The 2020 Presidential Election - Convention & General Election

[Moiraine]

8 hours ago, BlitzFirst said:

I gave an example outside what Biden was talking about to show that HIS GENERALIZATION didn't fit.  Then you come back with another generalization to try and say that I made some kind of judgement based on my personal experience.  I didn't.  I gave an example to show that Biden was being stereotypical only and that there are plenty of examples outside of the box he constructed.  Please don't read into it.

 

 

You didn’t show that his generalization “didn’t fit.” All generalizations have examples that the generalization doesn’t apply to. In general, FBS teams beat FCS teams. When an FCS team wins it doesn’t show the generalization was wrong.

 

You’d have to show he’s wrong with numbers rather than just saying you know some people. On the other hand, I’m guessing Biden has no idea whether it’s right, either. Not arguing that what he said was good, just arguing about generalizations. They aren’t inherently bad. 

[teachercd]

28 minutes ago, Moiraine said:

 

 

You didn’t show that his generalization “didn’t fit.” All generalizations have examples that the generalization doesn’t apply to. In general, FBS teams beat FCS teams. When an FCS team wins it doesn’t show the generalization was wrong.

 

You’d have to show he’s wrong with numbers rather than just saying you know some people. On the other hand, I’m guessing Biden has no idea whether it’s right, either. Not arguing that what he said was good, just arguing about generalizations. They aren’t inherently bad. 

Amen

[Nebfanatic]

1 hour ago, knapplc said:

 

I'm not of the camp who believes every ham handed promise to help disadvantaged POC is racist.

Biden has a history of believing in preconcieved notions about people of color. It is a form of racism and its important we recognize it. Not all racism is overt. Not all racism is intentional. His mental slip ups just show us what he thinks really. It isn't malicious, more of a white knight syndrome thing but still superiority complex is there.

[Moiraine]

1 hour ago, BlitzFirst said:

 

When someone says "all X subset of people are lazy" the response is "I know plenty of X that aren't lazy".

 

Those aren't two generalizations.  It's a generalization followed by a reason the generalization is wrong.

 

 

Neither of those is a generalization. The first is a stereotype. The 2nd is an anecdote. What Biden said was a generalization. He clearly doesn’t think what he said is true for all Black families seeing as he was Obama’s vice president. His comment was stupid but you’re equating generalization with stereotype and they aren’t the same.

 

You can definitely use an anecdote to prove your example statement wrong, but not Biden’s. 

[RedDenver]

6 hours ago, knapplc said:

 

I'm not of the camp who believes every ham handed promise to help disadvantaged POC is racist.

I'm not of the camp that brushes off racial prejudice as a "ham handed promise to help". This article does a good job looking at the issue:

https://theintercept.com/2019/09/13/joe-biden-democratic-debate-slavery/

Quote

Nikole Hannah-Jones, a journalist leading the New York Times Magazine’s “1619 Project” on the legacy of 400 years of slavery and its aftermath in America, said that Biden’s remark was revealing. “He talked about poverty, social workers needing to help families raise their kids and debunked science on vocab deficits,” she said. “He assumed we’d all understand he meant black folks even without saying — as if black is synonymous with poverty/dysfunction.”

 

[knapplc]

Listen, if we're calling Joe Biden "racist" now, just about every single politician older than, say, 30 years old is racist.

 

I mean... I don't care if you're going to vote for the guy in the primary or not - I'm not - but let's calm down a little with the "R" word.

[RedDenver]

2 minutes ago, knapplc said:

Listen, if we're calling Joe Biden "racist" now, just about every single politician older than, say, 30 years old is racist.

 

I mean... I don't care if you're going to vote for the guy in the primary or not - I'm not - but let's calm down a little with the "R" word.

This isn't the first time Biden has done racist stuff. He was in hot water just a couple months ago for his comments about segregationist politicians. And there's this from the above link:

Quote

 

Biden’s political approach to race has long been geared toward assuaging the racial anxieties of white voters. Biden has even deployed his — at best — racial insensitivity toward Barack Obama himself. “I mean, you got the first mainstream African-American who is articulate and bright and clean and a nice-looking guy,” Biden declared in 2007. It’s an irony that he was added to Obama’s ticket not in spite of his racial politics, but because of them.

 

“Obama,” the Times reported recently, was “deeply worried about a backlash against a black man at the top of the ticket, and believed that an older white running mate would ease fears in battleground states like Pennsylvania, Michigan and Indiana that he had lost in the primaries.”

 

He told his adviser, David Axelrod: “Barack Hussein Obama is change enough for most people.” Biden’s politics have now been laundered by his eight years serving the country’s first black president, but that doesn’t mean he’s clean.

 

 

[RedDenver]

And even if you don't care if what Biden said was racist, there's problems politically in him running against Trump:

 

[knapplc]

[Nebfanatic]

1 hour ago, knapplc said:

Listen, if we're calling Joe Biden "racist" now, just about every single politician older than, say, 30 years old is racist.

 

I mean... I don't care if you're going to vote for the guy in the primary or not - I'm not - but let's calm down a little with the "R" word.

If you're implying Bidens view is normal among most politicians I must ask, how does that help your argument? Prejudice being normal isn't really a good reason to defend it 

[knapplc]

2 minutes ago, Nebfanatic said:

If you're implying Bidens view is normal among most politicians I must ask, how does that help your argument? Prejudice being normal isn't really a good reason to defend it 

 

Because we're only calling out Biden, for some reason.

 

I'm not saying he's clean. I'm saying he's no different than anyone else. It's a weird thing to attack him on.

[Nebfanatic]

2 minutes ago, knapplc said:

 

Because we're only calling out Biden, for some reason.

 

I'm not saying he's clean. I'm saying he's no different than anyone else. It's a weird thing to attack him on.

I feel like he was being called out for his comments and you writing it off as poor mental acuity sparked a more targeted discussion, but I digress.

[RedDenver]

2 hours ago, knapplc said:

 

1 hour ago, knapplc said:

 

Because we're only calling out Biden, for some reason.

 

I'm not saying he's clean. I'm saying he's no different than anyone else. It's a weird thing to attack him on.

By all means, call out the other candidates for racism. But Biden is different than the other candidates particularly when it comes to race, which is another reason why it matters.

[mrandyk]

Biden has a black friend, he isn't racist.

[Landlord]

On 9/14/2019 at 1:34 AM, BlitzFirst said:

 

I gave an example outside what Biden was talking about to show that HIS GENERALIZATION didn't fit.  Then you come back with another generalization to try and say that I made some kind of judgement based on my personal experience.  I didn't.  I gave an example to show that Biden was being stereotypical only and that there are plenty of examples outside of the box he constructed.  Please don't read into it.

 

 

Moiraine already accurately addressed this, but just for clarification, offering anecdotal counterpoints has, literally, in the truest sense of the word, nothing at all to do with a general statement. Her FBS/FCS example was a perfect one. 

 

You responded with something like, "If someone says all _______ are X, then it's normal to respond by saying that no they're not, I know ______ who isn't." Well, Biden isn't saying anything about ALL black people.