BigRedBuster Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 5 minutes ago, NM11046 said: If he does there are already a couple HB members in his camp. I'm so heartbroken to see some of you interested in him after what we've been through for 2 years. OH give me a break. It's about a year and a half till the election. I think it's pretty sad that already people are fighting against certain candidates based on party affiliation....or lack there of. Here's an idea, let's listen to ideas and make decisions based on that. OR....how about the Dems put up some people who would appeal to moderates???? It's a novel Idea....I know. 1 Link to comment
TheSker Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 11 hours ago, RedDenver said: A majority of Americans don't think the 70% sounds crazy and are in fact in favor of it. Poll: A majority of Americans support raising the top tax rate to 70 percent I find it hard to imagine an easier decision than voting how to spend someone else's dime. Link to comment
NM11046 Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 38 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said: OH give me a break. It's about a year and a half till the election. I think it's pretty sad that already people are fighting against certain candidates based on party affiliation....or lack there of. Here's an idea, let's listen to ideas and make decisions based on that. OR....how about the Dems put up some people who would appeal to moderates???? It's a novel Idea....I know. Not at all fighting against anyone based on party affiliation - content bro. Intent, experience, what the guy is saying should be enough. The only party issue is that when it comes time someone like this, who has about zero chance of winning will only disrupt and create a situation where votes cast for him will impact outcomes, and as we've seen (going back to Perot and the most recent example who is sitting in DC right now with only 3 things on his agenda today from 11:45 until 4pm, tweeting about last nights Fox newscast) not always in a good way. 3 Link to comment
TGHusker Posted January 31, 2019 Author Share Posted January 31, 2019 44 minutes ago, NM11046 said: If he does there are already a couple HB members in his camp. I'm so heartbroken to see some of you interested in him after what we've been through for 2 years. Please, please dig in to what he is saying - it's got zero substance. Zero. This is truly a vanity project and America can't take 4 more years of that, regardless of the party affiliation (or lack of) associated with the candidate. You are smart people. I know last time we debated the value of a vote, and in some situations how voting for the "lesser of two evils" and that got us this frickin' mess. Your vote counts, and you have to think beyond simplistic "he says what I like". Those that said a vote for Jill Stein or Gary what his name were not wasted were proven wrong. This a$$hat is going to do the same thing - don't fall for it. The biggest supporter of this man and his campaign so far? Steve Schmidt. Yes, that SS. The one that has so eloquently spoken up against Trump, the one who dramatically left the Republican party after a lifetime of service because of Trump. The one that handpicked and supporter Sarah Palin as VP candidate for John McCain and took the man's presidential aspirations down the tube. Yet this choice may be worse than Palin, and one has to wonder his motivation. Do you trust the man who one could argue turned the tone on politics into what it is today? Palin became the tv darling because of her catch phrases and personality, not because of her knowledge or ability or history of experience. And ultimatley her absolute lack of appropriateness for the role took the race away from an otherwise qualified, deserving man. Wealth does not equal intelligence, or an understanding of governing. Wealth does not necessarily come from being a good business man/woman (see current POTUS). Being a good business man/woman does not mean someone will make a good leader. Wealth does however breed ego, and an ability to surround oneself with people who support your thoughts no matter the content. Wealth does seem to give some the security to assume the best in someone - god knows why. This man is an asinine joke. And he's preying on the American people with this joke of a candidacy. NM - a bit of an over reaction at this point We are in a very fluid time. Who I back in the end may change 2 or 3 times before then. If he can moderate the discussion some what and challenge the Dems to think of more than just their base - - then he could be a good influence. If it came down to the point where he plays only a spoiler role which automatically elects Trump - then no - I won't vote for him at that point. But if he can draw more moderate and right leaning Never Trumpers 2.1 away from Trump then it also serves the purpose. Because he comes across as more fiscally conservative - I think he would draw more GOP voters then Dem voters in spite of what Trump says. 1 Link to comment
Guy Chamberlin Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 46 minutes ago, TheSker said: I find it hard to imagine an easier decision than voting how to spend someone else's dime. True. That kind of vote is pretty much class warfare theater. But the weird part is how we supposedly vote to spend our own money as taxpayers, but it's never a line item choice, and our elected representatives on both sides rarely align with how we'd prefer the government to spend our money. 1 Link to comment
Whistlebritches Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 If Schultz really wants to do everything possible to remove Trump from office then he will join a party and go through the primary process. I understand that he doesn't line up real well with either party right now but if he truly thinks that running as an independent is going to remove Trump from office he's not smart enough for the job. HOWARD SCHULTZ, FMR. STARBUCKS CEO, INDEPENDENT CANDIDATE FOR PRESIDENT: I've spent the last almost 40 years building the kind of company which we serve people, 100 million customers a week. We employ almost 400,000 people. I’ve spent my entire career building consensus, creating imagination and innovation and working well with people on both sides of the aisle. President Trump to me is not the litmus test for the presidency and not the litmus test for what I'm going to try and do. What I will say is I'm going to do everything I can to remove President Trump from office. 3 Link to comment
TGHusker Posted January 31, 2019 Author Share Posted January 31, 2019 also to the above - if Kasich or Romney (but not both which would split their primary vote) happen to challenge Trump in the primaries - then I think it will be a mute point - the discussion of Schultz. I would love a one on one primary season between Trump and Kasich or Romney- Trump wouldn't be able to pick off his opponents one by one with his rope a dope tactics. Both are too ethical, too compassionate & too knowledgeable for Trump's verbal assaults to be seen as valid. Either one is our real Obi-Wan Kenobi in my opinion. Let's hope one of them considers the race. The other ace in the hole - Mr Mueller. Link to comment
NM11046 Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 14 minutes ago, TGHusker said: NM - a bit of an over reaction at this point We are in a very fluid time. Who I back in the end may change 2 or 3 times before then. If he can moderate the discussion some what and challenge the Dems to think of more than just their base - - then he could be a good influence. If it came down to the point where he plays only a spoiler role which automatically elects Trump - then no - I won't vote for him at that point. But if he can draw more moderate and right leaning Never Trumpers 2.1 away from Trump then it also serves the purpose. Because he comes across as more fiscally conservative - I think he would draw more GOP voters then Dem voters in spite of what Trump says. Very fair and very rational TG. Sorry for the drama. I guess my concern is that he's making very broad statements, and tearing down those of others (most recently it was Warren and Cortez I think) without providing specifics as to his solution. I just don't see the "why" ... you don't decide at that age and point in your career that you want to be POTUS. I want to see years of community involvement and service, learning from doing etc. Maybe Trump's ruined it for a lot of strong potential candidates, but I don't believe someone like this has anything other than selfish reasons for putting themselves in the race. I don't know if its boredom, ego, whatever, it's not because they want to give back and do right by the American people. If he's smart man, he's looked at the data and history and to @Whistlebritches point above, he knows his candidacy is going to result in exactly what he claims to be running for. 1 Link to comment
Moiraine Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 1 hour ago, TheSker said: I find it hard to imagine an easier decision than voting how to spend someone else's dime. It’s one of the most complex topics there is, and it’s what every discussion on taxes is about. No one discussing taxes doesn’t also pay taxes. I would argue that a part of why someone is able to make $10M per year is because we have safety nets. Also, people making that much $ are able to push through policy that benefits no one but the people making that amount of $. There has to be something to offset that. In some cases it allows them to endanger people’s health or lives. Link to comment
TheSker Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 23 minutes ago, Guy Chamberlin said: True. That kind of vote is pretty much class warfare theater. But the weird part is how we supposedly vote to spend our own money as taxpayers, but it's never a line item choice, and our elected representatives on both sides rarely align with how we'd prefer the government to spend our money. Totally agree. I believe there are more efficient and effective ways to aid than putting the partisan, inefficient government in charge of societal needs. Link to comment
BigRedBuster Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 3 minutes ago, Moiraine said: No one discussing taxes doesn’t also pay taxes. Depends on specific taxes. Not everyone discussing income taxes...pays income tax. Link to comment
Moiraine Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 Just now, BigRedBuster said: Depends on specific taxes. Not everyone discussing income taxes...pays income tax. I’m aware of that Link to comment
TGHusker Posted January 31, 2019 Author Share Posted January 31, 2019 10 minutes ago, NM11046 said: Very fair and very rational TG. Sorry for the drama. I guess my concern is that he's making very broad statements, and tearing down those of others (most recently it was Warren and Cortez I think) without providing specifics as to his solution. I just don't see the "why" ... you don't decide at that age and point in your career that you want to be POTUS. I want to see years of community involvement and service, learning from doing etc. Maybe Trump's ruined it for a lot of strong potential candidates, but I don't believe someone like this has anything other than selfish reasons for putting themselves in the race. I don't know if its boredom, ego, whatever, it's not because they want to give back and do right by the American people. If he's smart man, he's looked at the data and history and to @Whistlebritches point above, he knows his candidacy is going to result in exactly what he claims to be running for. Would you say the same thing if Opra decided to jump in as an indep - she would be the darling of the left and would split the Dem vote?? I also prefer that the WH is not used for on the job training. However, we've had a few non-political guys become WH trainees who fared pretty well: U.S Grant, Ike, Wilson (the founder basically of the progressive movement). Grant and Ike were military leaders and that helped their learning curve but Wilson came from academia. Trump was just the wrong guy to 're-start' the trend of non-politicals getting into the WH. Link to comment
TheSker Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 4 minutes ago, Moiraine said: No one discussing taxes doesn’t also pay taxes. That's not entirely correct. Link to comment
Moiraine Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 1 minute ago, TheSker said: That's not entirely correct. Who doesn’t pay taxes? Link to comment
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