The Republican Utopia

[ZRod]

15 hours ago, BigRedBuster said:

I wonder why the republicans disrespect the military so much. 

 

 

 

And yet yet they support a draft dodger with bone spurs. 

 

Happy New Year. 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't McChrystal very well liked by the troops, the media, and GOP before he resigned? Even after he resigned I think he was still a favorite of conservatives.

[BigRedBuster]

24 minutes ago, ZRod said:

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't McChrystal very well liked by the troops, the media, and GOP before he resigned? Even after he resigned I think he was still a favorite of conservatives.

 

Hell yes, they supported and liked him.  It wasn't till he criticized their dear leader that it was fashionable to turn on him.

 

 

[BigRedBuster]

Yeah. Education isn’t important. 

 

 

[Danny Bateman]

Seems about right.

 

 

[TGHusker]

On 1/3/2019 at 6:51 AM, BigRedBuster said:

Yeah. Education isn’t important. 

 

 

In this case, ignorance isn't bliss ...  it is dangerous.   The guy is an idiot.  Just cannot believe anyone wt an ounce of smarts could sit by in his cabinet and put up with this crap day by day.   Thus the conclusion is - there remains no one in his cabinet wt an ounce worth of smarts.   The Soviet Empire dissolved for a number of reasons - Afgan was only a small part of it.  The combined efforts of the US and OPEC (primarily Saudi) to force oil prices lower, plus the build up of USA military, tech etc and the Soviets inability to keep up, plus a broken, unproductive economic system, plus the moral bankruptcy of the system and a Pope from Poland who inspired change within the masses, plus the work of US allies like Margret Thatcher.  And as the tweet notes, Russia invaded Afgan to hold up one of its puppet leaders and the people of Afgan, including the Taliban who we supported at the time rose up against their puppet.   Trump is proving to be Putin's useful idiot - I see his attempts to withdraw from Syria as falling into the Russian play book.  He gets on Obama because of Obama's 'timeline' and Trump does the same thing - probably under Putin's direction. This guy has no right to be within a mile of the White House much less sitting in the oval office. What a shame

[RedDenver]

10 hours ago, TGHusker said:

In this case, ignorance isn't bliss ...  it is dangerous.   The guy is an idiot.  Just cannot believe anyone wt an ounce of smarts could sit by in his cabinet and put up with this crap day by day.   Thus the conclusion is - there remains no one in his cabinet wt an ounce worth of smarts.   The Soviet Empire dissolved for a number of reasons - Afgan was only a small part of it.  The combined efforts of the US and OPEC (primarily Saudi) to force oil prices lower, plus the build up of USA military, tech etc and the Soviets inability to keep up, plus a broken, unproductive economic system, plus the moral bankruptcy of the system and a Pope from Poland who inspired change within the masses, plus the work of US allies like Margret Thatcher.  And as the tweet notes, Russia invaded Afgan to hold up one of its puppet leaders and the people of Afgan, including the Taliban who we supported at the time rose up against their puppet.   Trump is proving to be Putin's useful idiot - I see his attempts to withdraw from Syria as falling into the Russian play book.  He gets on Obama because of Obama's 'timeline' and Trump does the same thing - probably under Putin's direction. This guy has no right to be within a mile of the White House much less sitting in the oval office. What a shame

Plus the Soviet people rebelling against an authoritarian state.

[Danny Bateman]

Tom recommended reading this recently and I finally had time to get around to it this weekend.

 

Absolutely agree this is worth a read wherever you fall on the political spectrum, especially for those amenable to the pre-Trump version of the GOP. Definitely a bit dense but I agreed with almost every bit of it. This piece recognizes, rather than minimizes, the abject failings of modern conservatism. Being that it's arguing for a complete revamp of the GOP away from libertarianism and angry social conservatism and towards inclusive center-right policies, I also agree with its critique of liberals.

 

If the GOP modeled itself after the small-r republican ideas espoused in this piece, even I would feel welcome in that party. But they're just wildly careening in the opposite direction and barreling towards the end of the tracks up ahead.

 

 

A selected passage:

 

Quote

One thing is for sure: It's not a quick fix. The challenge that faces any effort to reconstruct the American right is immense. The Republican Party at present is overwhelmingly under the spell of Donald Trump and seems determined to plumb the depths of intellectual and moral self-abasement in the service of a cult of personality. Between this point and the opportunity for any real renewal likely lies sustained electoral failure at the hands of the Democrats. Only repeated repudiation at the polls can break the hold of the populist demagoguery and extreme negative partisanship that has led the Republican Party so badly astray.

 

If the laws of political gravity have not been abolished altogether, though, the Republican Party's day of reckoning will come. Indeed, there could be repeated days of reckoning over extended election cycles. In which case, there will be an opportunity for different voices to be heard and new directions to be explored. Will that opportunity translate into real renewal on the right, or just a temporary respite in a downward spiral? The answer turns on whether the appropriate alternative vision is there to seize the moment — one whose ideas are sound and matched to the times, with a larger framing that connects emotionally and intellectually with party regulars and ordinary voters.

 

The impetus for such changes will not come from today's Republican establishment, or from the right-wing media complex. A new intellectual movement — one that firmly opposes itself to both ethno-nationalism and plutocracy and offers an appealing vision in their place — is the most promising vehicle for generating and articulating new ideas.

 

For all those whose home could only be on the right and yet are now politically homeless, it's time to move past bemoaning what you have lost. It's time to build a new home.

He just gets so much correct with this piece of writing. I'll be looking for more from the Niskansen Center if they advocate for reforming the Republican Party, as our democracy badly needs it.

 

Edit: Off the top of my hea, @JJ Husker @BigRedBuster @TGHusker you would all probably enjoy this piece.

[BigRedBuster]

 

[knapplc]

Responding to this part of @Clifford Franklin 's post:

 

Quote

 

One thing is for sure: It's not a quick fix. The challenge that faces any effort to reconstruct the American right is immense. The Republican Party at present is overwhelmingly under the spell of Donald Trump and seems determined to plumb the depths of intellectual and moral self-abasement in the service of a cult of personality. Between this point and the opportunity for any real renewal likely lies sustained electoral failure at the hands of the Democrats. Only repeated repudiation at the polls can break the hold of the populist demagoguery and extreme negative partisanship that has led the Republican Party so badly astray.

 

If the laws of political gravity have not been abolished altogether, though, the Republican Party's day of reckoning will come. Indeed, there could be repeated days of reckoning over extended election cycles. In which case, there will be an opportunity for different voices to be heard and new directions to be explored. Will that opportunity translate into real renewal on the right, or just a temporary respite in a downward spiral? The answer turns on whether the appropriate alternative vision is there to seize the moment — one whose ideas are sound and matched to the times, with a larger framing that connects emotionally and intellectually with party regulars and ordinary voters.

 

The impetus for such changes will not come from today's Republican establishment, or from the right-wing media complex. A new intellectual movement — one that firmly opposes itself to both ethno-nationalism and plutocracy and offers an appealing vision in their place — is the most promising vehicle for generating and articulating new ideas.

 

For all those whose home could only be on the right and yet are now politically homeless, it's time to move past bemoaning what you have lost. It's time to build a new home.

 

 

Already most of America has gone away from self-identifying as Republican. They are a minority party, and risk becoming even more marginalized as their rhetoric continues to spiral further away from the beliefs of mainstream America. 

 

A recent Gallup poll shows that only 26% of Americans self-identify as Republicans. That's pretty shocking, but really it follows the trend started in 2004 as America was repulsed by the abuse of 9/11 by a Republican regime to engage in two dubious and costly wars, and continues as a governing policy of "owning the libs" doesn't really solve the problems facing our country.

 

 

 

[Danny Bateman]

22 minutes ago, knapplc said:

Responding to this part of @Clifford Franklin 's post:

 

 

Already most of America has gone away from self-identifying as Republican. They are a minority party, and risk becoming even more marginalized as their rhetoric continues to spiral further away from the beliefs of mainstream America. 

  

A recent Gallup poll shows that only 26% of Americans self-identify as Republicans. That's pretty shocking, but really it follows the trend started in 2004 as America was repulsed by the abuse of 9/11 by a Republican regime to engage in two dubious and costly wars, and continues as a governing policy of "owning the libs" doesn't really solve the problems facing our country.

  

 

 

 

I wish we knew how much of that 42% independent share reliably leaned one way or the other. IIRC I've heard that the majority of independents still vote pretty consistently for one party or the other and true unaffiliated independents without a preference are a smaller slice of the pie. I suppose that makes sense. The more people who rationally consider candidates on their merits and vote accordingly the better, IMO.

 

But nonetheless - we badly need a responsible, sane, accepting, compassionate center-right party to claw back control of the GOP from the Trumpists and the Tea Partiers. I've done some reading on this - actual conservatives grew increasingly disenchanted with the GOP for failing to achieve their agenda. It began with Goldwater and continued on (even through Reagan) until W Bush. He actually wanted to become that compassionate center-right party he felt America needed and expand the GOP tent, but McCain occupied the center-right lane so W shifted further right to appeal to conservative GOP voters. His policies ultimately slid further right over time and in 2004 he had given up the center-right schtick to double down on his conservatism. Conservatives continued asserting their importance with Palin, the Tea Party and ultimately solidified their grasp on the party with the election of Trump.

 

Point is though that our country badly needs a rebooted GOP that tries to appeal to the majority of America instead of the lunatic fringe conservatives under the spell of Fox News and talk radio who currently control their party.

[TGHusker]

On ‎1‎/‎4‎/‎2019 at 10:11 PM, RedDenver said:

Plus the Soviet people rebelling against an authoritarian state.

YEP

[TGHusker]

40 minutes ago, Clifford Franklin said:

 

I wish we knew how much of that 42% independent share reliably leaned one way or the other. IIRC I've heard that the majority of independents still vote pretty consistently for one party or the other and true unaffiliated independents without a preference are a smaller slice of the pie. I suppose that makes sense. The more people who rationally consider candidates on their merits and vote accordingly the better, IMO.

 

But nonetheless - we badly need a responsible, sane, accepting, compassionate center-right party to claw back control of the GOP from the Trumpists and the Tea Partiers. I've done some reading on this - actual conservatives grew increasingly disenchanted with the GOP for failing to achieve their agenda. It began with Goldwater and continued on (even through Reagan) until W Bush. He actually wanted to become that compassionate center-right party he felt America needed and expand the GOP tent, but McCain occupied the center-right lane so W shifted further right to appeal to conservative GOP voters. His policies ultimately slid further right over time and in 2004 he had given up the center-right schtick to double down on his conservatism. Conservatives continued asserting their importance with Palin, the Tea Party and ultimately solidified their grasp on the party with the election of Trump.

 

Point is though that our country badly needs a rebooted GOP that tries to appeal to the majority of America instead of the lunatic fringe conservatives under the spell of Fox News and talk radio who currently control their party.

Agreed and I think the Dem party is in danger of doing the same thing the other direction.  Polarization to the max.  Seems to me so much more could be accomplished if the center left and center right could gain control and work together. 

[BigRedBuster]

What a lying piece of crap. 

 

 

[mrandyk]

11 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said:

What a lying piece of crap. 

 

 

I think more notable than Trump making s#!t up, simply because his supporters will believe it, is that he apparently has had no real contact with any of his predecessors. Who else has done that? Why wouldn't you seek advice from those who have held this impossible position?

 

I know the answer, but it helps paint the picture of just how insane this administration has been. I still can't believe anyone voted for this twat.

[BigRedBuster]

2 minutes ago, mrandyk said:

I think more notable than Trump making s#!t up, simply because his supporters will believe it, is that he apparently has had no real contact with any of his predecessors. Who else has done that? Why wouldn't you seek advice from those who have held this impossible position?

 

I know the answer, but it helps paint the picture of just how insane this administration has been. I still can't believe anyone voted for this twat.

Well, I’ll answer even though you know. 

 

He he thinks he’s so much smarter than everyone else and his ego just won’t let him ask.