8-4

[Nebfanatic]

4 minutes ago, Guy Chamberlin said:

 

Honest question:  did you feel better about the team that ended last season beating Michigan State (with defense), Illinois (with offense) and giving two ranked teams -- Ohio State and Iowa --- hard fought games on national television?  Or do you prefer the team we're watching right now? 

Notice all of those games happened after this point in the season last year....

 

To answer your question, I like this team because they have improved on defense and learned how to win when it takes some guts. I'm excited to see how the second half of the season plays out. Either way we have come a long way from how we were playing in 2017

[Redux]

23 minutes ago, Guy Chamberlin said:

Honest question:  did you feel better about the team that ended last season beating Michigan State (with defense), Illinois (with offense) and giving two ranked teams -- Ohio State and Iowa --- hard fought games on national television?  Or do you prefer the team we're watching right now? 

 

I felt better about last year's team through the last 6 games than I ever have the first 6 of this year's team.

 

Hands dow , no question about it.

[Mavric]

29 minutes ago, Guy Chamberlin said:

Honest question:  did you feel better about the team that ended last season beating Michigan State (with defense), Illinois (with offense) and giving two ranked teams -- Ohio State and Iowa --- hard fought games on national television?  Or do you prefer the team we're watching right now? 

 

You're obviously free to ask the question but that has basically nothing to do with whether we've improved or are trending in the right direction.  It has almost everything to do with expectations.  Expectations last year were really low coming off a 4-8 season and especially after starting 0-6.  We were definitely playing well at the end of last year and it felt like we'd come miles since the early season.  This year is basically the opposite.  Expectations were in the realm of winning the West and competing for a conference championship.  Those expectations have been significantly downgraded by many due to the perceived struggles on the field.  

 

But we can still win the West.  We might even see another jump in performance like we did last year.  But none of that has anything to do with whether we're actually making progress or not.  

 

Our offense has taken a step back from last year but is still significantly better than we were two years ago.  Our defense has gotten noticeably better each of the last two years.  Our points allowed have gone down 27% from two years ago.  Our yards allowed per game is down 12%. Our tackles for loss, sacks and passes defended have all doubled.  Our penalties are down. 

 

I'm not sure how anyone could look at that and not see progress.

[Guy Chamberlin]

6 minutes ago, Mavric said:

 

 It has almost everything to do with expectations.  Expectations last year were really low coming off a 4-8 season and especially after starting 0-6. 

 

Expectations were that it was virtually inconceivable that Scott Frost would post the same record as Mike Riley, much less get off to the worst start in 125 years of Nebraska football. I'm not being cranky. I don't know anyone who thought last year would unfold that way.

 

Last year's Nebraska team played better in the second half of the season against tougher opposition, raising the expectation that the light had gone off and players were buying into Frost's system. This year's Nebraska team has struggled in the earlier, easier part of the schedule, improved a bit on defense and mysteriously regressed on offense -- where many of us thought we had an advantage. 

 

This is not a referendum on Frost or the future. I just think it's hard to have watched any game not against Northern Illinois this year and see a team with better discipline, consistency, and attitude than last year. 

[NUinID]

4 minutes ago, Guy Chamberlin said:

 

Expectations were that it was virtually inconceivable that Scott Frost would post the same record as Mike Riley, much less get off to the worst start in 125 years of Nebraska football. I'm not being cranky. I don't know anyone who thought last year would unfold that way.

 

Last year's Nebraska team played better in the second half of the season against tougher opposition, raising the expectation that the light had gone off and players were buying into Frost's system. This year's Nebraska team has struggled in the earlier, easier part of the schedule, improved a bit on defense and mysteriously regressed on offense -- where many of us thought we had an advantage. 

 

This is not a referendum on Frost or the future. I just think it's hard to have watched any game not against Northern Illinois this year and see a team with better discipline, consistency, and attitude than last year. 

 

Offensively, Nebraska misses its 2 O linemen from last year and Ozigbo and Morgan a lot.  It is amazing how 4 guys can make that much of a difference, but they can.  That is part of the difference in the offense this year, but I still think Martinez is playing poorly compared to last year.  Is it because he is missing his guys from last year, probably to an extent, but I think there is something else missing. 

 

I think the defense as taken a significant jump this year.  As Mavric showed they have improved a lot statistically speaking.  The run defense is way more impressive than last year.  I mean yeah, OSU put up phenomenal numbers against Nebraska rushing the ball, but OSU did that against Michigan States defense too. 

 

For me the team has improved in being able to finish games and win games.  This  year they have won games that last year they probably let slip away.    

 

 

[NUance]

31 minutes ago, NUinID said:

 

Offensively, Nebraska misses its 2 O linemen from last year and Ozigbo and Morgan a lot.  It is amazing how 4 guys can make that much of a difference, but they can.  That is part of the difference in the offense this year, but I still think Martinez is playing poorly compared to last year.  Is it because he is missing his guys from last year, probably to an extent, but I think there is something else missing. 

 

I think the defense as taken a significant jump this year.  As Mavric showed they have improved a lot statistically speaking.  The run defense is way more impressive than last year.  I mean yeah, OSU put up phenomenal numbers against Nebraska rushing the ball, but OSU did that against Michigan States defense too. 

 

For me the team has improved in being able to finish games and win games.  This  year they have won games that last year they probably let slip away.   

 

Agreed.  We miss the guys from last year and Martinez is experiencing the sophomore jinx.  I think the "something else" you mention is that D-coordinators have film on Martinez.  Just like Taylor Martinez.  Remember those first five or six games?  Remember Kansas State?  He was unstoppable.  So many long, highlight reel runs.  But then D-coordinators started game planning for him, and his production went down.  (That, and T-Magic might have been slowed a step due to injury.)    In case you want to walk down the memory lane remembering how great T-Magic was his R-frosh year, here he is crushing the soul of Kansas State:  

 

 

It's hilarious listening to the announcers at 1:00 in that youtube talk about K-State's halftime adjustments--and then watching Martinez peel off a huge TD run.  

[NUinID]

6 minutes ago, NUance said:

 

Agreed.  We miss the guys from last year and Martinez is experiencing the sophomore jinx.  I think the "something else" you mention is that D-coordinators have film on Martinez.  Just like Taylor Martinez.  Remember those first five or six games?  Remember Kansas State?  He was unstoppable.  So many long, highlight reel runs.  But then D-coordinators started game planning for him, and his production went down.  (That, and T-Magic might have been slowed a step due to injury.)    In case you want to walk down the memory lane remembering how great T-Magic was his R-frosh year, here he is crushing the soul of Kansas State:  

 

 

 

 

Yeah, having film on him is probably part of it, but I think they really want think and move through is progressions.  I think he is thinking too much and not playing.  Listening to Dr. Rob right now on Husker Doc Talk and he things the exact same thing.  He says last year it was 2 reads and take off.  Look at my 2 primarys and if they aren't there run and get what you can.  Watch the NW game again, NW defense is really good and fundamentally sound.  He had 3-4x in this last game that he could have taken off and ran for 10 yards, but he kept looking down field.  He then ends up throwing it away or picking up a yard and a half

[BigRedBuster]

1 hour ago, Guy Chamberlin said:

 

Honest question:  did you feel better about the team that ended last season beating Michigan State (with defense), Illinois (with offense) and giving two ranked teams -- Ohio State and Iowa --- hard fought games on national television?  Or do you prefer the team we're watching right now? 

Obviously, the team that ended the year last year was a better team than we have right now.  That doesn't mean the program isn't headed in the right direction.

 

To see that, you have to dig farther.  Why is our offensive line worse?  Well....we lost some major upper classmen that ended last year playing pretty well.  This year, we are replacing them with young kids that are being developed.  We have very little upper class leadership on the line.  We DO have some guys very young that are supposed to be very good on the line.

 

I would take this defense over last year's any day of the week.  Are they perfect?  No.  but, look at the stats above.  You honestly going to also say the "eye test" doesn't tell you our defense is better?

We lost to CU because of the offense.  We lost to OSU probably because they are a top 4 team in the country and nobody should expect us to be at that level yet.  Our offense struggled that game and it's been pointed out how the O line was a major part of that...even in two of the turnovers.

So.....this "eye test" talk gets tiring.  bla bla bla......  Progress to where we want to be is not going to be a straight line.

[BigRedBuster]

1 hour ago, Guy Chamberlin said:

and mysteriously regressed on offense

You really find it a mystery why we are down some on offense?

[Mavric]

2 hours ago, Guy Chamberlin said:

Expectations were that it was virtually inconceivable that Scott Frost would post the same record as Mike Riley, much less get off to the worst start in 125 years of Nebraska football. I'm not being cranky. I don't know anyone who thought last year would unfold that way.

 

Last year's Nebraska team played better in the second half of the season against tougher opposition, raising the expectation that the light had gone off and players were buying into Frost's system. This year's Nebraska team has struggled in the earlier, easier part of the schedule, improved a bit on defense and mysteriously regressed on offense -- where many of us thought we had an advantage. 

 

This is not a referendum on Frost or the future. I just think it's hard to have watched any game not against Northern Illinois this year and see a team with better discipline, consistency, and attitude than last year. 

 

I'm not saying people expected to go 0-6.  I'm saying that - while they thought Frost would do better - most were not expecting miracles in year 1.  Not 4-8.  But not undefeated either.  Then after the 0-6 start we really seemed to greatly exceed expectations for the second half of the season by playing Ohio State way closer than almost anyone thought possible, having a great chance to win at Iowa and winnign the rest.  That's part of why the end of the season felt really good, beyond just playing better.

 

And you are exactly making my point with the rest of your post.  There is nothing objective that says we aren't improving.  The only way you are saying we aren't improving is relative to expectations.  That doesn't make the expectations realistic or the perceptions true.

[Guy Chamberlin]

1 hour ago, BigRedBuster said:

You really find it a mystery why we are down some on offense?

 

Why Adrian Martinez increasingly stares down his primary receiver and has become the interception and fumble threat that Taylor Martinez and Tommy Armstrong once were?  Why Adrian hesitates to run when everyone in the stadium and on TV sees a first down there for the taking? Yes. I really don't understand what has happened to Adrians instincts and decision making, and that's coming from all quarters. 

 

Of course I see where you're going. The offensive line. Not great, but it's the same offensive line that let us put up 700 yards against Illinois, and came out firing on all cylinders in the first half against Colorado,  Dedrick Mills and Maurice Washington average 5.1 and 6.3 yards a carry respectively. The offensive line operates under a fairly large playbook and have been pretty good at the edges, yet play-calling keeps sending our small speedy backs up the middle, where this line is at its weakest.

 

It's no mystery that a freshman center with wildly high snaps would hurt your offense. But it is a mystery why he's still doing this six games into the season.  

 

I still think Mo Washington is the real deal, Wan'dale is a revelation, Spielman is as tough and dependable as they come, Jack Stoll is a prototypical Husker tight end, and Noa, Warner, and the others have earned more touches.  Stanley Morgan was a senior, and seniors graduate. Devine Ozigbo was a Riley leftover who started the season behind three other more favored backs and stepped up his game to earn the playing time. We miss them, but to think they were irreplaceable pieces of this offense isn't fair to the talent we have. 

 

Obviously we have some talent and playcalling issues. Most teams do. But the part where I'm not seeing progress is attitude. This team comes out the second half looking lifeless, no real adjustments made, no killer instinct, and even looking kinda lost. Honestly feels like a step back to me. Don't know what else to say other than six more games will tell a better story.

[Guy Chamberlin]

34 minutes ago, Mavric said:

 

 

And you are exactly making my point with the rest of your post.  There is nothing objective that says we aren't improving.  The only way you are saying we aren't improving is relative to expectations.  That doesn't make the expectations realistic or the perceptions true.

 

That's why I posed the question the way I did. 

 

Did you feel better about the team that ended the 2018 season, or the team that's 4-2 this season?

 

If you expected the Huskers to take a big step this year, you were being no more unrealistic than the professional college football analysts who thought Scott Frost was well positioned for his second season, and ranked Nebraska as high as #19. 

 

Again....I'm 100% certain we WILL trend forward. Hopefully soon. We're just not seeing on the field yet. 

[BigRedBuster]

9 minutes ago, Guy Chamberlin said:

 

Why Adrian Martinez increasingly stares down his primary receiver and has become the interception and fumble threat that Taylor Martinez and Tommy Armstrong once were?  Why Adrian hesitates to run when everyone in the stadium and on TV sees a first down there for the taking? Yes. I really don't understand what has happened to Adrians instincts and decision making, and that's coming from all quarters. 

 

Of course I see where you're going. The offensive line. Not great, but it's the same offensive line that let us put up 700 yards against Illinois, and came out firing on all cylinders in the first half against Colorado,  Dedrick Mills and Maurice Washington average 5.1 and 6.3 yards a carry respectively. The offensive line operates under a fairly large playbook and have been pretty good at the edges, yet play-calling keeps sending our small speedy backs up the middle, where this line is at its weakest.

 

It's no mystery that a freshman center with wildly high snaps would hurt your offense. But it is a mystery why he's still doing this six games into the season.  

 

I still think Mo Washington is the real deal, Wan'dale is a revelation, Spielman is as tough and dependable as they come, Jack Stoll is a prototypical Husker tight end, and Noa, Warner, and the others have earned more touches.  Stanley Morgan was a senior, and seniors graduate. Devine Ozigbo was a Riley leftover who started the season behind three other more favored backs and stepped up his game to earn the playing time. We miss them, but to think they were irreplaceable pieces of this offense isn't fair to the talent we have. 

 

Obviously we have some talent and playcalling issues. Most teams do. But the part where I'm not seeing progress is attitude. This team comes out the second half looking lifeless, no real adjustments made, no killer instinct, and even looking kinda lost. Honestly feels like a step back to me. Don't know what else to say other than six more games will tell a better story.

Almost everything you posted here can be marked up to 4 players being lost to graduation. Most of it by O linemen. 
 

are you going to hive this staff time to build developed depth or throw everything out at the earliest moment?  

[TheSker]

We are an overtime loss at Colorado away from being 5-1 and few eyebrows raised.

[Guy Chamberlin]

49 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said:

Almost everything you posted here can be marked up to 4 players being lost to graduation. Most of it by O linemen. 
 

are you going to hive this staff time to build developed depth or throw everything out at the earliest moment?  

 

I was just trying to stick to the thread: how we measure progress.

 

I'm still seeing too much regression for my taste. Could have sworn that was the general perception of even loyal Husker fans. Let's not pretend expectations weren't pretty high.  

 

No idea how or why you jumped to "throw everything out at the earliest moment."