Govt & Election Reform Mega Thread

[TGHusker]

6 minutes ago, knapplc said:

 

Absolutely. They know their base is shrinking (ageing out) and this is how they're going to try to hold onto power.

 

Not by representing the actual people of America as demographics change, but by suppressing those who don't fit their narrow world view.

The bold sounds to final - I'm getting old (65).   But true.    I think the party missed its opportunity to change a few  of times during the past 30 years.  The GOP was on solid ground when there was a common enemy - communism. It was the party of national defense, opposition to communism, patriotism and it cloaked itself in the song "Proud to be an American".  But then the Berlin wall fell and the party lost its identity and in a way it's sense of national importance.  Everyone knew the Dems were better at the 'soft issues' of compassion, welfare, etc.  And really better at national governance when it came right down to it.  They were however perceived as weak on defense & during the time of communistic aggression that was important.  The big brother party was no longer needed to stand up against the bullies of the world.   Since then they have failed to remake themselves into a national party - having won the popular vote for the white house just 2x since Reagan was last elected -1988, 2004. 

 

GHWB - tried to be the 'gentle and kinder' conservative'.  That fell flat with his broken tax pledge and a recession.  And besides, Lee Atwater, Bush's campaign mgr,  made sure that GHWB was not known as gentle by the type of campaign he ran against Dukakis   

 

GWB - Tried to be the 'compassionate conservative' and even tried to get comprehensive immigration  passed but his party would have none of that.  He worked wt Ted Kennedy on drugs and education. But he blew it with 2 wars and an unjustifiable tax cut in the midst of the 2 wars.

 

While McCain would have changed the direction of the party, his selection of Palin as VP doomed any chance he had in 2008. That selection was pushed by the far right at that time as much of the party didn't care for 'moderate' McCain. 

 

I also think Romney could have changed the tone in 2012.  But he blew that election after having won the 1st debate in a landslide. He had all of the momentum and then fizzled after that. Again, the party was by then starting to slug off towards the far right as well. Romney was too moderate for to many who decided not to vote in the general election.

 

All of those who wouldn't vote for McCain and Romney came out in droves for Trump. Thus the true heart of the GOP was revealed.  The true heart was hidden until the moderates could be vanished.

[Archy1221]

8 minutes ago, knapplc said:

I've answered these questions. 

You haven’t because you know it doesn’t fit your narrative.  

[knapplc]

1 minute ago, Archy1221 said:

As secretary of state from 2010 to 2018, when most of Georgia's poll closures occurred, Brian Kemp, now the governor, took a laissez-faire attitude toward county-run election practices, save for a 2015 document that spelled out methods officials could use to shutter polling places to show "how the change can benefit voters and the public interest."

 

This doesn't absolve Republicans.  

 

[knapplc]

Just now, Archy1221 said:

You haven’t because you know it doesn’t fit your narrative.  

 

Explain how the new Georgia laws make it easier to vote. 

[Archy1221]

11 minutes ago, knapplc said:

 

Explain how the new Georgia laws make it easier to vote. 

I’m still waiting on how you blame Republicans for the polling location closures in GA.  

[knapplc]

Just now, Archy1221 said:

I’m still waiting on how you blame Republicans for the polling location closures in GA.  

 

I'm not playing that game. The question has been answered. 

 

How does the new Georgia law make it easier to vote?

[Archy1221]

Just now, knapplc said:

 

I'm not playing that game. The question has been answered. 

 

How does the new Georgia law make it easier to vote?

I’m still waiting...............

[knapplc]

1 minute ago, Archy1221 said:

I’m still waiting...............

 

No, you're dodging a question you can't answer: 

 

How does the new Georgia law make it easier to vote?

[Archy1221]

21 minutes ago, knapplc said:

 

No, you're dodging a question you can't answer: 

 

How does the new Georgia law make it easier to vote?

Seems as though I may be waiting indefinitely for my answer.  

[DevoHusker]

38 minutes ago, knapplc said:

 

You quoted what Raffensperger said.  From the same article, here's what he's done. 

 

Since the U.S. Supreme Court's Shelby v. Holder decision in 2013 eliminated key federal oversight of election decisions in states with histories of discrimination, Georgia's voter rolls have grown by nearly 2 million people, yet polling locations have been cut statewide by nearly 10%, according to an analysis of state and local records by Georgia Public Broadcasting and ProPublica. Much of the growth has been fueled by younger, nonwhite voters, especially in nine metro Atlanta counties, where four out of five new voters were nonwhite, according to the Georgia secretary of state's office.

 

 

The metro Atlanta area has been hit particularly hard. The nine counties — Fulton, Gwinnett, Forsyth, DeKalb, Cobb, Hall, Cherokee, Henry and Clayton — have nearly half of the state's active voters but only 38% of the polling places, according to the analysis.

 

 

As a result, the average number of voters packed into each polling location in those counties grew by nearly 40%, from about 2,600 in 2012 to more than 3,600 per polling place as of Oct. 9, the analysis shows. In addition, a last-minute push that opened more than 90 polling places just weeks before the November election has left many voters uncertain about where to vote or how long they might wait to cast a ballot.

 

 

Georgia law sets a cap of 2,000 voters for a polling place that has experienced significant voter delays, but that limit is rarely, if ever, enforced. Our analysis found that, in both majority Black and majority white neighborhoods, about nine of every 10 precincts are assigned to polling places with more than 2,000 people.

 

 

A June 2020 analysis by the Brennan Center for Justice at New York University Law School found that the average number of voters assigned to a polling place has grown in the past five years in Georgia, Louisiana, Mississippi and South Carolina — all states with substantial Black populations that before the Shelby decision needed federal approval to close polling places under the Voting Rights Act. And though dozens of states have regulations on the size of voting precincts and polling places or the number of voting machines, the analysis found that many jurisdictions do not abide by them.

 

 

Georgia's state leadership and elections officials have largely ignored complaints about poll consolidations even as they tout record growth in voter registration. As secretary of state from 2010 to 2018, when most of Georgia's poll closures occurred, Brian Kemp, now the governor, took a laissez-faire attitude toward county-run election practices, save for a 2015 document that spelled out methods officials could use to shutter polling places to show "how the change can benefit voters and the public interest."

 

 

Kemp's office declined to comment Thursday on the letter or why poll closures went unchallenged by state officials. His spokesperson referred to his previous statements that he did not encourage officials to close polling places but merely offered guidance on how to follow the law.

 

 

The inaction has left Black voters in Georgia facing barriers reminiscent of Jim Crow laws, said Adrienne Jones, a political science professor at Morehouse College in Atlanta who has studied the impact of the landmark Shelby decision on Black voters.

 

 

Voter suppression "is happening with these voter impediments that are being imposed," Jones said.

 

 

"You're closing down polling places so people have a more difficult time getting there. You're making vote-by-mail difficult or confusing. Now we're in court arguing about which ballots are going to be accepted, and it means that people have less trust in our state."

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

State legislatures should be making it EASIER to vote, not HARDER.  That this bill is being forcefully denounced should be a clue it's doing the latter. 

 

There is no reason to make these changes. They're loosely based on trump's bogus "voter fraud" nonsense - none of which has ever been validated. 

 

The ONLY reason they're changing these laws across the country is to ensure Republicans hold on to power. Period. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I've answered these questions. 

 

I read the article, that's why I linked it. 

 

39 minutes ago, knapplc said:

The metro Atlanta area has been hit particularly hard. The nine counties — Fulton, Gwinnett, Forsyth, DeKalb, Cobb, Hall, Cherokee, Henry and Clayton — have nearly half of the state's active voters but only 38% of the polling places, according to the analysis.

 

To the bold "nearly half the active voters but only 38% of polls" is intentionally vague. How much is nearly half? how many are "active"? 

 

And, from 2016 numbers anyway, the statement is not correct. There were 6.65 million registered voters in GA in 2016.

2.5 million of those voters were registered in the 23 county (not 9 as quoted) metro Atlanta area. https://33n.atlantaregional.com/special-features/where-are-the-active-voters-voter-turnout-in-metro-atlanta

 

And, breaking down those metro voters there were 1.38 million females. Of that number 554,313 were black and 826,922 were white.

There were 1.12 million males. Of that number 377,157 were black. 735,428 were white.

 

I am not going to argue with you regarding the intent of the State of Georgia to make it more difficult to vote. Some of their intended measures make sense to me and don't make sense to you. It might possibly be Rs trying to suppress Ds. In my opinion, everyone should have the same access regardless of party affiliation.  However, just using the numbers provided in my last two posts, I will argue when you insist that it is racially motivated. 

[Scarlet]

2 hours ago, Archy1221 said:

You haven’t because you know it doesn’t fit your narrative.  

Lol...pot meet kettle.  You've never answered why the Republicans would go through all these contortions based on the red herring of voter fraud if the intent wasn't to make voting more difficult for those that they see as more likely to vote against their agenda.  You've never answered why it is now illegal in Georgia to give water to someone who is waiting in line to vote.   How is making giving someone water addressing "voter fraud"?  Seems like stepping on "muh freedoms".

 

Why haven't you answered these questions?  Because you know, and everyone here knows, the intent of these laws are to make voting more difficult, especially for targeted communities.  Maybe you don't understand it sitting in Kansas but it's a fact.   It's pretty clear you support these Jim Crow laws. Well done.

[Moiraine]

18 minutes ago, Scarlet said:

Maybe you don't understand it sitting in Kansas but it's a fact.

 

 

https://www.salon.com/2018/10/24/officials-close-only-polling-site-in-majority-latino-kansas-town/

 

Quote

Dodge City, Kansas, which has a 60 percent Hispanic population, had its only polling site moved outside the city limits to a suburban location with no access to public transportation, the Wichita Eagle reports.

Once famous as a boozy, violent frontier town of the Old West, Dodge City today is a community of 27,000 people roughly 160 miles west of Wichita. In recent years it has relied on a single polling site for its 13,000 voters, compared to an average of 1,200 voters at other sites. The polling site was located in a wealthy, predominantly white neighborhood near a local country club.

 

[DevoHusker]

10 minutes ago, Moiraine said:

 

 

https://www.salon.com/2018/10/24/officials-close-only-polling-site-in-majority-latino-kansas-town/

 

 

 

https://www.kwch.com/content/news/Dodge-City-to-have-two-polling-places-504741251.html 

 

Dodge City voters will no longer need to cast their ballots at a single location. The election office there came under fire during the 2018 election because they moved the city moved the only polling place to a location many felt was inconvenient for lower-income voters.

Ford County Clerk Debbie Cox says there will be at least two polling places for Dodge City for all elections moving forward, beginning with the primary election on August 6th (if needed) and the general election on November 5th.

Those polling sites are The Hoover Pavilion at 108 Fourth Avenue and the Knights of Columbus Hall at 800 West Frontview Street.

Voters will not be able to choose between the locations. Cox says each location will have precincts assigned to it. The polling places will be designated on each voter’s Voter Registration Card. New cards will be mailed out by the end of January to the address voters provided at the Ford County Election Office.

[Moiraine]

1 hour ago, DevoHusker said:

https://www.kwch.com/content/news/Dodge-City-to-have-two-polling-places-504741251.html 

 

Dodge City voters will no longer need to cast their ballots at a single location. The election office there came under fire during the 2018 election because they moved the city moved the only polling place to a location many felt was inconvenient for lower-income voters.

Ford County Clerk Debbie Cox says there will be at least two polling places for Dodge City for all elections moving forward, beginning with the primary election on August 6th (if needed) and the general election on November 5th.

Those polling sites are The Hoover Pavilion at 108 Fourth Avenue and the Knights of Columbus Hall at 800 West Frontview Street.

Voters will not be able to choose between the locations. Cox says each location will have precincts assigned to it. The polling places will be designated on each voter’s Voter Registration Card. New cards will be mailed out by the end of January to the address voters provided at the Ford County Election Office.

 

 

That's good but beside the point (and now it's 6,500 vs. 1,200). This happens in a lot of states not just the south.

[Archy1221]

2 hours ago, Scarlet said:

Lol...pot meet kettle.  You've never answered why the Republicans would go through all these contortions based on the red herring of voter fraud if the intent wasn't to make voting more difficult for those that they see as more likely to vote against their agenda.  You've never answered why it is now illegal in Georgia to give water to someone who is waiting in line to vote.   How is making giving someone water addressing "voter fraud"?  Seems like stepping on "muh freedoms".

 

Why haven't you answered these questions?  Because you know, and everyone here knows, the intent of these laws are to make voting more difficult, especially for targeted communities.  Maybe you don't understand it sitting in Kansas but it's a fact.   It's pretty clear you support these Jim Crow laws. Well done.

Because I’m still waiting for an answer to a question I asked before all that came up.  That’s how a conversation works.