Will our democracy survive Trump?

[Moiraine]

13 minutes ago, mrandyk said:

It could die if the Republicans installed someone with these destructive tendencies who wasn't a total s#!t for brains. We need to fortify the checks and balances because they have clearly failed us.

 

 

This is how I feel - that somewhere there is someone who knows how to manipulate the system a lot better and is being shown how easy it would be. The Democrats could do it too, although I think it's less likely.

[mrandyk]

I shouldn't have limited that statement to just the Republicans, the Dems could also put someone out there looking to tear down our democracy - it just seems a lot less likely. There is absolutely no line the Republicans won't cross in their support of Trump. If he were to attempt to extend his stay, by either pushing term limits or disputing election results, I doubt his party would fight him.

 

The president needs to be held accountable. Simply is not the case in our current state of affairs. That needs to change.

[Landlord]

22 minutes ago, Moiraine said:

 

 

This is how I feel - that somewhere there is someone who knows how to manipulate the system a lot better and is being shown how easy it would be. The Democrats could do it too, although I think it's less likely.

 

 

Yep. The most dangerous thing about the Trump era is it has given smarter, more opportunistic power hungry politicians the blueprint for how to sideskirt and ignore the ways the system works. And how to get away with doing it and even have people support you doing it. It's a scary narrative development.

[commando]

9 hours ago, StPaulHusker said:

 

America "survived" the Civil Rights Movement........

i would upvote that 1,000 times if i could.   apparently that guy thinks the civil rights movement was a bad thing

[commando]

On 11/13/2018 at 9:45 AM, Landlord said:

I have conservative friends telling me that the process of accounting for votes includes things like overseas votes, where if 100 people request an absentee ballot and 1 million vote, then the state will declare 1,000,100 votes, and it's proof of voter fraud that the number of declared votes keeps rising. Can someone help me debunk this plz lol

every vote has to have a registered voter attached to it to count.   those 1,000,000 extra votes would have to match up with registered voters who haven't been crossed off the list of people who have already voted.  

[Vegas]

15 hours ago, Ulty said:

 

Wait, are you casually equating war, the Depression, and corruption with the civil rights movement?

No, not with the civil rights movement. I'm saying that with everything this country has gone through over the years and survived, Trump is not going to be the downfall.

[Vegas]

19 minutes ago, commando said:

i would upvote that 1,000 times if i could.   apparently that guy thinks the civil rights movement was a bad thing

No, I never claimed the civil right movement was a bad thing. But obviously it was one of many challanges that our country went through.

[Vegas]

13 hours ago, commando said:

the right would never ask that?

 

radio giant Rush Limbaugh says that’s the wrong question to ask.

“That’s not the question. The question is: Will America last through Obama’s full term?” Limbaugh said on his program Monday.

Read more at https://www.wnd.com/2013/06/will-u-s-even-survive-obamas-full-term/#XMAST4s8qCZ3XWyR.99

and that makes him a dem...voting for the conservative agenda but disagreeing with trump ju

13 hours ago, commando said:

the right would never ask that?

 

radio giant Rush Limbaugh says that’s the wrong question to ask.

“That’s not the question. The question is: Will America last through Obama’s full term?” Limbaugh said on his program Monday.

Read more at https://www.wnd.com/2013/06/will-u-s-even-survive-obamas-full-term/#XMAST4s8qCZ3XWyR.99

and that makes him a dem...voting for the conservative agenda but disagreeing with trump personally?

 

And Rush says a lot of dumb stuff as well. Trump is not a dictator, our country is protected by checks and balances. America has had a lot of horrible Presidents over the years including Barrack Obama. If someone doesn't believe the U.S. can withstand one American President then they must not have much faith in a system that has been around for nearly 250 years.

[mrandyk]

9 minutes ago, Vegas said:

And Rush says a lot of dumb stuff as well. Trump is not a dictator, our country is protected by checks and balances. America has had a lot of horrible Presidents over the years including Barrack Obama. If someone doesn't believe the U.S. can withstand one American President then they must not have much faith in a system that has been around for nearly 250 years.

It's worth restating to you that the question is whether our democracy will survive, not the nation itself. (Though if democracy dies I'm sure states will be looking to secede.)

 

I do believe you were misunderstood when you listed the Civil Rights Movement as something this country "survived", but you don't seem to realize the unique threat Trump poses. It's unlike anything this nation has ever seen. The checks and balances have been thrown out the window by a complicit House and Senate, they've given free reign to a destructive egomaniac. The insanity involving Russia and his obstruction of justice would have sunk him long ago if checks and balances were actually in place.

[commando]

5 minutes ago, Vegas said:

And Rush says a lot of dumb stuff as well. Trump is not a dictator, our country is protected by checks and balances. America has had a lot of horrible Presidents over the years including Barrack Obama. If someone doesn't believe the U.S. can withstand one American President then they must not have much faith in a system that has been around for nearly 250 years.

the breakdown in the system right now is the complicit republicans letting Donald get away with way more than he should.   they are suppose to be the checks and balances.   the slow moving saturday night massacre is evidence that they are not taking their check and balance role seriously IMO.   today mitch blocked a resolution to protect mueller from getting to the floor for a vote.  

[Landlord]

1 hour ago, commando said:

every vote has to have a registered voter attached to it to count.   those 1,000,000 extra votes would have to match up with registered voters who haven't been crossed off the list of people who have already voted.  

 

 

You read my post wrong. In the scenario it would be 1,000,000 local legitimate votes, and 100 overseas/military mail in votes. Do they declare a total # of votes as 1,000,100 before they get those votes in? As in, is that extra 100 already accounted for as a total quantity before they actually get them to sort them?

[commando]

Just now, Landlord said:

 

 

You read my post wrong. In the scenario it would be 1,000,000 local legitimate votes, and 100 overseas/military mail in votes. Do they declare a total # of votes as 1,000,100 before they get those votes in? As in, is that extra 100 already accounted for as a total quantity before they actually get them to sort them?

whatever votes come in is howm they get the total.   in florida those votes have to postmarked before or on election day and  be there by the 16th ...or 2 days from now so no way to know the total yet.

[Landlord]

4 minutes ago, commando said:

whatever votes come in is howm they get the total.   in florida those votes have to postmarked before or on election day and  be there by the 16th ...or 2 days from now so no way to know the total yet.

 

 

But they know the total of overseas ballots that were requested, right?

[commando]

Just now, Landlord said:

 

 

But they know the total of overseas ballots that were requested, right?

yews...but they have no idea how many will actually be returned.

[methodical]

It's not Trump that will be the undoing of American Democracy.  He's a symptom of a much larger problem as I see it and American Democracy won't survive it unless we make it 100% a priority to elect people pledged to end it, hell it already feels a little sarcastic to call it a Democracy.  The reason he gets away with unimaginable policies and lying and just in general being a lazy idiot is simple.  Money, not his money, but the money being pumped into the parties and PACs by wealthy extremists and special interests.  Trump helped whip people on the right into a frenzy, but that was happening before plenty by their actors spewing propaganda on their networks, but its PAC money and RNC money that tells these politicians (that are sans backbone until they decide not to run again) "hey, you better fall in line or we'll find and fund your primary opponents that will."

 

That's the root of the problems on pretty much any level policy, from partisanship, to nobody able to stand up to their leadership.  It's turned being an elected representative into a hostage to their leadership or they get the "how are you going to keep your glorified telemarketing job when we'll bury you in attack ads next cycle if you don't snap to."