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The Republican Utopia

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57 minutes ago, Moiraine said:

What is wrong with Iowa?

 

 

How much time have you got?  :D

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1 hour ago, Moiraine said:

"Speaker (Nancy) Pelosi's refusal to negotiate on funding for a border wall/barrier -- even if the government were to be reopened -- virtually ends the congressional path to funding for a border wall/barrier," Graham said in a statement. "It is time for President Trump to use emergency powers to fund the construction of a border wall/barrier."

 

I think Graham is worse than Trump for enabling him. Emergency funds should be used for emergencies. People with lower crime rates in America than Americans are not an emergency. They may not even be a negative.

WTF?!?

 

Hey Graham, the Senate voted 100-0 to fund the budget and not the wall.

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2 hours ago, Moiraine said:

 

 

 

What is wrong with Iowa?

 

I lived in his district growing up. He’s only really been super open with his views for the past couple election cycles... gee, I wonder what changed? Anywho, I’ll tell you that district is overwhelmingly rural and white and cultural conservatism runs deep in that neck of the woods. To the point of a lot of them don’t hear about or outright look the other way at his awful views and vote for the R.

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2 hours ago, Clifford Franklin said:

 

I lived in his district growing up. He’s only really been super open with his views for the past couple election cycles... gee, I wonder what changed? Anywho, I’ll tell you that district is overwhelmingly rural and white and cultural conservatism runs deep in that neck of the woods. To the point of a lot of them don’t hear about or outright look the other way at his awful views and vote for the R.

I currently live in this district and in a rural community. Your points are spot on. This is a place where people still openly drop racial slurs and talk about minorities like they are the plague without any backlash. I’ve lived in many rural areas throughout the Midwest.  This is by far the most pro-trump/racist I have ever been around.

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1 hour ago, BigRedBuster said:

Wow. 

 

 

 

 

Can’t fix stupid. If there was an actual serious threat to the country I might admire them, but they’ve fallen for believing in a made up threat. 

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2 hours ago, BigRedBuster said:

Wow. 

 

 

 

 

If you're willing to lose your farm because of that wall, you should lose your farm because of that wall.

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29 minutes ago, StPaulHusker said:

 

 

If you're willing to lose your farm because of that wall, you should lose your farm because of that wall.

what if they sell their tractors and farms and donate the proceeds to the wall fund?  that would really own the libs!

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1 minute ago, commando said:

what if they sell their tractors and farms and donate the proceeds to the wall fund?  that would really own the libs!

Maybe the president could funnel the farm subsidy money to build the wall.  I'm sure farmers won't mind.  

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7 minutes ago, StPaulHusker said:

Maybe the president could funnel the farm subsidy money to build the wall.  I'm sure farmers won't mind.  

that is a great idea!  let's forward it to donnie along with the quote from the farmer wanting to lose his farm to support the wall.    

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A few outliers don't speak for the farming community. It's a tough time for farmers (mainly crop) right now, some of which I know personally, and not all of them are happy with the way the President has handled it. 

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4 minutes ago, B.B. Hemingway said:

 

A few outliers don't speak for the farming community. It's a tough time for farmers (mainly crop) right now, some of which I know personally, and not all of them are happy with the way the President has handled it. 

 

How did they imagine he was going to handle it?  Make Mexico pay for the wall?

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7 minutes ago, StPaulHusker said:

 

How did they imagine he was going to handle it?  Make Mexico pay for the wall?

 

 

Probably. Does all empathy go out the window if they were duped by Trump? That be the least surprising thing ever, considering their demographic.

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3 minutes ago, B.B. Hemingway said:

 

 

Probably. Does all empathy go out the window if they were duped by Trump? That be the least surprising thing ever, considering their demographic.

 

I think empathy should go out the window if they were duped.  People were screaming that they were being duped. Didn't matter to them as long as they "LOCK HER UP!!!!!"

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Just now, StPaulHusker said:

 

I think empathy should go out the window if they were duped.  People were screaming that they were being duped. Didn't matter to them as long as they "LOCK HER UP!!!!!"

 

Interesting. So they should "lay in the bed they made", right? I would tend to agree with you. A little consistency from the left, across the entire demographic spectrum in regard to personal accountability, would be welcomed. I'm all for accountability.

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2 minutes ago, B.B. Hemingway said:

 

Interesting. So they should "lay in the bed they made", right? I would tend to agree with you. A little consistency from the left, across the entire demographic spectrum in regard to personal accountability, would be welcomed. I'm all for accountability.

Cite examples of where the personal accountability from the left is needed for you

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18 hours ago, Moiraine said:

"Speaker (Nancy) Pelosi's refusal to negotiate on funding for a border wall/barrier -- even if the government were to be reopened -- virtually ends the congressional path to funding for a border wall/barrier," Graham said in a statement. "It is time for President Trump to use emergency powers to fund the construction of a border wall/barrier."

 

Yeah, I think it's also time for Senator Palpatine to use emergency powers to eradicate the Jedi problem.

 

 

 

 

30 minutes ago, StPaulHusker said:

 

I think empathy should go out the window if they were duped.  People were screaming that they were being duped. Didn't matter to them as long as they "LOCK HER UP!!!!!"

 

Empathy should never go out the window. It's the only means by which we can come to real long lasting solutions.

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1 minute ago, Landlord said:

 

Yeah, I think it's also time for Senator Palpatine to use emergency powers to eradicate the Jedi problem.

 

 

 

 

 

Empathy should never go out the window. It's the only means by which we can come to real long lasting solutions.

 

Empathy can go out the window.  It doesn't mean I'm going to personally go up to farmers I know and say, "I told you so" and ridicule them.  

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45 minutes ago, StPaulHusker said:

Cite examples of where the personal accountability from the left is needed for you

 

 

 

It's  not "needed for me", but if you're going to have empathy for minorities in the inner-city, where personal accountability doesn't always exist, then you should have the same for farmers (or poor white people) that have similar struggles in their own lives. Even if their circumstances are partly of their own doing (just like those in the inner cities). 

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7 minutes ago, B.B. Hemingway said:

It's  not "needed for me", but if you're going to have empathy for minorities in the inner-city, where personal accountability doesn't always exist, then you should have the same for farmers (or poor white people) that have similar struggles in their own lives. Even if their circumstances are partly of their own doing (just like those in the inner cities). 

 

You're 100% right. This is the entire point of the political left. Their utility is to be watchful and vigilant against heirarchies becoming calcified in ways that hurt groups. Farmers and coal miners and the like should absolutely be included in that considering the current state of the world.

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25 minutes ago, StPaulHusker said:

 

Empathy can go out the window.  It doesn't mean I'm going to personally go up to farmers I know and say, "I told you so" and ridicule them.  

 

There are ways of saying 'I told you so' while still being empathetic. These farmers need to learn the err of their ways, but they shouldn't have to lose everything and sacrifice the security, health, and safety of their family to do it. 

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8 minutes ago, VectorVictor said:

 

There are ways of saying 'I told you so' while still being empathetic. These farmers need to learn the err of their ways, but they shouldn't have to lose everything and sacrifice the security, health, and safety of their family to do it. 

 

Gotta teach them a lesson, huh?

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1 minute ago, B.B. Hemingway said:

 

Gotta teach us a lesson, huh?

 

If you're a farmer and voted for Trump, yes--that's a pretty damn myopic and ignorant choice if your trade requires open trade, cheap labor, and government subsidies. 

 

 

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I live right smack dab in the middle of farming country in Nebraska.  I'm heavily involved with the ag community.  I have very good friends who are farmers.  I don't want them to lose their livelihoods.  


But, I've also had enough conversations with them about Trump and them teasing me because I'm the outlier in not loving the guy......that when they bitch about this, there will be a twinge of "told you so" going through my mind.

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39 minutes ago, B.B. Hemingway said:

 

 

 

It's  not "needed for me", but if you're going to have empathy for minorities in the inner-city, where personal accountability doesn't always exist, then you should have the same for farmers (or poor white people) that have similar struggles in their own lives. Even if their circumstances are partly of their own doing (just like those in the inner cities). 

You think democrats don't have empathy for farmers? Despite how they vote?  Do tell.....

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4 minutes ago, StPaulHusker said:

You think democrats don't have empathy for farmers? Despite how they vote?  Do tell.....

 

You get bonus points for providing subsidies for farmers? It's kind of a must, given the industry. If you can't see the polar-opposite narratives out there, and how it relates to  poor white people, and minorities, well....

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3 minutes ago, B.B. Hemingway said:

 

You get bonus points for providing subsidies for farmers? It's kind of a must, given the industry. If you can't see the polar-opposite narratives out there, and how it relates to  poor white people, and minorities, well....

Every single Democrat in the Senate voted for the $867B farm bill.  Every one.  Every Democrat voted to support farmers despite who they voted for.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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20 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said:

I live right smack dab in the middle of farming country in Nebraska.  I'm heavily involved with the ag community.  I have very good friends who are farmers.  I don't want them to lose their livelihoods.  


But, I've also had enough conversations with them about Trump and them teasing me because I'm the outlier in not loving the guy......that when they bitch about this, there will be a twinge of "told you so" going through my mind.

 

I can understand farmers voting for the guy. They almost exclusively lean conservative now, whereas in the past some of them may have been more open to liberals because they promoted the government helping their industry.

 

What I don't get is how they can see their access to markets close off because of Trump's moves on trade and literally be backed up against a wall facing the loss of your farm, and still be like "Well, yeah, we've got to build that wall!"

 

I definitely feel empathy for these people. Because their cultural conservatism & identifying with the GOP are bonds that run so deep they still put their faith in a conman who promised them everything but is now costing them everything. They're still sticking their neck out for him in hopes he'll come through.

 

I don't know how that type of recalcitrant belief in a person/party who is hurting them is going to change.

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34 minutes ago, VectorVictor said:

 

There are ways of saying 'I told you so' while still being empathetic. These farmers need to learn the err of their ways, but they shouldn't have to lose everything and sacrifice the security, health, and safety of their family to do it. 

 

 

That particular way of saying 'I told you so' doesn't really sound anything like I told you so. It sounds more like, "Hey, I understand why you made that decision and you weren't alone - a lot of good people were fooled and taken advantage of it wasn't just you. Here's some helpful ways to be on the lookout against people trying to manipulate and use you like that so you can be more mindful in the future. We're all in this together we've gotta look out for each other."

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40 minutes ago, B.B. Hemingway said:

Gotta teach them a lesson, huh?

 

 

Shouldn’t all of us learn lessons from how we vote when it doesn’t work out, instead of being hard-headed?

 

Sometimes the only way to learn that lesson is to be personally affected by a problem the person you voted for caused.

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Lindsey Graham is about the worst offender of being constitutionally incapable of taking a stand against the leader of his own party. 

 

Remember when he said not to trust Trump? That getting behind him would destroy the GOP?

 

What a turn he's made. Now he's clearly only concerned with avoiding a primary next year from his base, and being Trump's footstool is priority numero uno.

 

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2 minutes ago, Clifford Franklin said:

 

I can understand farmers voting for the guy. They almost exclusively lean conservative now, whereas in the past some of them may have been more open to liberals because they promoted the government helping their industry.

 

What I don't get is how they can see their access to markets close off because of Trump's moves on trade and literally be backed up against a wall facing the loss of your farm, and still be like "Well, yeah, we've got to build that wall!"

 

I definitely feel empathy for these people. Because their cultural conservatism & identifying with the GOP are bonds that run so deep they still put their faith in a conman who promised them everything but is now costing them everything. They're still sticking their neck out for him in hopes he'll come through.

 

I don't know how that type of recalcitrant belief in a person/party who is hurting them is going to change.

 

When I talk to these people, it's a really strange conversation.  I've been around these people long enough that I know they heavily criticized politicians in the past for moral issues....like Clinton and his affairs.  "Claiming" Obama lied to everyone with Obamacare.  Hillary and her corrupt business dealings.


NOW.....we have a Republican that encompasses all of those things openly and almost proudly.  They think he's the greatest thing in the world because he "tells it like it is" and gets conservatives on the bench.

 

This, honestly, is the strangest era of American politics I have ever witnessed.

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1 hour ago, BigRedBuster said:

 

When I talk to these people, it's a really strange conversation.  I've been around these people long enough that I know they heavily criticized politicians in the past for moral issues....like Clinton and his affairs.  "Claiming" Obama lied to everyone with Obamacare.  Hillary and her corrupt business dealings.


NOW.....we have a Republican that encompasses all of those things openly and almost proudly.  They think he's the greatest thing in the world because he "tells it like it is" and gets conservatives on the bench.

 

This, honestly, is the strangest era of American politics I have ever witnessed.

 

Strangest, or saddest? Remember, these are the Baby Boomers, who came from our Greatest Generation(tm). Expectations were not unreasonably high. 

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this shutdown might last awhile if trumpy doesn't get his way

 

https://www.politico.com/story/2019/01/11/freedom-caucus-border-emergency-trump-1096929

 

Meadows added that Trump could decide to keep the government shut down even if he declares a national emergency, suggesting that the president may wait to see the outcome in the courts first even if that took months.

“It doesn’t necessarily open the government,” Meadows said. “Declaring a national emergency and funding the government are two separate decisions.”

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Lotta mentions about farmers here. I grew up on a farm, it's still in the family. All that I've really got to say is f#&% farmers. No one should inherit their livelihood. Zero sympathy from me if those people are impacted by...anything.

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9 hours ago, mrandyk said:

Lotta mentions about farmers here. I grew up on a farm, it's still in the family. All that I've really got to say is f#&% farmers. No one should inherit their livelihood. Zero sympathy from me if those people are impacted by...anything.

 

So you're against somebody inheriting a livelihood from their own family, but you're okay with someone inheriting a livelihood from taxpayers they've never met? Very, very interesting....

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10 hours ago, mrandyk said:

Lotta mentions about farmers here. I grew up on a farm, it's still in the family. All that I've really got to say is f#&% farmers. No one should inherit their livelihood. Zero sympathy from me if those people are impacted by...anything.

What?

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I was quite a few beers deep last night. Very eloquent thought there. Love getting back online in the morning and wondering why I thought I should share whatever I did.

 

Response was meant for the posts regarding farmers screwing themselves by voting Republican, while holding a holier than thou attitude. Seeing people inherit a good living instead of earning one is something that bothers me. Whether it be falling into the family farm or having connected parents place them into roles they don't deserve. My generalization on the farmers we are generally referring to is people receiving a great living because they were born on a plot of land and have a big head from it. There is zero sympathy from me if those same people have their unearned livelihood threatened by their own support of the Republican party.

 

Not everyone fits the bill, and I may be over-generalizing, but the point stands that Republican voters should take a hard look at what they are actually voting for.

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7 minutes ago, mrandyk said:

I was quite a few beers deep last night. Very eloquent thought there. Love getting back online in the morning and wondering why I thought I should share whatever I did.

 

Response was meant for the posts regarding farmers screwing themselves by voting Republican, while holding a holier than thou attitude. Seeing people inherit a good living instead of earning one is something that bothers me. Whether it be falling into the family farm or having connected parents place them into roles they don't deserve. My generalization on the farmers we are generally referring to is people receiving a great living because they were born on a plot of land and have a big head from it. There is zero sympathy from me if those same people have their unearned livelihood threatened by their own support of the Republican party.

 

Not everyone fits the bill, and I may be over-generalizing, but the point stands that Republican voters should take a hard look at what they are actually voting for.

I think I get your point.  I've had quite the FB discussion with one of my cousin's kids this morning.

 

CliffNotes:

We agreed the government is in debt and money for the wall would add to deficit.

We agree healthcare options are way to expensive for normal families.

We agree that sometimes the government needs to spend money they don't have and hope for a return on the investment.

 

Her stance:  Spend money we don't have on a wall to make healthcare cheaper for all.

Also her stance:  Do not spend money we don't have on healthcare to make healthcare cheaper for all

 

Wasn't sure where to go, except the beer fridge, after we established that....

 

 

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On 1/12/2019 at 1:06 AM, mrandyk said:

Lotta mentions about farmers here. I grew up on a farm, it's still in the family. All that I've really got to say is f#&% farmers. No one should inherit their livelihood. Zero sympathy from me if those people are impacted by...anything.

Wow....that’s a pretty pathetic attitude.   

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