The Angry Violent Left

[OTHusker]

34 minutes ago, Nebfanatic said:

 Denmark is the happiest country in the world and models many of the 'communist' policies you attribute to liberalism. People can see the difference between North Korea and Denmark. People want to model Denmark.

You may want to do more research

suicide rate is twice as high as the capitalist usa

 

1 in 9 adults are on prescription anti depressants

 

not sure that equates to happiest country in the world 

 

tax ax rates of 68 percent on 80k incomes 

I’m not sure informed voters want to sign up for that 

nevermind $10 per gallon gas and a bunch of other nonsense 

[Waldo]

53 minutes ago, Nebfanatic said:

1350 people and an unknown number of millenials is a fairly small sample. I would reason to guess much more than 1/3rd of all millenials know about Auchwitz.

 

What you also fail to recognize with your staunch anti communism rant is that some of the worlds best functioning nations right now are largely socialist. Denmark is the happiest country in the world and models many of the 'communist' policies you attribute to liberalism. People can see the difference between North Korea and Denmark. People want to model Denmark.

I always find it odd when people compare the U.S. to places like Denmark. Comparing a country that has a work force 50 times smaller than another makes little sense. 

 

[NM11046]

17 minutes ago, OTHusker said:

You may want to do more research

suicide rate is twice as high as the capitalist usa

 

1 in 9 adults are on prescription anti depressants

 

not sure that equates to happiest country in the world 

 

tax ax rates of 68 percent on 80k incomes 

I’m not sure informed voters want to sign up for that 

nevermind $10 per gallon gas and a bunch of other nonsense 

1 of 8 people in the USA under the age of 12 is on an antidepressant.  And that weighs heavily in favor of white women.  Minorities (black, mexican etc) use less (likely due to access of medical care and stigma) Denmark is something like 85% white.  So if you want to try and compare antidepressant use in the US vs. Denmark as some marker of socialism working or not working or happiness levels it's very skewed.  If the entire US population was white we'd be far above  1 in 8.

 

AND antidepressants are used for issues other than depression, so you can't assume that it's an accurate representation of depressed people.  And depression is not tied 100% to living environment or socialism - much is genetic.  

 

I guess I'm struggling with how you're trying to say Danes are more unhappy with life in a socialist country because pay high taxes and this is proven by the fact that they take antidepressants.

 

Here's the 2018 Forbes article defines how they choose the top 10 happiest places to live (Denmark was #3 in 2018).  https://www.forbes.com/sites/duncanmadden/2018/03/27/ranked-the-10-happiest-countries-in-the-world-in-2018/#cf8f65273e91

Quote

The report ranks 156 countries across six factors including GDP, life expectancy, social support, generosity, freedom and corruption. And this year for the first time the UN has also assessed the happiness levels of immigrants in 117 of those countries.

 

In a nutshell:  

Quote

Typical Scandinavian attributes such as high living standards and a brilliant tax, health, education and welfare system mean it has one of the smallest wealth gaps in the world.

 

As far as suicide rate - I again disagree with this being a result of high taxes or socialism.  It's often a mental health issue, genetic in nature.  But regardless you're wrong claiming that it's twice as high as the US.  Far from it.

 

Denmark 12.8% per 100k

USA 15.3% per 100K

(source http://worldpopulationreview.com/countries/suicide-rate-by-country/)

 

So while I appreciate your response being based in what you think are facts, your "facts" are not at all correct.

[Nebfanatic]

35 minutes ago, OTHusker said:

You may want to do more research

suicide rate is twice as high as the capitalist usa

 

1 in 9 adults are on prescription anti depressants

 

not sure that equates to happiest country in the world 

 

tax ax rates of 68 percent on 80k incomes 

I’m not sure informed voters want to sign up for that 

nevermind $10 per gallon gas and a bunch of other nonsense 

https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2015/oct/23/viral-image/internet-graphic-says-suicide-rate-much-higher-den/

 

Denmark has a lower suicide rate than US. 

[OTHusker]

1 hour ago, NM11046 said:

1 of 8 people in the USA under the age of 12 is on an antidepressant.  And that weighs heavily in favor of white women.  Minorities (black, mexican etc) use less (likely due to access of medical care and stigma) Denmark is something like 85% white.  So if you want to try and compare antidepressant use in the US vs. Denmark as some marker of socialism working or not working or happiness levels it's very skewed.  If the entire US population was white we'd be far above  1 in 8.

 

AND antidepressants are used for issues other than depression, so you can't assume that it's an accurate representation of depressed people.  And depression is not tied 100% to living environment or socialism - much is genetic.  

 

I guess I'm struggling with how you're trying to say Danes are more unhappy with life in a socialist country because pay high taxes and this is proven by the fact that they take antidepressants.

 

Here's the 2018 Forbes article defines how they choose the top 10 happiest places to live (Denmark was #3 in 2018).  https://www.forbes.com/sites/duncanmadden/2018/03/27/ranked-the-10-happiest-countries-in-the-world-in-2018/#cf8f65273e91

 

In a nutshell:  

 

As far as suicide rate - I again disagree with this being a result of high taxes or socialism.  It's often a mental health issue, genetic in nature.  But regardless you're wrong claiming that it's twice as high as the US.  Far from it.

 

Denmark 12.8% per 100k

USA 15.3% per 100K

(source http://worldpopulationreview.com/countries/suicide-rate-by-country/)

 

So while I appreciate your response being based in what you think are facts, your "facts" are not at all correct.

Thanks for the reply 

 

here from a very pro socialist Dane:

income tax rates for a 43k per year worker is 45 percent

 

and there is a 25 percent sales tax

 

has the us sunk to this level of government  control into our every day lives ?

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/articles/2016-01-20/why-danes-happily-pay-high-rates-of-taxes%3fcontext=amp

 

over the last 50 years Danes suicide rates are twice ours- yes over last 10 years close to the same as ours 

 

yes we have a much lower adult anti depressant use than the danes

 

 it if what you say is true that it is all generic and that Danes are mostly white and the us is not

a homogenous  very very tiny country is much different than a huge multicultural one wouldn’t you agree

 

do you really think that a tiny homogenous country what they do would be successful in a massive multicultural country where very few of us per human nature are rowing the communal boat in the same direction? 

 

how do you explain the collapse of socialist Venezuela who went from being very rich under capitalism

to starvation and ruin under socialism 

 

[OTHusker]

I guess no one wants to talk about our neighbor to the south Venezuela 

where the socialists got elected and kept in power by outbidding each other on promising more and more benefits to the point the upper and now middle class is leaving due to economic collapse,starvation and now totalitarianism 

 

doesnt that kinda sound like where the Dems are now with their freee everything socialist candidates? 

When you think about it, pretty scary stuff 

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/thehill.com/opinion/international/381791-fading-democracy-in-venezuela-demonstrates-failure-of-socialism%3famp

 

not sure we really want to follow that path 

most of us anyways 

[Moiraine]

1 hour ago, OTHusker said:

Thanks for the reply however not sure your data is correct

here from a very pro socialist Dane:

income tax rates for a 43k per year worker is 45 percent

 

and there is a 25 percent sales tax

 

has the us sunk to this level of government  control into our every day lives ?

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/articles/2016-01-20/why-danes-happily-pay-high-rates-of-taxes%3fcontext=amp

 

over the last 50 years Danes suicide rates are twice ours- yes over last 10 years close to the same as ours 

 

yes we have a much lower adult anti depressant use than the danes

 

 it if what you say is true that it is all generic and that Danes are mostly white and the us is not

a homogenous  very very tiny country is much different than a huge multicultural one wouldn’t you agree

 

do you really think that a tiny homogenous country what they do would be successful in a massive multicultural country where very few of us per human nature are rowing the communal boat in the same direction? 

 

how do you explain the collapse of socialist Venezuela who went from being very rich under capitalism

to starvation and ruin under socialism 

 

 

 

 

Correlation does not imply causation.

 

If it did, you could literally cherry pick any bad thing that happened, and then choose the thing you don’t like (for other reasons) as the thing that must have caused it, as long as that thing existed while the bad thing happened. And that is exactly what you’re doing, and it has no basis in fact/reality/etc.

 

It is hard to prove cause and effect, but some things are a lot more reasonable than others. What you’re suggesting isn’t reasonable.

 

And it’s just plain silly to put more importance on 50, 40, 30 years ago compared to 10 years ago for suicide rates.

 

Also, I don’t know much about Venezuela, but picking the worst country that has tiny similarities to something some politicians in the U.S. are suggesting is another silly argument. There are many countries with things like universal health care and higher effective taxes that are doing fine.

 

In addition to that, it seems to me Venezuela made a disaaterous mistake with their most important export.

 

Quote

Venezuela’s highest-ever oil production occurred in 1998 at 3.5 million barrels per day (BPD). That also happened to be the year that Hugo Chávez was elected president of Venezuela. During the Venezuelan general strike of 2002–2003, Chávez fired 19,000 employees of the state oil company Petróleos de Venezuela, S.A. (PDVSA) and replaced them with employees loyal to his government.

This eliminated a tremendous amount of experience from Venezuela’s oil industry. Most of Venezuela’s proved oil reserves consists of extra-heavy crude oil in the Orinoco Belt. The Orinoco contains an estimated 1.2 trillion barrels of oil resource. This oil is expensive to produce, but after oil prices climbed to $100/bbl, 235 billion barrels of this heavy oil were moved into the “proved reserves” category. This positioned Venezuela ahead of Saudi Arabia as the country with the world’s largest proved oil reserves.

Because this oil is particularly challenging to produce, Venezuela invited international oil companies into the country to participate in the development of these reserves. Companies like ExxonMobil, BP, Chevron, Total and ConocoPhillips invested billions of dollars in technology and infrastructure to turn the extra-heavy oil into crude oil exports.  

What most people do not understand about the oil industry is that it is extremely capital intensive. When oil prices rise, oil companies may indeed reap billions of dollars in profits. But reaping that reward required billions of dollars in capital investments, and if oil prices decline it can quickly turn into billions of dollars of losses. This is the key to understanding what has gone wrong in Venezuela.

 

https://www.forbes.com/sites/rrapier/2017/05/07/how-venezuela-ruined-its-oil-industry/#6cfd8abf7399

 

I bolded the part I did because oil prices declined in 2014.

 

I doubt I need to explain this, but I will just in case. The U.S. isn’t required to make the above mistake just because it gets universal healthcare or raises taxes on some.

[OTHusker]

If you think that all the socialists in the us want I s universal health care 

God help us if that lie is being accepted by willing and able  voters 

 

 

socialism simply does not work in large multicultural societies and by many metrics doesn’t in much tinier homogenous ones either 

 

nationalizing and taking the profit out of industry and substituting state or collective planning is socialism and that’s what killed  Venezuela and it’s oil industry 

[Nebfanatic]

2 minutes ago, OTHusker said:

If you think that all the socialists in the us want I s universal health care 

God help us if that lie is being accepted by willing and able  voters 

 

 

socialism simply does not work in large multicultural societies and by many metrics doesn’t in much tinier homogenous ones either 

What does work then because we aren't exactly doing great in the US by many metrics. Thats the problem, every country has a myriad of problems you can point to and say "their system simply doesn't work" 

[OTHusker]

17 minutes ago, Moiraine said:

 

 

Also, I don’t know much about Venezuela, but picking the worst country that has tiny similarities to something some politicians in the U.S. are suggesting is another silly argument. There are many countries with things like universal health care and higher effective taxes that are doing fine.

 

In addition to that, it seems to me Venezuela made a disaaterous mistake with their most important export.

 

You didn’t read the article

venezuela failed because their socialist politicians got into a bidding war to distribute more and more free stuff

 

businesses were nationalized

the educated and successful left 

my friend is east indian

his parents had several businesses in Venezuela and fled after the socialists came to power one of their businesses was a bus company - overnight he had no power his workers were now the owners and bossing him around 

 

They went from being a country that had been very wealthy over the last 40 years to one mired in poverty And decay 

[OTHusker]

8 minutes ago, Nebfanatic said:

What does work then because we aren't exactly doing great in the US by many metrics. Thats the problem, every country has a myriad of problems you can point to and say "their system simply doesn't work" 

Hmmm

millions of immigrants into the us over the last 100 years would beg to differ 

so would the thousands that have died trying to get here

biggest destination for immigrants in the world 

[Moiraine]

24 minutes ago, OTHusker said:

If you think that all the socialists in the us want I s universal health care 

God help us if that lie is being accepted by willing and able  voters 

 

 

socialism simply does not work in large multicultural societies and by many metrics doesn’t in much tinier homogenous ones either 

 

nationalizing and taking the profit out of industry and substituting state or collective planning is socialism and that’s what killed  Venezuela and it’s oil industry 

 

 

I didn’t say that’s all the socialists want. It’s no wonder you were confused by my post if that’s your conclusion.

 

There are very few socialists in the U.S. It’d be pretty crazy if you’re concerned about them. That’s why I thought what you were worried about is universal health care and higher taxes. 

[Moiraine]

15 minutes ago, OTHusker said:

You didn’t read the article

venezuela failed because their socialist politicians got into a bidding war to distribute more and more free stuff

 

businesses were nationalized

the educated and successful left 

my friend is east indian

his parents had several businesses in Venezuela and fled after the socialists came to power one of their businesses was a bus company - overnight he had no power his workers were now the owners and bossing him around 

 

They went from being a country that had been very wealthy over the last 40 years to one mired in poverty And decay 

 

 

Lots of things went wrong in Venezuela. Just being socialist wasn’t one of them. There are many stupid things they did that weren't required just because they were socialist. They did lots of stupid s#!t because they were stupid. Most of which aren’t being suggested by anyone in the U.S. other than wackjob fringe people no one listens to and that you shouldn’t be concerned enough about to bring up Venezuela. No one that matters is suggesting the U.S. become a socialist country, so you should stop bringing up Venezuela as if it's relevant.

 

If you're concerned we'll become Venezuela if we get universal health care and raise taxes, the fearmongering is working well on you.

[Nebfanatic]

15 minutes ago, OTHusker said:

Hmmm

millions of immigrants into the us over the last 100 years would beg to differ 

so would the thousands that have died trying to get here

biggest destination for immigrants in the world 

Is immigration the only metric of a great country? How is our infant mortality rate these days? 

[OTHusker]

Top destination in the world

people vote with their feet 

 

weve have won that election in an ultra landslide for what 100 years ?