The 2020 Presidential Election - Convention & General Election

[RedDenver]

14 minutes ago, knapplc said:

If the last four years haven't convinced you not to vote for Trump, nothing Joe Biden says will convince you.

While this might be true for you and maybe how you'd like all voters to be, it just isn't reality. And there's also a huge difference between not voting for Trump and actually voting for Biden. If you want to defeat Trump, then enough voters need to be convinced of both of those things.

[knapplc]

1 minute ago, Frott Scost said:

Most americans dont follow politics so some people might think their life has neither improved or gotten worse under Trump so they dont feel the need to vote for Biden because their life wont improve under him either. So its the job of the candidate to convince someone who normally doesnt vote or on the fence that voting for them would improve their life. People care about themselves and their families. Someone who says they will veto healthcare for all doesnt make people think their life will improve. The people on huskerboard are a different breed because we all keep up with the times for the most part. 

 

1 minute ago, RedDenver said:

While this might be true for you and maybe how you'd like all voters to be, it just isn't reality. And there's also a huge difference between not voting for Trump and actually voting for Biden. If you want to defeat Trump, then enough voters need to be convinced of both of those things.

 

When I saw that you two had quoted me within a couple seconds of each other, I knew you were congratulating me on my perspicacity.

 

 

 

We'll just have to agree to disagree on this. Clearly we are of differing opinions.

[Danny Bateman]

3 hours ago, RedDenver said:

Joe Rogan is pointing out what's obvious: Biden is having trouble with simple interviews and making basic talking points. I disagree with Rogan about rather voting for Trump, but this isn't an issue that's going to go away unless Biden starts having stronger interviews and debates.

 

There's a reason Biden doesn't want another debate. A strong candidate who's clearly winning would want the debate as another chance for publicity, to get his message out, and to take a primary victory lap.

I disagree. This narrative gets a lot of play but the online anti-Biden crowd is pretty clearly cherry-picking and sometimes selectively editing of the guy to reinforce their point. I would've thought the JoE bIdEn HaS dEmEnTiA nonsense would've died down after the last debate where Biden more than held his own against Bernie. I've never thought the latter was a terribly effective debater because all he does is pivot back to his stump speech and talking points, but I could see how others would disagree and find that style of "debate" effective. He had Bernie waving his arms around and raising his voice with just a few simple verbal jabs about dictators for crying out loud. Perhaps we should rethink the notion of a strong debater.

 

Biden doesn't want yet another debate and is beginning to vet VPs because we're in the middle of a health crisis and the primary is over. It's time to engage Trump.

[teachercd]

1 minute ago, Danny Bateman said:

I disagree. This narrative gets a lot of play but the online anti-Biden crowd is pretty clearly cherry-picking and sometimes selectively editing of the guy to reinforce their point. I would've thought the JoE bIdEn HaS dEmEnTiA nonsense would've died down after the last debate where Biden more than held his own against Bernie. I've never thought the latter was a terribly effective debater because all he does is pivot back to his stump speech and talking points, but I could see how others would disagree and find that style of "debate" effective. He had Bernie waving his arms around and raising his voice with just a few simple verbal jabs about dictators for crying out loud. Perhaps we should rethink the notion of a strong debater.

 

Biden doesn't want yet another debate and is beginning to vet VPs because we're in the middle of a health crisis and the primary is over. It's time to engage Trump.

No kidding, do some people still think Sanders is in it?  He isn't.

[Danny Bateman]

4 hours ago, Landlord said:

 

Rogan isn't libertarian, he's pretty left and he admits as much often. He gets painted as "alt-right adjacent" because he's willing to have controversial people on and be friends/cordial with people that society wants to make out to be boogeymen, but Rogan himself is pretty left. He also hasn't been employed by Dana White, or anybody, for years and years. 

 

 

That being said I haven't heard/seen the clip so I can't comment on it specifically.

 

 

 

Does he not get paid for commentating? I assumed some of those fees were paid by the UFC. Regardless the point is BIden's views are shaped in part by the company he keeps, including White.

 

I'm sorry, the notion that Rogan is any kind of leftist lost me at him saying he'd vote for Donald f#cking Trump and citing a bunch of bullsh#t as the reason why.

[knapplc]

3 minutes ago, Danny Bateman said:

Biden doesn't want yet another debate and is beginning to vet VPs because we're in the middle of a health crisis and the primary is over.

 

Yep. Biden had a good Combine. He's not going to do drills at his college Pro Day after that.

[RedDenver]

1 minute ago, Danny Bateman said:

I disagree. This narrative gets a lot of play but the online anti-Biden crowd is pretty clearly cherry-picking and sometimes selectively editing of the guy to reinforce their point. I would've thought the JoE bIdEn HaS dEmEnTiA nonsense would've died down after the last debate where Biden more than held his own against Bernie. I've never thought the latter was a terribly effective debater because all he does is pivot back to his stump speech and talking points, but I could see how others would disagree and find that style of "debate" effective. He had Bernie waving his arms around and raising his voice with just a few simple verbal jabs about dictators for crying out loud. Perhaps we should rethink the notion of a strong debater.

 

Biden doesn't want yet another debate and is beginning to vet VPs because we're in the middle of a health crisis and the primary is over. It's time to engage Trump.

I don't think Biden has dementia, but he is having trouble with basic things the President has to do like interviews and speaking. Biden did look much better in the last debate, which is why I think he should do another debate and flip that script on his issues. I agree that Bernie isn't a great debater, but I thought Biden would be and he hasn't even been as good as Bernie in this cycle IMO. Bernie always waves his arms and raises his voice, so I don't think Biden really made him do anything different.

 

[knapplc]

1 minute ago, RedDenver said:

I don't think Biden has dementia, but he is having trouble with basic things the President has to do like interviews and speaking. Biden did look much better in the last debate, which is why I think he should do another debate and flip that script on his issues. I agree that Bernie isn't a great debater, but I thought Biden would be and he hasn't even been as good as Bernie in this cycle IMO. Bernie always waves his arms and raises his voice, so I don't think Biden really made him do anything different.

 

 

Most voters aren't Bernie supporters and don't know his speaking style, so when he behaves like that in a debate he comes across angry and unlikable.

 

If Bernie wanted us to vote for him, he should have worked harder to convince us.

[Danny Bateman]

11 minutes ago, teachercd said:

No kidding, do some people still think Sanders is in it?  He isn't.

 

And thi$ i$ coming from a guy who has ab$olutely no incentive to $ay thing$ are over, right teach?

[RedDenver]

Just now, knapplc said:

 

Most voters aren't Bernie supporters and don't know his speaking style, so when he behaves like that in a debate he comes across angry and unlikable.

 

If Bernie wanted us to vote for him, he should have worked harder to convince us.

I agree. Bernie needed to run a better campaign. He had Biden on the ropes, but let him off because he never wanted to go on the offensive and attack Biden.

[knapplc]

Just now, RedDenver said:

I agree. Bernie needed to run a better campaign. He had Biden on the ropes, but let him off because he never wanted to go on the offensive and attack Biden.

 

I don't think he ever did. He was just lucky enough to have favorable early matchups. Kinda like when Nebraska started out 7-0 under Riley. It was all an illusion.

[teachercd]

9 minutes ago, Danny Bateman said:

 

And thi$ i$ coming from a guy who has ab$olutely no incentive to $ay thing$ are over, right teach?

Ha...I want my 36 dollars!!!!

[Danny Bateman]

15 minutes ago, knapplc said:

 

I don't think he ever did. He was just lucky enough to have favorable early matchups. Kinda like when Nebraska started out 7-0 under Riley. It was all an illusion.

 

Bernie's entire campaign was staked on winning a plurality of maybe 30-35% of the vote with enough moderates still in the race long enough that eventually his delegate lead became insurmountable and he pulled away.

 

Then moderates dropped out and his campaign kind of fell apart.

 

It was not a strongly run campaign. They had a legitimate strategy in place but it relied too much on the actions of others instead of expanding his own base.

[RedDenver]

Note that even Biden voters favored Medicare for All in primary exit polling. This is an example of what Biden could do if he wanted:

 

[Danny Bateman]

1 hour ago, Frott Scost said:

We tried to warn you people that Bernie does best with independents which are not able to vote in some democratic primaries. The polls showed this. It would have been a slam dunk in November but democrats wanted to listen to corporate media about how electable Biden is and now they screwed up. New poll just came out this week that shows Trump has I think it was 58% extremely excited to vote for him in November and Biden had 24% extremely excited to vote for him. People will not leave work early or stand in a long line to vote for him. The democrats made their bed in 2016 and they didnt learn and now they made their bed in 2020. Will the learn in 2024? Probably not. 

 

OK, set the enthusiasm piece aside. Point conceded - Trump's cult is extremely excited to vote for him. I'm not shocked.

 

Where is the evidence that Sanders performs best with independents by any significant margin?

 

that Here's a recent poll has Biden +11 with indies compared to Bernie in a general election. Here's one where Biden is +4 on Bernie in a general. Here's one where Bernie is up +2 over Biden with them in the primary (Biden still beats Trump by 1 with independents).

 

The evidence is a bit unclear on whether he would be better with swing voters. And Biden is outperforming him in nearly every swing state poll taken recently. Personally I don't care what coalition we cobble together, I just want the strongest candidate that will bring out the most voters.

Arizona

Florida

Florida

Michigan

North Carolina

Ohio

Pennsylvania

Wisconsin