Danny Bateman Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 16 minutes ago, Frott Scost said: Manchin is a DINO. Its no secret. He votes with Trump all the time. Idk why Im the bad guy who points it out. And Im also apparently the bad guy who points out that he ALWAYS takes the side of the coal barons and not the coal workers. I wonder why that is? Youre right, winning the primary is diff than the general. Most dems dont even bother to campaign in WV bc of past history. Sanders is diff and has said he would use a 50 state strategy and if you actually watch the video I posted he got a room full of Trump supporters to applaud his agenda. Were you born yesterday? The health insurance industry and pharma industry spent 60 million dollars over the past couple months attacking MFA and it still polls at 60%. Jesus christ man you think they havent been using attack ads. Every debate there is an attack ad during commercial break. Its not working. People are tired of being f#&%ed over! Sanders is a DINO. He literally only becomes a Democrat in election years so he can use their party platform to advance his own campaign. You can take potshots at Manchin all you want but you will need people like him to support the things you want. Sanders cannot govern by decree. You're going to have to get people you disagree with to come around or you'll be doing a whole lot of nothing. I think you're nuts if you think Bernie comes anywhere close in West Virginia. Maybe. A populist could probably outperform a generic moderate Dem there - en route to losing by 20 or 25 points. Ironically enough, the last time WV went blue it was to vote for the original third-way blue dog, Bill Clinton. Do you think maybe there is a reason Trump props up Sanders? Why he continually pushes the narrative that Sanders is getting screwed? Perhaps he wants a shot to attack Sanders agenda in earnest himself, in lockstep with the entire GOP? So they can portray themselves as the vanguard between voters and a socialist takeover of everything? Does that seem plausible to you? If you think Sanders and his plans have been seriously attacked to this point you are kidding yourself. I'm sorry if I come off as the bad guy, too. But no one around here seems to want to play Devil's advocate and consider the potential downsides of Bernie heading up a ticket. I guess it'll have to be me. 1 1 Link to comment
Ratt Mhule Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 11 minutes ago, Danny Bateman said: Sanders is a DINO. He literally only becomes a Democrat in election years so he can use their party platform to advance his own campaign. You can take potshots at Manchin all you want but you will need people like him to support the things you want. Sanders cannot govern by decree. You're going to have to get people you disagree with to come around or you'll be doing a whole lot of nothing. I think you're nuts if you think Bernie comes anywhere close in West Virginia. Maybe. A populist could probably outperform a generic moderate Dem there - en route to losing by 20 or 25 points. Ironically enough, the last time WV went blue it was to vote for the original third-way blue dog, Bill Clinton. Do you think maybe there is a reason Trump props up Sanders? Why he continually pushes the narrative that Sanders is getting screwed? Perhaps he wants a shot to attack Sanders agenda in earnest himself, in lockstep with the entire GOP? So they can portray themselves as the vanguard between voters and a socialist takeover of everything? Does that seem plausible to you? If you think Sanders and his plans have been seriously attacked to this point you are kidding yourself. I'm sorry if I come off as the bad guy, too. But no one around here seems to want to play Devil's advocate and consider the potential downsides of Bernie heading up a ticket. I guess it'll have to be me. Yeah hes an independent which is why he appeals to the folks that hate the system, like me. Which is the majority of the country. Just like Trump did. Trump ran to the left of Hilary on multiple issues (war, trade, criminal justice, even healthcare at times). Maybe because left wing ideas are popular? Trump is literally on tape saying he didnt want Clinton to pick Sanders as her VP because he took many Sanders supporters in the rust belt. There were more Sanders supporters who flipped to Trump in WI, MI and PA than the amount of votes he won by. He wants those votes again. How do you do that? By pissing off Sanders supporters saying the dems screwed him. Idk how anyone cant see whats happening. He wants those people to vote for him again because if they vote for Biden he will lose. Link to comment
Danny Bateman Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 9 hours ago, Frott Scost said: Yeah hes an independent which is why he appeals to the folks that hate the system, like me. Which is the majority of the country. Just like Trump did. Trump ran to the left of Hilary on multiple issues (war, trade, criminal justice, even healthcare at times). Maybe because left wing ideas are popular? Trump is literally on tape saying he didnt want Clinton to pick Sanders as her VP because he took many Sanders supporters in the rust belt. There were more Sanders supporters who flipped to Trump in WI, MI and PA than the amount of votes he won by. He wants those votes again. How do you do that? By pissing off Sanders supporters saying the dems screwed him. Idk how anyone cant see whats happening. He wants those people to vote for him again because if they vote for Biden he will lose. Saying he did not want to face a unity ticket in 2016 =/= saying he's afraid to run against Sanders at the top of the ticket. It's very obvious what Trump is doing. Sanders supporters are extremely sensitive to the charge they're getting screwed because they're convinced the system is out to get them. We can only hope that should Bernie find a way to lose the nomination a good chunk of them will support whomever won it instead of opting for another four years of burning everything down with Trump. 8 hours ago, BlitzFirst said: You kind of have to be elected to try and influence those things. Asking them to influence it during a primary is kind of short sighted don't you think? If you look at Bernie's record, he's worked with Republicans to get things done. Him saying he's fighting the establishment which is trying to bully the common person isn't saying he won't work well with others. Sanders doesn't have to do anything but win the nomination. He doesn't have to get 4+ seats elected. He just has to show Washington that people want a change. The rest will follow. I'm just looking at what little data we have about the effectiveness of Bernie's revolution. It's the only thing concrete we can base the discussion on. Let's be real: Things are a whole lot different when you're about to assume the presidency than when you're a gadfly senator from Vermont with some unorthodox ideas even most of your caucus does not share. Remember how McConnell began plotting how to obstruct every single thing Obama did and vowed making him a one-termer was his greatest priority before he was even inaugurated? I would not suspect Bernie would receive any different treatment. I would submit Sanders winning the whole thing would definitely send a message about change (or the desire to dump Trump) but asking him to go into his first term without control of Congress will severely handicap his agenda right from the jump. Change will not happen because the GOP will not allow it to happen. Link to comment
Ratt Mhule Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 2 hours ago, Danny Bateman said: Saying he did not want to face a unity ticket in 2016 =/= saying he's afraid to run against Sanders at the top of the ticket. It's very obvious what Trump is doing. Sanders supporters are extremely sensitive to the charge they're getting screwed because they're convinced the system is out to get them. We can only hope that should Bernie find a way to lose the nomination a good chunk of them will support whomever won it instead of opting for another four years of burning everything down with Trump. He will not be the nominee. Its not a conspiracy theory they literally said last week they will take it from him at the convention and they know it risks the party being fractured but are okay with it. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2020/02/27/us/politics/democratic-superdelegates.amp.html This whole thing is just a test on how corrupt the democrats actually are. They are proving they, like the republicans, will do whatever they can to keep this system in place. Donors would rather have Trump than Sanders because they still make money with Trump. This is not debateable they have said it. As far as Sanders voters falling in line Im sure some will vote for Biden. Some will prob vote for Trump. Most will stay home. Dems know this and they dont care. Link to comment
Danny Bateman Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 26 minutes ago, Frott Scost said: He will not be the nominee. Its not a conspiracy theory they literally said last week they will take it from him at the convention and they know it risks the party being fractured but are okay with it. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2020/02/27/us/politics/democratic-superdelegates.amp.html This whole thing is just a test on how corrupt the democrats actually are. They are proving they, like the republicans, will do whatever they can to keep this system in place. Donors would rather have Trump than Sanders because they still make money with Trump. This is not debateable they have said it. As far as Sanders voters falling in line Im sure some will vote for Biden. Some will prob vote for Trump. Most will stay home. Dems know this and they dont care. Shocker. Loyal Democrats do not want to see someone whose politics they do not share take control of the party and proceed to get spanked by Trump. Are you surprised Blankfein would not be enthused about Bernie? I believe the Sanders camp official response was "we welcome their hatred." Of course Blankfein does not want to see someone he thinks would tank the economy take office over a buffoon he thinks has had economic successes. As right as he seems to you, there are people out there who believe Sanders doesn't know what the heck he is talking about regarding the economy. I will say I am not someone who loves Sanders by any stretch but will happily vote for him if he is the nominee. At the same time it does get tiresome of hearing how anyone who doesn't support him without exception is somehow corrupt or doing so with ill intentions. 3 1 Link to comment
funhusker Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 3 minutes ago, Danny Bateman said: Shocker. Loyal Democrats do not want to see someone whose politics they do not share take control of the party and proceed to get spanked by Trump. Are you surprised Blankfein would not be enthused about Bernie? I believe the Sanders camp official response was "we welcome their hatred." Of course Blankfein does not want to see someone he thinks would tank the economy take office over a buffoon he thinks has had economic successes. As right as he seems to you, there are people out there who believe Sanders doesn't know what the heck he is talking about regarding the economy. I will say I am not someone who loves Sanders by any stretch but will happily vote for him if he is the nominee. At the same time it does get tiresome of hearing how anyone who doesn't support him without exception is somehow corrupt or doing so with ill intentions. Thank you... Link to comment
Moiraine Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 29 minutes ago, Danny Bateman said: Shocker. Loyal Democrats do not want to see someone whose politics they do not share take control of the party and proceed to get spanked by Trump. The topic was not voting for Sanders against Trump. This statement is illogical in response to that. 1 Link to comment
commando Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 34 minutes ago, Danny Bateman said: Shocker. Loyal Democrats do not want to see someone whose politics they do not share take control of the party and proceed to get spanked by Trump. Are you surprised Blankfein would not be enthused about Bernie? I believe the Sanders camp official response was "we welcome their hatred." Of course Blankfein does not want to see someone he thinks would tank the economy take office over a buffoon he thinks has had economic successes. As right as he seems to you, there are people out there who believe Sanders doesn't know what the heck he is talking about regarding the economy. I will say I am not someone who loves Sanders by any stretch but will happily vote for him if he is the nominee. At the same time it does get tiresome of hearing how anyone who doesn't support him without exception is somehow corrupt or doing so with ill intentions. i am tired of that attitude after the last few years of our current potus and his yipping lap dogs. Link to comment
Danny Bateman Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 2 minutes ago, Moiraine said: The topic was not voting for Sanders against Trump. This statement is illogical in response to that. In what way? Not wanting Sanders to be the nominee =/= not voting for him. And I presume someone like Lloyd Blankfein does not represent the median Democrat. Link to comment
Moiraine Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 18 minutes ago, Danny Bateman said: In what way? Not wanting Sanders to be the nominee =/= not voting for him. And I presume someone like Lloyd Blankfein does not represent the median Democrat. You’re replying to a post about a Democrat thinking of voting for Trump over Sanders. Link to comment
sho Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 1 minute ago, teachercd said: Amy out...endorsing Biden? Wonder if that's for a promise for a cabinet position? Link to comment
FrantzHardySwag Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 2 minutes ago, sho said: Wonder if that's for a promise for a cabinet position? If Bloomberg truly doesn’t want Bernie he would be smart to drop out, Biden seems to be unifying the Centrist movement under one flag. Link to comment
Danny Bateman Posted March 2, 2020 Share Posted March 2, 2020 5 minutes ago, Moiraine said: You’re replying to a post about a Democrat thinking of voting for Trump over Sanders. I know but I guess I'm not sure what your original response to me was supposed to mean. Link to comment
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