A new Political party

[Hingle McCringleberry]

Carl,

The irony though, and the problem, is both sides think that the other"whitewashes extremism". I am a diehard conservative. Make no issues about it. I feel that the dems are doing the exact same thing that you same the Reps are doing. That is a problem. We are two guys on an internet board who both, based upon life experiences, jobs, culture, whatever that have the exact same idea. Extremism is wrong, yet you say it is the R's and I say it is the D's.

 

I am not saying this to get into some discussion about point counter point, but just a common sense observation. Our country is divided on views and opinions. Look at the demographics for who voted for who in the previous election and you can see this divide. It is scary. Our country is being divided by both parties.

 

Something needs to change. I hear you. Approximately 50% think that Dems are correct and the rest sided with the Reps. Their is slowly an eroding of a centerist party. Both sides are going farther left and farther right and those in the middle are forced to choose the lesser of two evils and not the best candidate.

 

I can't remember when the last presidential election was that I voted for candidate X instead of against candidate Y. Sad.

 

Some say the Reps need to change. I agree. BUt so do the Dems. Compromise. Both sides. Not just one.

What do you see as extreme within the mainstream Democratic Party? I sure haven't seen much extremism from the POTUS (much to true believer liberals chagrin . . . but to my satisfaction.)

 

 

Totally agree about compromise. Spending cuts AND the expiration of tax cuts for the wealthiest Americans. Let's do it.

 

 

It's not enough. Correct my math if I am off, but from what I understand the proposed tax hikes will only bring in 8xx billion over ten years. Or in other terms, not enough to cover one years deficit spending. Sorry folks, we all will have to kick in some bucks, everyone under 50 will have to be way more responsible for there own retirement, SS needed a massive over haul five years ago, Medicare as well. Defense spending must come down, and the tax code needs a huge overhaul. Of course none of this will happen. Obama will get his tax hike, the Dems will declare victory, and spend the next two years running a smear campaign to prevent any changes in SS or Medicare....

 

Honestly the more I look at it, I hope we go over. Mandated cuts, mandated taxes, still wont be enough but it would be a start.

[lo country]

You guys must both make more than 250,000. Congrats!

I do not. If we go over the cliff tax rates go up for everyone.

Not even close to $250k.

 

If there is no resolution, ALL CURRENT TAX BREAKS EXPIRE. Everyone is screwed. That is the scary part. We are all in this together regardless of who you voted for or against. This calamity effects everyone. Not just those making $250k+. IMO, it has the possibility of economically ruining this country in short order.

 

Currently, each side is trying to spin it so it is the other parties fault. Bottom line BOTH sides have known this has been coming for months. I am sure that the current lower than projected holiday revenue is directly related to people unsure if they will be losing money come Jan 1 and be able to pay for the holidays.

[EbylHusker]

Stewart has the best description of the fiscal cliff...

 

"There’s an asteroid headed towards the Earth. We made it and fired it at ourselves, because otherwise we would never have done the hard work required to protect ourselves from asteroids."

[HuskerShark]

The main problem with the two party system is that a large portion of the people that claim one party or the other (and this especially applies to the GOP) don't know anything about what the party stands for in the first place.

 

Probably over half of the people that I know who feel strongly about their party try to defend it, but when it comes down to it, the only thought/rationalization that is actually going through their head is this:

"My daddy was Republican, my daddy's daddy was a Republican, my daddy's daddy's daddy was a Republican, so I am too."

 

THAT is my problem with the two party system.

[EbylHusker]

While I don't like the two party system, I'd have less of an issue with it if there weren't so many in both parties (including politicians and voters) who only care about the other party losing. It doesn't matter to them what has to be done, what effect it might have on the country, etc - if the opposing side loses, it's worth it.

 

Public executions for these people are in order, both as immediate improvement to the country and to remove their genes from the pool.

[HuskerShark]

Public executions for these people are in order, both as immediate improvement to the country and to remove their genes from the pool.

[carlfense]

I'll let you show me the stipulation on fiscal cliff.

 

So your memory is failing you.

[carlfense]

Carl,

The irony though, and the problem, is both sides think that the other"whitewashes extremism". I am a diehard conservative. Make no issues about it. I feel that the dems are doing the exact same thing that you same the Reps are doing. That is a problem. We are two guys on an internet board who both, based upon life experiences, jobs, culture, whatever that have the exact same idea. Extremism is wrong, yet you say it is the R's and I say it is the D's.

 

I am not saying this to get into some discussion about point counter point, but just a common sense observation. Our country is divided on views and opinions. Look at the demographics for who voted for who in the previous election and you can see this divide. It is scary. Our country is being divided by both parties.

 

Something needs to change. I hear you. Approximately 50% think that Dems are correct and the rest sided with the Reps. Their is slowly an eroding of a centerist party. Both sides are going farther left and farther right and those in the middle are forced to choose the lesser of two evils and not the best candidate.

 

I can't remember when the last presidential election was that I voted for candidate X instead of against candidate Y. Sad.

 

Some say the Reps need to change. I agree. BUt so do the Dems. Compromise. Both sides. Not just one.

What do you see as extreme within the mainstream Democratic Party? I sure haven't seen much extremism from the POTUS (much to true believer liberals chagrin . . . but to my satisfaction.)

 

 

Totally agree about compromise. Spending cuts AND the expiration of tax cuts for the wealthiest Americans. Let's do it.

 

 

It's not enough. Correct my math if I am off, but from what I understand the proposed tax hikes will only bring in 8xx billion over ten years. Or in other terms, not enough to cover one years deficit spending. Sorry folks, we all will have to kick in some bucks, everyone under 50 will have to be way more responsible for there own retirement, SS needed a massive over haul five years ago, Medicare as well. Defense spending must come down, and the tax code needs a huge overhaul. Of course none of this will happen. Obama will get his tax hike, the Dems will declare victory, and spend the next two years running a smear campaign to prevent any changes in SS or Medicare....

 

Honestly the more I look at it, I hope we go over. Mandated cuts, mandated taxes, still wont be enough but it would be a start.

This is true. Unfortunately, it's politically impossible at the moment. Baby steps first.

[carlfense]

The main problem with the two party system is that a large portion of the people that claim one party or the other (and this especially applies to the GOP) don't know anything about what the party stands for in the first place.

 

Probably over half of the people that I know who feel strongly about their party try to defend it, but when it comes down to it, the only thought/rationalization that is actually going through their head is this:

"My daddy was Republican, my daddy's daddy was a Republican, my daddy's daddy's daddy was a Republican, so I am too."

 

THAT is my problem with the two party system.

I know what you mean about the "my daddy was Republican" crowd . . . but I don't think that I agree that it's more prevalent amongst Republicans. I think that sometimes it appears that way but then I think that my own viewpoint probably isn't representative of the parties nationwide because we have a very skewed sample in Nebraska. I'd probably think that the opposite were true if I lived in New York.

[BigRedBuster]

I'll let you show me the stipulation on fiscal cliff.

 

So your memory is failing you.

 

nice try.

[carlfense]

I'll let you show me the stipulation on fiscal cliff.

 

So your memory is failing you.

 

nice try.

Lighten up a little . . . you've got to admit that it's pretty funny that you want me to find a random Obama statement that you may or may not have imagined . . . and prove that he didn't say it.

 

It makes me laugh at the very least.

[Hingle McCringleberry]

Carl,

The irony though, and the problem, is both sides think that the other"whitewashes extremism". I am a diehard conservative. Make no issues about it. I feel that the dems are doing the exact same thing that you same the Reps are doing. That is a problem. We are two guys on an internet board who both, based upon life experiences, jobs, culture, whatever that have the exact same idea. Extremism is wrong, yet you say it is the R's and I say it is the D's.

 

I am not saying this to get into some discussion about point counter point, but just a common sense observation. Our country is divided on views and opinions. Look at the demographics for who voted for who in the previous election and you can see this divide. It is scary. Our country is being divided by both parties.

 

Something needs to change. I hear you. Approximately 50% think that Dems are correct and the rest sided with the Reps. Their is slowly an eroding of a centerist party. Both sides are going farther left and farther right and those in the middle are forced to choose the lesser of two evils and not the best candidate.

 

I can't remember when the last presidential election was that I voted for candidate X instead of against candidate Y. Sad.

 

Some say the Reps need to change. I agree. BUt so do the Dems. Compromise. Both sides. Not just one.

What do you see as extreme within the mainstream Democratic Party? I sure haven't seen much extremism from the POTUS (much to true believer liberals chagrin . . . but to my satisfaction.)

 

 

Totally agree about compromise. Spending cuts AND the expiration of tax cuts for the wealthiest Americans. Let's do it.

 

 

It's not enough. Correct my math if I am off, but from what I understand the proposed tax hikes will only bring in 8xx billion over ten years. Or in other terms, not enough to cover one years deficit spending. Sorry folks, we all will have to kick in some bucks, everyone under 50 will have to be way more responsible for there own retirement, SS needed a massive over haul five years ago, Medicare as well. Defense spending must come down, and the tax code needs a huge overhaul. Of course none of this will happen. Obama will get his tax hike, the Dems will declare victory, and spend the next two years running a smear campaign to prevent any changes in SS or Medicare....

 

Honestly the more I look at it, I hope we go over. Mandated cuts, mandated taxes, still wont be enough but it would be a start.

This is true. Unfortunately, it's politically impossible at the moment. Baby steps first.

 

 

The unfortunate thing is, there is never enough political will. Small moves now make for big results down the line, but we kick the can for another year, the changes that need to be made will get bigger. SS is actually in pretty good shape for the near term, but that shouldn't mean we dont take action now to ensure long term viability, but Harry Ried has said no way. It is this kind of short sighted thinking that got us the where we are. We can make adjustments to SS now that will have no affect on current users, or those getting ready to retire.

[BigRedBuster]

I'll let you show me the stipulation on fiscal cliff.

 

So your memory is failing you.

 

nice try.

Lighten up a little . . . you've got to admit that it's pretty funny that you want me to find a random Obama statement that you may or may not have imagined . . . and prove that he didn't say it.

 

It makes me laugh at the very least.

 

 

I'm fine. All through the campaign Obama promised to:

 

"Not raise taxes on people making under $250,000."

 

He did NOT say:

 

"I promise to not raise taxes on people making under $250,000 as long as we don't go over a cliff."

 

You claimed that that was his promise. So, I'm simply asking you to find a quote saying that.

 

Basically in this thread you have proven absolutely nothing. You come into a conversation and even bring up topics but when the discussion gets going, you act like you sit back and laugh at everyone else and don't add anything to the discussion.

 

That is pretty typical of a troll.

[carlfense]

I'm fine. All through the campaign Obama promised to:

 

"Not raise taxes on people making under $250,000."

Show me. If he did it throughout the campaign it shouldn't be hard at all.

 

He did NOT say:

 

"I promise to not raise taxes on people making under $250,000 as long as we don't go over a cliff."

 

You claimed that that was his promise. So, I'm simply asking you to find a quote saying that.

Here you go, straight from the White House website:

If Congress fails to act before the end of the year, every American family’s taxes will automatically go up. A typical middle-class family of four would see its taxes rise by $2,200 starting in 2013.

<snip>

President Obama is calling on Congress to act on his proposal that would prevent 98 percent of American families making less than $250,000 a year and 97 percent of small businesses from paying higher taxes next year.

http://www.whitehous.../taxes/tax-cuts

 

Basically in this thread you have proven absolutely nothing. You come into a conversation and even bring up topics but when the discussion gets going, you act like you sit back and laugh at everyone else and don't add anything to the discussion.

 

That is pretty typical of a troll.

You’re up. Show us Obama saying that taxes would never go up on people making less than $250,000. I have a sinking suspicion that the reason that you haven't done so is that you've discovered that your memory was . . . less than accurate.

 

But, yes. I do take these discussions rather lightly. The Beck-ian strategy of making claims with no evidence and demanding that they be accepted as factual until disproven always cracks me up. You've done that. I haven't.

 

 

 

(Also, FWIW, after quickly scanning this thread it looks like this is the first and only post citing a source other than you saying that you remember something. )

[BigRedBuster]

Great....You link to a current web site for the White House. I have specifically asked for quotes from the campaign where he was promising to not raise taxes on anyone under $250,000 (with stipulations about the fiscal cliff) since you didn't, I'm assuming you can't.