Guy Chamberlin Posted July 6, 2020 Author Share Posted July 6, 2020 Could this be the start of some lively libertarian-flavored debate? I almost forgot how disappointed I was with this thread. Link to comment
BigRedBuster Posted July 6, 2020 Share Posted July 6, 2020 Just now, Guy Chamberlin said: Could this be the start of some lively libertarian-flavored debate? I almost forgot how disappointed I was with this thread. Basically, everyone is a libertarian till people start talking about the benefit they get from the government....then all of a sudden it gets switched to how justified it is. Fact is, we all benefit from the government....and all of us should work to not rely on the government.....but sometimes that's not possible..so you rely on the government....but that shouldn't stop you from trying to get away from relying on the government....and stop complaining when someone else needs to rely on the government like you're some kind of saint for not relying on the government because you do. 3 Link to comment
Landlord Posted July 6, 2020 Share Posted July 6, 2020 32 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said: Basically, everyone is a libertarian till people start talking about the benefit they get from the government....then all of a sudden it gets switched to how justified it is. Fact is, we all benefit from the government....and all of us should work to not rely on the government.....but sometimes that's not possible..so you rely on the government....but that shouldn't stop you from trying to get away from relying on the government....and stop complaining when someone else needs to rely on the government like you're some kind of saint for not relying on the government because you do. This is about spot on. There's a lot of good instinct in libertarianism, but for some super weird reason the only people you see arguing for it are people who aren't poor and trapped at the bottom of the socioeconomic ladder. Our country is currently a lot of socialism for the rich and powerful, and a lot of rugged individualist capitalist for the poor and helpless. If we flipped that around some, where there's a good and helpful safety net paired with tools for success and growth at the bottom, then yeah, let's libertarianism the hell out of the top. 3 Link to comment
Guy Chamberlin Posted July 7, 2020 Author Share Posted July 7, 2020 16 hours ago, Landlord said: This is about spot on. There's a lot of good instinct in libertarianism, but for some super weird reason the only people you see arguing for it are people who aren't poor and trapped at the bottom of the socioeconomic ladder. Our country is currently a lot of socialism for the rich and powerful, and a lot of rugged individualist capitalist for the poor and helpless. If we flipped that around some, where there's a good and helpful safety net paired with tools for success and growth at the bottom, then yeah, let's libertarianism the hell out of the top. Two good posts. Link to comment
TGHusker Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 On 7/7/2020 at 10:50 AM, RedDenver said: Yep, we are all small govt until the govt is willing to hand us a check. Link to comment
dubsker Posted July 8, 2020 Share Posted July 8, 2020 On 1/8/2019 at 2:16 PM, knapplc said: We can't have a Libertarian party. If we did, the Republicans wouldn't know which libs they were owning. As a person who loved Ron Paul's manifesto, you threw that one really high (possibly higher than you meant to) and all that matters is it f#&%ing cracked me up. 1 Link to comment
Guy Chamberlin Posted June 17, 2023 Author Share Posted June 17, 2023 22 hours ago, RedDenver said: I feel like we've moved into a phase where full-fledged conspiracy theories are being used by all sides to explain everything. My 19 and 22 year old kids, and apparently all their peers, claim my attempts at skepticism and vetting is blind optimism that the powers that be aren't running shadow operations on virtually every facet of life. Maybe I was like that at their age. I don't know. But it's running through every discourse and age group more than I ever remember. So you really can't have a meaningful conversation. There were some interesting dynamics involved around Pearl Harbor, some unexpected consequences around 9/11, and some complicated rooting interests in the Russia/Ukraine war, but they still leave a huge and often illogical leap to reach the conspiracy theory being passed off as fact. It always involves people who believe themselves much smarter than they are, having ferreted out the secrets of the shadow elites, and then lecturing a mainstream they accuse of being sheep. Unfortunately, that fits the Libertarian profile more than the simple desire to be left alone as much as possible. 1 Link to comment
Guy Chamberlin Posted June 20, 2023 Author Share Posted June 20, 2023 I just made a Deep State joke on another thread, but I'm wondering what the Libertarian take is on the power infrastructure. It's laughable that conservatives consider the Deep State and the Globalists to be liberal or Democrat operations. This is where I believe there's a Conspiracy In Broad Daylight: people with wealth and power fully expect to wield disproportionate influence, and we expect them to as well. Duh. They don't necessarily align with a single political party. They may collude, but they may also compete with each other, led by personalities who hate each other. They celebrate the meritocracy of the free market and the CEOs could be heroes in their own Ayn Rand novel, but they also play every advantage the government gives them and the nature of corporations tends to discourage individualism. Another conundrum: globalism is the most natural extent of the free market. So if you're a modern libertarian, where do you stand on the state of Capitalism? 1 Link to comment
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