Weird Time for Christians

[BigRedBuster]

1 minute ago, BlitzFirst said:

 

  Evangelicals make up over 40% of the 64% of Christians in America and churches aligned under them do this.

So, you've gone form "All" to "90%", which included Catholic and Evangelicals......and now just evangelicals?

 

You confirmed your belief in the 90% not too long ago.  Now you're saying 40% of 64%...which is actually 25.6%.  That's only if ALL evangelicals do that stuff...which they don't.

[BigRedBuster]

1 minute ago, BlitzFirst said:

 

Nope, you can do your own research.

 

So, you make a claim that the Catholic organizational websites do voter registrations, tell people to go vote, and preach about patriotism.....but, you can't find it on the Catholic organizational website.

 

Your point is falling apart.

[TGHusker]

1 minute ago, BlitzFirst said:

No idea what you're on about here...I said none of these things you are stating here.

No idea - read your previous post -   pro-lifers aren't to care what the govt does you state.  Read your words in bold below.  You are doing back flips better than any Olympian high diver. 

 

41 minutes ago, BlitzFirst said:

What makes it political is intolerance.  Religion could just bow out of this (prolife) and not care what the government does.  Same with gay marriage...they could bow out and just tell their members the various stances on each issue that followers should have and let the government make laws how they want to make laws.

 

[BigRedBuster]

8 minutes ago, BlitzFirst said:

Nope, I haven't. 

Then show me on the Catholic website where it says what you claim?

 

You're talking in circles because your original claim you're trying to keep going.....doesn't work.

[Apsu]

Honest question from someone new to this debate, and i really do not have a strong stance on this issue.

- What social issues (reflecting Biblical values) are not political?

[TGHusker]

2 minutes ago, Apsu said:

Honest question from someone new to this debate, and i really do not have a strong stance on this issue.

- What social issues (reflecting Biblical values) are not political?

Good question -  most social issues have a political solution( govt solution) and a non-political solution.  As private citizens and as private organizations we can do what we can to work on the issue. Sometimes govt intervention is needed - ok most times govt has to be involved - that is where the debate comes in on what is the best solution. I think we demonize 'the other side' too much when talking about solutions (regardless of who the other side is). Most people want to solve the problem they just have different ways of getting there.  Most times the best solution is a mix from both sides but if we are constantly yelling over each other and making every social issue a 'red meat' political issue, it doesn't get solved - which often fits in wt the plan of the partisan leaders of these parties.  Having divisive social issues is how parties get power and stay in power.  We, as private citizens and organizations, should refuse to be pawns in that kind of power trap.  Thus, I'm not beholding to the GOP just because I'm pro-life.

[TGHusker]

6 minutes ago, BlitzFirst said:

Yep, separation of church and state should be there...but it often isn't in today's society.  Your stuff about Hitler/Germany...I just stopped reading.  Thus people shouldn't care what the government does...they should care what their church does because government and church are not the same (gods law versus mans law)

 

It's the reason why every presidential candidate needs to be a Christian of some kind...Christianity plays to large of role in politics.

The principle (it isn't a law) of separation does not bar religious expression in public debate --- it bars the govt from founding a national church and from hindering the free expression of religion which is a first amendment right. 

[TGHusker]

2 minutes ago, BlitzFirst said:

 

I never claimed it did bar any debate.  Separation of church and state also protects the state from having moral laws (e.g. Sharia) and a caliphate propping himself/herself up as leader...so the separation works for both sides (for a Christian example, see church of England versus Cathloic church)

 

The problem is, that the founding fathers wanted it to be separate but they're closer now than they have been for a very long time.  Often political talking points are aligned and referenced with religious morality.  Then again, what can we do other than be aware of it and not take part in it?

Ok something we agree about

[30-50 Feral Hogs]

59 minutes ago, Apsu said:

Honest question from someone new to this debate, and i really do not have a strong stance on this issue.

- What social issues (reflecting Biblical values) are not political?

In my opinion..

 

The act of abortion is a moral issue.

 

Keeping it legal or making it illegal is the political issue

[Landlord]

I've worked in ministry for years and been unpaid behind the scenes even longer, across several different denominational environments, and have never once been told how to vote.

 

 

So, respectfully, as somewhat of an expert in the matter, I disagree with the over generalization Blitz.

[Moiraine]

1 hour ago, BlitzFirst said:

 

Google catholics stance on just about any hot button moral political item and you'll see.  Prolife might be a moral choice but it's a political issue.  Gay marriage might be a moral sin according to Christians but it's a political issue.

 

Just look it up.  Religion and politics are intertwined way to much and the Church never distances itself from politics when it should.

 

 

What would be required for a church to distance itself from politics, in your eyes?

 

Because churches are always going to talk about sinful behavior. Just talking about sinful behavior does not mean a church is getting political. 

[Crusader Husker]

10 minutes ago, Landlord said:

I've worked in ministry for years and been unpaid behind the scenes even longer, across several different denominational environments, and have never once been told how to vote.

 

 

So, respectfully, as somewhat of an expert in the matter, I disagree with the over generalization Blitz.

I have gone to church my whole life.  I have also never been told how to vote.  During a Bible Study in 2016 a parishioner told people how they should vote.  Our pastor shut them down and said you should never tell someone how to vote.  He said as a pastor he never would.  I have many friends who are Christians who also vote the left side.  Actually I have many friends who are Catholic who voted for Clinton in the last election.  I guess from what I am reading many may think these things don't happen.

[BigRedBuster]

1 hour ago, BlitzFirst said:

 

Google catholics stance on just about any hot button moral political item and you'll see.  Prolife might be a moral choice but it's a political issue.  Gay marriage might be a moral sin according to Christians but it's a political issue.

 

Just look it up.  Religion and politics are intertwined way to much and the Church never distances itself from politics when it should.

Wait....you said the church's websites did these things.

 

Yes, the Catholic church is pro-life and there are lots of Christian groups or organizations that are political.

 

I'm waiting for you to show me the official Catholic website that is political.  If it is, I would assume it would be at the Diocese level.  I've provided my Diocese website.  You claim that my local church is hypocritical because it doesn't preach to me to vote Republican when the Diocese is telling them to.  

[30-50 Feral Hogs]

4 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said:

Wait....you said the church's websites did these things.

 

Yes, the Catholic church is pro-life and there are lots of Christian groups or organizations that are political.

 

I'm waiting for you to show me the official Catholic website that is political.  If it is, I would assume it would be at the Diocese level.  I've provided my Diocese website.  You claim that my local church is hypocritical because it doesn't preach to me to vote Republican when the Diocese is telling them to.  

I have learned that when someone spouts things they believe as fact and then are asked to back them up, and they tell YOU to go do your own research, it tends to not favor their original point.

[BigRedBuster]

42 minutes ago, 30-50 Feral Hogs said:

In my opinion..

 

The act of abortion is a moral issue.

 

Keeping it legal or making it illegal is the political issue

@BlitzFirst this is a short and sweet way to put it.

 

For instance, I'm pro-life.  However, I don't vote solely on that because I don't believe it should be a political issue.  I don't get caught up in all the political crap on the issue.  I would prefer to donate and work through organizations that help prevent the need for abortions and also help women either before or after an abortion deal with the issue.