The Democrat Utopia

[Guy Chamberlin]

1 hour ago, Redux said:

 

I have a problem with the government.  The vaccine itself isn't the issue here, the people enforcing it are.  Take it or lose your job isn't a choice for most of Americans, not the Americans that have worked through this entire pandemic.  We already have a shortage of people willing to work, the mandate will reduce that number even further.  Do you not see a problem with this?

 

Why aren't members of Congress/White house and their staffers exempt from the mandate?  Seems awfully hypocritical.  Not sure the validity, but also among tha list CDC workers, Phizer etc. employees, judges.

 

I saw it said best the other day:

 

"Inserting needles and chemicals into people without there consent would be considered violence.  So deprivation of basic human rights because they won't give consent is also violence."

 

Yeah. I think you're looking at this entirely through the lens of Government vs. Anti-Government. Those are the two silos our current political dialogue provides, and needless to say it's inaccurate on a lot of counts. 

 

For the entirety of this pandemic, the government has been able to exert very little control, especially the federal government. Lockdowns were largely localized, and practiced by very different governments around the world because there actually is a pandemic playbook that's been used in pandemics that America has been lucky enough to avoid.  In many places around the country the lockdown orders were ignored, with virtually no legal consequence. We quickly became the worst COVID nation in the world. 

 

Easy to forget, but the strict lockdowns were over in just a few weeks. For the next year the burden largely fell on private companies, and they weren't taking their marching orders from the government, largely because outside of the hospitality industry there were few or none. They had to figure out an ever-shifting free-market of both employees and consumers. They could not afford to alienate people worried about coming to work or shopping at their business. 

 

If you think No Vaccine = No Job is a repression of personal freedom, you need to consider the numerical majority of people who don't want to be FORCED to work or shop in close quarters with people who -- by choice -- are more likely to contract, spread, and prolong a deadly pandemic that is -- in fact -- having serious non-COVID consequences on our healthcare system. 

 

There will always be an out for people who don't want the vaccine. Some will have perfectly good reasons. Others will simply have fears, and that's understandable, too. But there are consequences in an unprecedented pandemic, and at the moment the free-market is driving it as much or more than the government.

 

Maybe you should look at it more in terms of Public vs. Private. You can still do anything you want in private. But if you want to go out in public during a public health crisis, your might have to bend to the collective will.  

 

If you don't listen to me, listen to the chip your iPhone inserted in your brain. 

 

That being said, Pelosi's response was awful. She is currently facing consequences for it. 

 

 

[Archy1221]

36 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said:

I'm assuming you meant to say "Why are..."

 

You're right, if they put in a mandate, they should not be exempt.  If there is a mandate, they have a choice, get it or resign.  

Since they are employees of an entity greater than 100 people, they should be mandated. 

[Redux]

42 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said:

This right here is completely wrong.  The vast majority of Americans can get the vaccine.  They are choosing not too and it's putting others at risk and our economy at risk.  This isn't just about them individually.

 

Look, I don't like the mandate either.  I haven't mandated my employees get the vaccine because I don't want to do that.  BUT.....I have the vast majority of my employees being morons and refusing to get it.  Now, I have more and more employees out with COVID.  Every single one that's out and sick, is not vaccinated.  Some are pretty sick.

 

I'm to the point of considering a mandate because it sure seems like we have way too many people being morons and causing major issues to them personally, the economy and the other people around them.

 

They are choosing not to and being forced to quit/be fired.  Not a choice.  How is it putting others at risk exactly?  It's putting themselves at risk, sure.  Not others, that's a fallacy.  The fully vaccinated and unvaccinated both spread the virus, so no it's not putting others at risk.

 

No employers should be put in that position or be at risk of being fined.  It's a complete infringement on freedom.

 

And that should be your choice free of pressure from the government.  If it's hurting the economy, so is forcing people out of jobs that refuse the vax.

[Redux]

45 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said:

I'm assuming you meant to say "Why are..."

 

You're right, if they put in a mandate, they should not be exempt.  If there is a mandate, they have a choice, get it or resign.  

 

Yes, my Android has gotten very bad at assuming the words I'm typing in.  Upgrade needed soon.

 

The absolutely should not be exempt, and it's precisely WHY people are pushing back so hard.  It sets a piss poor example.  Double that if it truly isn't mandatory for the freaking people making the vaccine.

[Archy1221]

If the mandate was about science, they would exempt previously infected people from the mandate.  

[knapplc]

Congress is exempted from Biden's mandate because he legally can't mandate their vaccination.

[Ratt Mhule]

4 hours ago, Redux said:

Get the vax, or be fired/quit, @Frott Scost says that's a choice.  There's really nothing else to say on the matter at this point, it's pretty sad that people actually believe this and are championing it as something noble.

Its pretty sad that people are unvaccinated in general. I feel bad for anyone who is that stupid. 

[Redux]

8 minutes ago, Frott Scost said:

Its pretty sad that people are unvaccinated in general. I feel bad for anyone who is that stupid. 

 

How very bigoted of you

[Ratt Mhule]

1 hour ago, BigRedBuster said:

This right here is completely wrong.  The vast majority of Americans can get the vaccine.  They are choosing not too and it's putting others at risk and our economy at risk.  This isn't just about them individually.

 

Look, I don't like the mandate either.  I haven't mandated my employees get the vaccine because I don't want to do that.  BUT.....I have the vast majority of my employees being morons and refusing to get it.  Now, I have more and more employees out with COVID.  Every single one that's out and sick, is not vaccinated.  Some are pretty sick.

 

I'm to the point of considering a mandate because it sure seems like we have way too many people being morons and causing major issues to them personally, the economy and the other people around them.

Yes sir!! Do it!

[Ratt Mhule]

3 minutes ago, Redux said:

 

How very bigoted of you

Yup. Ive already stated how I feel about the unvaccinated and how they are 100% the reason we are in the mess we are now. Whatever happens to them if they get covid, its a choice they made and they will have to live…or die with. Oh well…

[knapplc]

 

[Redux]

3 minutes ago, Frott Scost said:

Yup. Ive already stated how I feel about the unvaccinated and how they are 100% the reason we are in the mess we are now. Whatever happens to them if they get covid, its a choice they made and they will have to live…or die with. Oh well…

 

Well, good luck with being horrible

[Ratt Mhule]

1 minute ago, Redux said:

 

Well, good luck with being horrible

You can try and make me feel bad all

you want, thats fine. Ive lost my patience for these people months ago and anyone who looks at the data and doesnt think gee maybe I should get vaccinated needs a brain scan to see if its even functioning properly. 

[Redux]

Just now, Frott Scost said:

You can try and make me feel bad all

you want, thats fine. Ive lost my patience for these people months ago and anyone who looks at the data and doesnt think gee maybe I should get vaccinated needs a brain scan to see if its even functioning properly. 

 

Govern me harder Daddy

[Archy1221]

57 minutes ago, knapplc said:

Congress is exempted from Biden's mandate because he legally can't mandate their vaccination.

Do the states pay the salaries?