Playstation 4 incoming!

[Omaha-Husker]

There are XBox people and there are Playstation people, they will buy what they like and have probably owned for 10 years. The two products are basically fighting for a really small percentage of the market right now.

[Landlord]

Damn video won't embed so guess you'll have to click the link

 

 

 

 

Take the 's' off the end of http:// and you're good.

 

 

[Saunders]

There are XBox people and there are Playstation people, they will buy what they like and have probably owned for 10 years. The two products are basically fighting for a really small percentage of the market right now.

I don't think so. The 360 gained a bunch of marketshare over the previous gen (XBOX vs PS2). With MS new strategy, people will jump ship. For anectodtal evidence, I have gamed with a group of folks for over a decade. PC is our primary platform, and 360 was secondary. From the sounds of it, we'll all being going Sony.

[Chaddyboxer]

Yep....I have owned a 360 for a while and have been a fan of it...but with all the Microsoft BS..even if they turn back and abolish most of their foolish gaming policies...I am still going to end up buying the PS4....hell, the price difference alone screams at me to purchase it in the future.

Man...Microsoft really set up the pins with their reveal....and Sony is just knocking them down. Nice one Microsoft. Nice one.

[Blackshirts007]

I've read Xbox forums and its a riot. Countless people saying they are jumping ship and lots of people even put up a picture of their receipt for their preordered PS4.

[Chaddyboxer]

I've read Xbox forums and its a riot. Countless people saying they are jumping ship and lots of people even put up a picture of their receipt for their preordered PS4.

I've read Xbox forums and its a riot. Countless people saying they are jumping ship and lots of people even put up a picture of their receipt for their preordered PS4.

I've read Xbox forums and its a riot. Countless people saying they are jumping ship and lots of people even put up a picture of their receipt for their preordered PS4.

DAAAAAAYYYYUM!

[strigori]

The 'advertised backwards compatibility' always depended on which model you bought. The ones that ran PS2 games actually had the PS2 processor in the box. Future versions didn't include the hardware, as the analytics showed almost no one was used the 'feature' It was not removed in a software update, only if you changed hardware.

 

Who the hell used Linux on a PS3? People don't really even use it on PC's. What does hacking have to do with used games? Publishers are still able to do the 'online pass' feature that they used on this generation. That is not in Sony's hands at all.

 

The DRM or this generation is pretty much done. Sony is sticking with the status quo, and MS is going draconian. I doubt Sony changes course, though MS might. Too much consumer backlash, and there are better ways to minimalize the trade-in-itis that do not have that effect on people. Or just better incentives to buy the game digitally instead of a disc. (like many publishers already do with PCs, making the digital version off Steam, Gamestop/Impulse, or Origin $10 less than the disc based console versions) Sony has a much better understanding of these kinds of things from running MMO's for years. Also, the Xbone is region locked, and the PS4 is not. Not an issue for most, but for some its important, especially for non-Americans looking to import games. In general its not that surprising as a person who has dealt with the train wreck that is Games For Windows Live on PC.

 

I much preferred the PS4 exclusives, as 'shooters' are not my typical 'go to' for games. Also, be wary of some of those XBone exclusives, as they will shoehorn Kinect into them in ways that may well be damaging to the game. I have yet to see a great review for any Kinect (or PS Eye for that matter) game that was not a 'dance' game. And don't underestimate the indie games that MS has basically written off by disallowing self publishing on XBL. Must easier/cheaper to get games on PSN.

[VectorVictor]

Lets’ be clear here, that’s a very different situation than the “all games are protected” stance of Microsoft. What Tretton is referring to is the ability for a publisher to implement their own way to restrict game functionality and collect a fee if someone purchases a used game. We have already seen this in practice for current gen consoles in the form of EA’s Project Ten Dollar / Online Pass.

 

So, publishers can decide to implement such a system again, but the fact EA recently decided to kill Online Pass gives me confidence it isn’t going to happen, or at least not often.

 

http://www.geek.com/...y-wish-1558559/

 

And again, Sony is still being vague on publishers restricting used game sales or requiring always on DRM for their games. Their comments about allowing used games sales and no online authentication are for Sony-published titles only.

 

Sony has repeatedly been coy about how used games and online DRM will work for non-Sony published titles. And for Kotaku to bring this up, considering they're shilling all sorts of advertising for Sony (see the numerous banner ads on the site for PlayStation Plus and recent Sony-published titles) strongly suggests that online DRM and used game sale restrictions will be allowed at the publisher level.

 

The only difference is that Sony won't partake themselves, and there won't be a unified structure in place to handle this--each publisher could end up with their own online DRM and authentication process that differ from each other.

 

---

 

Of course, you can label me a fanboy, cover your ears, ignore Sony's inability to answer straightforward questions, and continue to do the online equivalent of screaming like a petulant little child. But at the end of the day, your inability to realize that Sony is playing you and the rest of the Sony fanbois for suckers will result in hurting the video game industry as a whole.

 

If Sony is truly as anti-DRM as you fanbois make them out to be, then Sony needs to come out and say no online DRM and full allowance of used disk game/traded disk game on the PS4, regardless of publisher. Sony needs to man up and take it out of the publisher's hands, but they're too chickens**t to do this. And the endgame will be a wild-west of publisher DRM standards and used/traded game authentication, on a per-publisher basis--that's not good for the lay/casual gamers, where the industry makes their money from.

[Landlord]

Lets’ be clear here, that’s a very different situation than the “all games are protected” stance of Microsoft. What Tretton is referring to is the ability for a publisher to implement their own way to restrict game functionality and collect a fee if someone purchases a used game. We have already seen this in practice for current gen consoles in the form of EA’s Project Ten Dollar / Online Pass.

 

So, publishers can decide to implement such a system again, but the fact EA recently decided to kill Online Pass gives me confidence it isn’t going to happen, or at least not often.

 

http://www.geek.com/...y-wish-1558559/

 

And again, Sony is still being vague on publishers restricting used game sales or requiring always on DRM for their games. Their comments about allowing used games sales and no online authentication are for Sony-published titles only.

 

Sony has repeatedly been coy about how used games and online DRM will work for non-Sony published titles. And for Kotaku to bring this up, considering they're shilling all sorts of advertising for Sony (see the numerous banner ads on the site for PlayStation Plus and recent Sony-published titles) strongly suggests that online DRM and used game sale restrictions will be allowed at the publisher level.

 

The only difference is that Sony won't partake themselves, and there won't be a unified structure in place to handle this--each publisher could end up with their own online DRM and authentication process that differ from each other.

 

---

 

Of course, you can label me a fanboy, cover your ears, ignore Sony's inability to answer straightforward questions, and continue to do the online equivalent of screaming like a petulant little child. But at the end of the day, your inability to realize that Sony is playing you and the rest of the Sony fanbois for suckers will result in hurting the video game industry as a whole.

 

If Sony is truly as anti-DRM as you fanbois make them out to be, then Sony needs to come out and say no online DRM and full allowance of used disk game/traded disk game on the PS4, regardless of publisher. Sony needs to man up and take it out of the publisher's hands, but they're too chickens**t to do this. And the endgame will be a wild-west of publisher DRM standards and used/traded game authentication, on a per-publisher basis--that's not good for the lay/casual gamers, where the industry makes their money from.

 

 

You realize this is exactly what we have had for the last 6 years of this console generation, yeah? On both sides? Sony is merely maintaining status quo. I dont' know how either company is actually in a position to tell the publishers they can't include any kind of DRM - that would be the worst business decision imaginable.

[VectorVictor]

You realize this is exactly what we have had for the last 6 years of this console generation, yeah? On both sides? Sony is merely maintaining status quo. I dont' know how either company is actually in a position to tell the publishers they can't include any kind of DRM - that would be the worst business decision imaginable.

 

Last time I checked, there were no discussions of used game restrictions or always-on DRM for this generation of single-player titles--that is still entirely possible (and plausible) on the PS4 via 3rd party publishers, and goes beyond what this generation of games has in terms of DRM restrictions.

 

Both companies can very well tell the publishers 'no'. In fact, on the NeoGAF forums, there are persistent rumblings that Nintendo saying 'no' to EA on Origin authentication/DRM on the WiiU is why EA is no longer developing titles for the console (that...and the lack of an expanding userbase). The problem is, there's a fear that if one of the console makers will say 'yes', the publishers will block production for the consoles that say 'no'....so it is a bad business decision only if the console makers aren't unified in their disdain.

 

But the thing is, this should be something that the console makers should all get behind for the good of the industry and their customers--that we have Microsoft making a DRM love-letter of a console and Sony being coy and deferring DRM questions to the individual publishers (the most significant of which we already know want always-on DRM) shows a certain lack of foresight by both the console makers and their fans that permit this to happen.

 

Unfortunately, the console makers depend on EA, Activision, and UBISoft to legitimize their console--the Dreamcast and GCN are good cases-in-point where publishers (read: EA) withheld titles and the console either floundered (Dreamcast, sadly) or it forced the console maker to pay a king's ransom for ports to be made (GCN). So as a result, they'll both kowtow to what the publishers want, as history has shown that they can't be successful without them.

 

So yes, it's a bad decision if the makers aren't unified, as Nintendo and Sega have shown. And it doesn't appear that Sony and Microsoft are willing to stand up to the publishers anytime soon.

[VectorVictor]

The 'advertised backwards compatibility' always depended on which model you bought. The ones that ran PS2 games actually had the PS2 processor in the box. Future versions didn't include the hardware, as the analytics showed almost no one was used the 'feature' It was not removed in a software update, only if you changed hardware.

 

Sony removed the PS2 hardware and went with software emulation that downloaded onto the console--I know because I have the last one with it before Sony disallowed (via update) future iterations from obtaining this software emulation, thus removing backwards compatibility via update (or lack thereof, in this case).

 

As for Sony's 'analytics' that say people didn't use backwards compatibility, this was Sony PR bulls**t...especially since soon after removing backwards compatibility, Sony introduced PSOne classics (and soon thereafter, PS2 classics) to the marketplace. Think about it--if people didn't want or use backwards compatibility as Sony claimed, then why would Sony put these titles on their marketplace and continue to support ports of these titles? Why would Sony introduce the Gakai streaming service for PS3, PS2, and PSX titles (that we don't know we'll have to buy...again...) for the PS4 in lieu of backwards compatibility?

 

Backwards compatibility was being used--Sony just realized that they could make money by making us buy our games over again, which is why it was removed. It had nothing to do with lack of use.

 

Who the hell used Linux on a PS3? People don't really even use it on PC's. What does hacking have to do with used games?

 

Well, first, hacking =/= the other OS feature on the PS3 that Sony removed. Hacking still occurs on the PS3 even after that feature was removed.

 

And apparently some folks used the feature, but I guess I want to know why you think the Air Force are a bunch of dirty hackers? Or do you just hate the armed services? (I kid..I know you don't hate the armed services, but calling them--by extension--hackers is rather rude...)

[VectorVictor]

Publishers are still able to do the 'online pass' feature that they used on this generation. That is not in Sony's hands at all. The DRM or this generation is pretty much done. Sony is sticking with the status quo, and MS is going draconian.

 

Not really--Microsoft is going draconian (but organized) and Sony is just letting the publishers do whatever the hell they feel like. So if EA decides in November that you can only play Dragon Age 3 or Dead Space 4 by authenticating online daily, guess what--you have daily DRM and authentication restrictions, and Sony isn't going to do jack or s**t to stop them. Not really all that different from Microsoft, other than MS is trying to put a standardized process around it, and Sony's first party titles won't partake.

 

I doubt Sony changes course, though MS might. Too much consumer backlash, and there are better ways to minimalize the trade-in-itis that do not have that effect on people. Or just better incentives to buy the game digitally instead of a disc. (like many publishers already do with PCs, making the digital version off Steam, Gamestop/Impulse, or Origin $10 less than the disc based console versions) Sony has a much better understanding of these kinds of things from running MMO's for years.

 

I agree with this. But those 'better ways' require effort that the publishers don't want to exude if they don't have to. It's why EA is getting rid of their day-one DLC and codes; they have something simpler and more obstructive in the works...but they sure as hell aren't going to discuss it while the frothing masses are already lambasting Microsoft for similar practices.

 

Also, the Xbone is region locked, and the PS4 is not. Not an issue for most, but for some its important, especially for non-Americans looking to import games.

 

Games, you are correct. Movies, sadly, the PS4 is region locked...

 

And don't underestimate the indie games that MS has basically written off by disallowing self publishing on XBL. Must easier/cheaper to get games on PSN.

 

I don't. I already remarked in the XBOne thread that this is a mistake on Microsoft's part, and it's indie games that are thriving on the PC and attracting folks like myself back to that platform. And if Sony embraces indie development on the PS4 in a similar fashion, then I'll be happy to support that move.

 

On a related note, I highly recommend 'Towns' on Steam--great indie strategy/planning title that probably won't see the light of day on the PS/XBox platforms due to the mouse-click nature of the interface. And it doesn't need a beefy computer to run.

[Saunders]

 

Not really--Microsoft is going draconian (but organized) and Sony is just letting the publishers do whatever the hell they feel like. So if EA decides in November that you can only play Dragon Age 3 or Dead Space 4 by authenticating online daily, guess what--you have daily DRM and authentication restrictions, and Sony isn't going to do jack or s**t to stop them. Not really all that different from Microsoft, other than MS is trying to put a standardized process around it, and Sony's first party titles won't partake.

Nope.

 

Update: We contacted Sony to clarifying Tretton's statements, which we were told might have been misunderstood. We were given the following response, which stresses online multiplayer on third-party used games:

The Online Pass program for PlayStation first-party games will not continue on PlayStation 4. Similar to PS3, we will not dictate the online used game strategy (the ability to play used games online) of its publishing partners. As announced last night, PS4 will not have any gating restrictions for used disc-based games. When a gamer buys a PS4 disc they have right to use that copy of the game, so they can trade-in the game at retail, sell it to another person, lend it to a friend, or keep it forever.

http://kotaku.com/th...-game-512643240

 

EA canned the online pass program, Activision doesn't want any part of it, and I doubt you'll see anyone else jump up and try it. I've never owned a Sony console, but I will not be buying a Xbone. People like to compare it to Steam, but there's no way in hell Microsoft and publishers are going to aggressively price games like they do on Steam.

[strigori]

Publishers are still able to do the 'online pass' feature that they used on this generation. That is not in Sony's hands at all. The DRM or this generation is pretty much done. Sony is sticking with the status quo, and MS is going draconian.

 

Not really--Microsoft is going draconian (but organized) and Sony is just letting the publishers do whatever the hell they feel like. So if EA decides in November that you can only play Dragon Age 3 or Dead Space 4 by authenticating online daily, guess what--you have daily DRM and authentication restrictions, and Sony isn't going to do jack or s**t to stop them. Not really all that different from Microsoft, other than MS is trying to put a standardized process around it, and Sony's first party titles won't partake.

 

I doubt Sony changes course, though MS might. Too much consumer backlash, and there are better ways to minimalize the trade-in-itis that do not have that effect on people. Or just better incentives to buy the game digitally instead of a disc. (like many publishers already do with PCs, making the digital version off Steam, Gamestop/Impulse, or Origin $10 less than the disc based console versions) Sony has a much better understanding of these kinds of things from running MMO's for years.

 

I agree with this. But those 'better ways' require effort that the publishers don't want to exude if they don't have to. It's why EA is getting rid of their day-one DLC and codes; they have something simpler and more obstructive in the works...but they sure as hell aren't going to discuss it while the frothing masses are already lambasting Microsoft for similar practices.

 

Also, the Xbone is region locked, and the PS4 is not. Not an issue for most, but for some its important, especially for non-Americans looking to import games.

 

Games, you are correct. Movies, sadly, the PS4 is region locked...

 

And don't underestimate the indie games that MS has basically written off by disallowing self publishing on XBL. Must easier/cheaper to get games on PSN.

 

I don't. I already remarked in the XBOne thread that this is a mistake on Microsoft's part, and it's indie games that are thriving on the PC and attracting folks like myself back to that platform. And if Sony embraces indie development on the PS4 in a similar fashion, then I'll be happy to support that move.

 

On a related note, I highly recommend 'Towns' on Steam--great indie strategy/planning title that probably won't see the light of day on the PS/XBox platforms due to the mouse-click nature of the interface. And it doesn't need a beefy computer to run.

Sony can't do anything about movies being region locked, that is a cluster of international trade agreements.

 

Just getting people to buy DLC or make use of Microtransactions, makes them much less likely to trade in a game, as they now own content for a game, and if they get rid of the disc, they now own something that is impossible to use. Season Passes are a huge key, sign up for DLC that will come out 6 months or more from the launch and you get past that first few weeks when most games get traded in.

[GSG]