job to tell these people what to do, but do I think it is a good idea? Not really, for many of the reasons that carlfense brings up. I also think that it is time for people to adapt to the "American culture" not for America to bend over backwards for other cultures.

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Eh. I have no idea if those reports are true. All I know is that it's a Muslim mosque. That info alone gives me no information if those reports are true, so if they are, the burden of proof is on the claimants.

 

74, how is having a mosque built the equivalent of America bending over backwards for another culture? What does adapting to American culture have to do? Subscribing to an American religion such as Christianity? (What about Judaism, Mormonism, or atheism, etc?) Islam is just another religion and while this is of course a PR nightmare for the mosque builders, I don't get the culture argument.

 

If we look at this from either a 'liberal' or 'conservative' - I hate labels, but yea - standpoint, the mosque should be built. I mean, for one thing, there is no reason not to (unless what appear to be wildly unsubstantiated claims about terrorism). For true conservatives, government should be small and have little interference in people's lives. That is freedom. In America, it means freedom for people who don't look or think or pray to the same God as you either. Don't know why this is difficult to swallow.

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74, how is having a mosque built the equivalent of America bending over backwards for another culture? What does adapting to American culture have to do? Subscribing to an American religion such as Christianity? (What about Judaism, Mormonism, or atheism, etc?) Islam is just another religion and while this is of course a PR nightmare for the mosque builders, I don't get the culture argument.

I guess because if a Christian, Jew, etc. were trying to do such a thing in a predominantly Muslim country, they would not be allowed to. And it seems as if Muslims try to bring their laws/cultures to the USA, but when outsiders go to predominantly Muslim countries, outsiders are expected to leave their laws/cultures at the border.

 

I guess I was hoping that the people proposing this mosque would understand the supposed American culture of compassion and understanding. Difference of opinion.

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If you see a dog sh*tting in your yard and it pisses you off...it would piss you off to see any dog in your yard...

 

Many NYer's are still paranoid about it, and I can see how...

 

However, if these people wanting a mosque are citizens of America, it is against their rights not to build it.

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74, how is having a mosque built the equivalent of America bending over backwards for another culture? What does adapting to American culture have to do? Subscribing to an American religion such as Christianity? (What about Judaism, Mormonism, or atheism, etc?) Islam is just another religion and while this is of course a PR nightmare for the mosque builders, I don't get the culture argument.

I guess because if a Christian, Jew, etc. were trying to do such a thing in a predominantly Muslim country, they would not be allowed to. And it seems as if Muslims try to bring their laws/cultures to the USA, but when outsiders go to predominantly Muslim countries, outsiders are expected to leave their laws/cultures at the border.

 

I guess I was hoping that the people proposing this mosque would understand the supposed American culture of compassion and understanding. Difference of opinion.

 

But Muslim countries are religious in nature and have limited civil freedoms or political rights. America is not like that. I don't know - are there mosques allowed in Israel? I don't think "they do it, why can't we" really applies here. Muslim people do not control their country's lack of religious freedom. America can offer them something better, rather than say 'we can't go to your country and be Christian, so you can't come to ours and be Muslim."

 

I mean, bottom line is America was attacked by terrorists, not by Muslims. Sure, they were Muslim, but Timothy McVeigh was an agnostic, too. I sort of get the paranoia, but it's really unfair to the 99% of Muslims in this country who are perfectly good American citizens or immigrants or permanent residents. Just like the Virginia Tech shooter was Korean, but more Korean students attending Virginia Tech shouldn't be regarded as disrespectful to those victims, or treated with paranoia.

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74, how is having a mosque built the equivalent of America bending over backwards for another culture? What does adapting to American culture have to do? Subscribing to an American religion such as Christianity? (What about Judaism, Mormonism, or atheism, etc?) Islam is just another religion and while this is of course a PR nightmare for the mosque builders, I don't get the culture argument.

I guess because if a Christian, Jew, etc. were trying to do such a thing in a predominantly Muslim country, they would not be allowed to. And it seems as if Muslims try to bring their laws/cultures to the USA, but when outsiders go to predominantly Muslim countries, outsiders are expected to leave their laws/cultures at the border.

 

I don't get what you're saying. New York is not Tehran. The United States is not Iran. If you have a problem with what you are saying, then you have a problem with the particular country that has oppressive human rights, which has nothing to do with Muslims in America. Sure, they may have relatives in those countries, but there here now, and many of them are citizens and many of them were born here. They have the same rights we do in this country.

 

By the way, you have to renounce your foreign citizenship to become a United States citizen. The United States is the only government in the world that taxes its citizens' foreign earnings. There are a lot of things we do that we sacrifice to enjoy the benefits of living in this country, and one of them is being allowed to practice whatever religion we please.

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74, how is having a mosque built the equivalent of America bending over backwards for another culture? What does adapting to American culture have to do? Subscribing to an American religion such as Christianity? (What about Judaism, Mormonism, or atheism, etc?) Islam is just another religion and while this is of course a PR nightmare for the mosque builders, I don't get the culture argument.

I guess because if a Christian, Jew, etc. were trying to do such a thing in a predominantly Muslim country, they would not be allowed to. And it seems as if Muslims try to bring their laws/cultures to the USA, but when outsiders go to predominantly Muslim countries, outsiders are expected to leave their laws/cultures at the border.

 

I guess I was hoping that the people proposing this mosque would understand the supposed American culture of compassion and understanding. Difference of opinion.

 

But Muslim countries are religious in nature and have limited civil freedoms or political rights. America is not like that. I don't know - are there mosques allowed in Israel? I don't think "they do it, why can't we" really applies here. Muslim people do not control their country's lack of religious freedom. America can offer them something better, rather than say 'we can't go to your country and be Christian, so you can't come to ours and be Muslim."

 

I mean, bottom line is America was attacked by terrorists, not by Muslims. Sure, they were Muslim, but Timothy McVeigh was an agnostic, too. I sort of get the paranoia, but it's really unfair to the 99% of Muslims in this country who are perfectly good American citizens or immigrants or permanent residents. Just like the Virginia Tech shooter was Korean, but more Korean students attending Virginia Tech shouldn't be regarded as disrespectful to those victims, or treated with paranoia.

I'm not saying that anyone should be ********** religion or that we should restrict anyone's right to freely practice a peaceful religion. I just have a problem with people who don't believe in America and our culture using our laws against us. IMO.

 

On the flip side, most American Muslims may be good decent people, but IMO 99% is a little high. Not only were ther American Muslims that spouted anti-American rhetoric prior to terrorist attacks, there are now Muslims in America that openly support/participate in terrorism. The thing that bothers me is that these "good Muslims" won't blow the whistle on real terrorists, like the guy who shot up the Air Force base in Texas.

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74, how is having a mosque built the equivalent of America bending over backwards for another culture? What does adapting to American culture have to do? Subscribing to an American religion such as Christianity? (What about Judaism, Mormonism, or atheism, etc?) Islam is just another religion and while this is of course a PR nightmare for the mosque builders, I don't get the culture argument.

I guess because if a Christian, Jew, etc. were trying to do such a thing in a predominantly Muslim country, they would not be allowed to. And it seems as if Muslims try to bring their laws/cultures to the USA, but when outsiders go to predominantly Muslim countries, outsiders are expected to leave their laws/cultures at the border.

 

I guess I was hoping that the people proposing this mosque would understand the supposed American culture of compassion and understanding. Difference of opinion.

 

But Muslim countries are religious in nature and have limited civil freedoms or political rights. America is not like that. I don't know - are there mosques allowed in Israel? I don't think "they do it, why can't we" really applies here. Muslim people do not control their country's lack of religious freedom. America can offer them something better, rather than say 'we can't go to your country and be Christian, so you can't come to ours and be Muslim."

 

I mean, bottom line is America was attacked by terrorists, not by Muslims. Sure, they were Muslim, but Timothy McVeigh was an agnostic, too. I sort of get the paranoia, but it's really unfair to the 99% of Muslims in this country who are perfectly good American citizens or immigrants or permanent residents. Just like the Virginia Tech shooter was Korean, but more Korean students attending Virginia Tech shouldn't be regarded as disrespectful to those victims, or treated with paranoia.

I'm not saying that anyone should be ********** religion or that we should restrict anyone's right to freely practice a peaceful religion. I just have a problem with people who don't believe in America and our culture using our laws against us. IMO.

 

On the flip side, most American Muslims may be good decent people, but IMO 99% is a little high. Not only were ther American Muslims that spouted anti-American rhetoric prior to terrorist attacks, there are now Muslims in America that openly support/participate in terrorism. The thing that bothers me is that these "good Muslims" won't blow the whistle on real terrorists, like the guy who shot up the Air Force base in Texas.

 

:facepalm:

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David Koresh and Timothy McVeigh considered themselves Christians - maybe not the definition of Christian most Christians believe, but that was their belief. I don't see anyone getting upset that there are half a dozen Christian churches within the same radius of Ground Zero as this mosque will be.

 

If we're going to hold all of Islam accountable for the actions of Osama bin Laden then we're going to hold all of Christendom responsible for the actions of McVeigh, et al. That's how this works.

 

We could spend a couple of pages in this thread listing off all the harms done to the world in the name of Christianity, from the Inquisition to the missionaries to Africa and Central/South America to the pedophilic plague in the Catholic church to whatever. Mainstream Christians abhor these things as much as anyone, and feel no responsibility for them. Why should Muslims feel responsibility for, or be held accountable for the actions of bin Laden and his ilk?

 

It doesn't make sense. Let them build their mosque.

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David Koresh and Timothy McVeigh considered themselves Christians - maybe not the definition of Christian most Christians believe, but that was their belief. I don't see anyone getting upset that there are half a dozen Christian churches within the same radius of Ground Zero as this mosque will be.

 

If we're going to hold all of Islam accountable for the actions of Osama bin Laden then we're going to hold all of Christendom responsible for the actions of McVeigh, et al. That's how this works.

 

We could spend a couple of pages in this thread listing off all the harms done to the world in the name of Christianity, from the Inquisition to the missionaries to Africa and Central/South America to the pedophilic plague in the Catholic church to whatever. Mainstream Christians abhor these things as much as anyone, and feel no responsibility for them. Why should Muslims feel responsibility for, or be held accountable for the actions of bin Laden and his ilk?

 

It doesn't make sense. Let them build their mosque.

Yep.

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