Education

[teachercd]

2 minutes ago, funhusker said:

DM

Everyone wants to get to EPS because of the amazing shop classes!  Haha

I did recently just chat with a Elk North teacher/coach, sounds like that school is amazing Inside!

 

I don't like that people without kids have to pay for schools too...but no one listens to me.

[Archy1221]

32 minutes ago, funhusker said:

 

I could get behind "school choice" as long as private schools are required to take on the same percentage of Special Education students as the surrounding districts

 

This makes sense and makes an even playing field when examining comparable outputs I think. 
 

One piece of the school choice that a poster above doesn’t realize (not you) is that school choice doesn’t necessarily mean going public to private.  It could also mean moving from one public school or district to another.  

[BigRedBuster]

For the most part, I'm for school choice.  I can't imagine being in a school system that absolutely sucks with no option but to send my kids there.  

 

But, the concern is that of the kids that are left behind.  Let's say there's an inner city school that isn't that great.  So, now a bunch of parents take their kids out and send them to a suburban school that's much better and the funds leave with them.  How does that school improve?  Some parents don't have the ability to transport their kids to another school, so they are stuck.  What is our solution for that?  As a parent, my responsibility is my kid and I need to do what's best for them.  As a society, our responsibility is all kids in general.

[Cdog923]

1 hour ago, knapplc said:

"School Choice" or vouchers are a grift by the religious right to fund their schools through public tax dollars. 

 

Louder for those in the back. 

[Archy1221]

10 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said:

For the most part, I'm for school choice.  I can't imagine being in a school system that absolutely sucks with no option but to send my kids there.  

 

But, the concern is that of the kids that are left behind.  Let's say there's an inner city school that isn't that great.  So, now a bunch of parents take their kids out and send them to a suburban school that's much better and the funds leave with them.  How does that school improve?  Some parents don't have the ability to transport their kids to another school, so they are stuck.  What is our solution for that?  As a parent, my responsibility is my kid and I need to do what's best for them.  As a society, our responsibility is all kids in general.

That is a good and tough question to figure out.  The status quo isn’t working in those districts, but you bring up a possible negative aspect to kids leaving.  
 

Fed grants to inner city schools impacted by this???  Divert some of the wasteful spending (cut military by a small portion, end the use it or lose it Gov budget idea to generate money for this, etc…)   Maybe this could keep funding levels up for those schools and actually having less students to handle may have a positive impact on those resources??  
 

good question though 

[knapplc]

15 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said:

For the most part, I'm for school choice.  I can't imagine being in a school system that absolutely sucks with no option but to send my kids there.  

 

 

You can opt your kid out of their current school district by simply filling out a form with the DOE.  You've been able to do that for years, without what right-wingers call "school choice." 

 

What "school choice" bills do - like the one Iowa just passed - is take taxpayer money and divide it into vouchers allocated for each student. Students that opt to go to private schools, which are overwhelmingly religious, take their taxpayer money out of the general budget. That means less money for public schools that are already cutting budgets.

 

On top of that, those private schools have zero obligation to explain how they're using taxpayer money. So your taxes are paying for religious indoctrination by private schools without oversight. As the Iowa State Auditor said:

 

Quote

 

Existing law requires public schools to have open meetings, maintain and produce public records, and have elected citizen oversight. They must follow budgeting laws. They must have an annual audit. We learn of waste, fraud, and abuse of tax dollars in part because of these obligations. None of these obligations apply to private schools the same way. This bill won’t change that.

 

Also, this bill provides no rules for how private school use these funds. After a private school gets public dollars as tuition, they could buy a teacher or teachers brand new Ford Mustang convertibles in the name of incentive pay. The public may not find out at all, and if they did, there may be no recourse for taxpayers. That is flatly, fundamentally irresponsible.

 

 

There's a reason these bills are being pushed by the religious right. And there's a reason they're written to be vague and place little oversight on how your taxes are spent. The lie is that it's to benefit any kid who wants to move from their crappy school district to another. 

[teachercd]

This thread is getting better than I thought!

[JJ Husker]

2 hours ago, knapplc said:

 

You can opt your kid out of their current school district by simply filling out a form with the DOE.  You've been able to do that for years, without what right-wingers call "school choice." 

 

What "school choice" bills do - like the one Iowa just passed - is take taxpayer money and divide it into vouchers allocated for each student. Students that opt to go to private schools, which are overwhelmingly religious, take their taxpayer money out of the general budget. That means less money for public schools that are already cutting budgets.

 

On top of that, those private schools have zero obligation to explain how they're using taxpayer money. So your taxes are paying for religious indoctrination by private schools without oversight. As the Iowa State Auditor said:

 

 

There's a reason these bills are being pushed by the religious right. And there's a reason they're written to be vague and place little oversight on how your taxes are spent. The lie is that it's to benefit any kid who wants to move from their crappy school district to another. 

I believe most of this to be true. However I do wonder how many actually attend private or religious schools compared to public schools. Seems like it would be some smaller manageable percentage.

 

I don’t think full value vouchers is the way to go. It’s not right to take public funds and use them without oversight and transparency or for religious purposes. But I also believe it is a parent’s right to choose if they want their kiddos to attend a religion based school. Therefore, my solution would be to issue vouchers equal to the amount of taxes that family actually pays for schools. That way whether they choose public or private the amount they are actually paying in property taxes, specifically for schools, goes with them. They can make up the difference out of pocket for the costs of a private school. This prevents joe taxpayer from subsidizing their religious choice and is still fair to them so they aren’t getting double dipped on education expense.

 

AFAIK, people already have choice on what schools they attend, at least we did. We went the “white flight” path with our kids for middle school, opted out of our home school. Our son attended another middle and high school in town and our daughter went to middle school in a neighboring school district and returned to town for high school. In Colorado there is a dollar amount per student and that money goes to whatever school district they are enrolled in. They have an official “butts in seats” attendance day (that you don’t dare miss) and the count that day determines how much money they get from the state. Anyway, it seems like schools of choice to me without having to subsidize others religious or private school choices.

[BigRedBuster]

2 hours ago, knapplc said:

 

You can opt your kid out of their current school district by simply filling out a form with the DOE.  You've been able to do that for years, without what right-wingers call "school choice." 

 

What "school choice" bills do - like the one Iowa just passed - is take taxpayer money and divide it into vouchers allocated for each student. Students that opt to go to private schools, which are overwhelmingly religious, take their taxpayer money out of the general budget. That means less money for public schools that are already cutting budgets.

 

On top of that, those private schools have zero obligation to explain how they're using taxpayer money. So your taxes are paying for religious indoctrination by private schools without oversight. As the Iowa State Auditor said:

 

 

There's a reason these bills are being pushed by the religious right. And there's a reason they're written to be vague and place little oversight on how your taxes are spent. The lie is that it's to benefit any kid who wants to move from their crappy school district to another. 

I somewhat agree.  But, I would add in that it's more and more including their grand scheme of charter schools.  Whatever their BS motivation is, I stand by my original post.  It didn't have anything to do with Republican's motivation.  It was just my thoughts.

[knapplc]

13 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said:

I somewhat agree.  But, I would add in that it's more and more including their grand scheme of charter schools.  Whatever their BS motivation is, I stand by my original post.  It didn't have anything to do with Republican's motivation.  It was just my thoughts.

 

That's what sucks about "school choice." They take reasonable opinions like yours (and mine, honestly) and manipulate that into their political agenda. 

 

I think everyone is fine with parents choosing where to send their kids. I think everyone is fine with opting into another school, or district, or even a private school.

 

Where I think most people are reasonably iffy is when private schools with no oversight are gifted tax money to push an unregulated agenda. That's not how regular people want their taxes spent. 

[teachercd]

Just do what is best for the students.

[BigRedBuster]

23 minutes ago, teachercd said:

Just do what is best for the students.

Agree.  But, that my change depending on if you're talking about an individual student compared to all students as a collective.

[teachercd]

4 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said:

Agree.  But, that my change depending on if you're talking about an individual student compared to all students as a collective.

Very true!

 

It sucks that there are "bad" schools. at all.  

[BigRedBuster]

16 minutes ago, teachercd said:

Very true!

 

It sucks that there are "bad" schools. at all.  

Well, if you would teach better, it would help.

 

[JJ Husker]

22 minutes ago, teachercd said:

 

It sucks that there are "bad" schools. at all.  

I don’t think there are bad schools, only bad locations and bad parents and very few bad teachers.