Scott Frost at half time?

[TheSker]

1 minute ago, Undone said:

 

Jim Leonhard is 37 years old and came onto Chryst's staff in February of 2016 as defensive backs coach. Then in February of 2017 he was named defensive coordinator.

 

So he has one extra year on Chinander in total years on the Wisconsin staff...but has been the defensive coordinator the same amount of time. Now, Chryst has provided a stability as head coach since 2015 - that is for sure significant to the conversation. Very significant.

 

I've asked before how many years is the minimum amount of time before a fair judgment of Chinander's abilities can be cast. The answer, obviously, varies. I don't want him fired. I just want him to improve, and fast.

Frost does too.

 

Frost specifically mentioned how disruptive Chase Young is and that's what he needs to find.

 

Frost specifically mentioned the pass rush in the Indiana post game.

 

The recruiting trail is unbelievably important to Frost.  And Moos.

[TheSker]

3 minutes ago, Undone said:

 

Jim Leonhard is 37 years old and came onto Chryst's staff in February of 2016 as defensive backs coach. Then in February of 2017 he was named defensive coordinator.

 

So he has one extra year on Chinander in total years on the Wisconsin staff...but has been the defensive coordinator the same amount of time. Now, Chryst has provided a stability as head coach since 2015 - that is for sure significant to the conversation. Very significant.

 

I've asked before how many years is the minimum amount of time before a fair judgment of Chinander's abilities can be cast. The answer, obviously, varies. I don't want him fired. I just want him to improve, and fast.

And seriously, Wisconsin has the top defense in the country.

 

Yet two losses.

[Undone]

3 minutes ago, TheSker said:

And seriously, Wisconsin has the top defense in the country.

 

Yet two losses.

 

Please don't veer towards strawman-ing my argument into being that Wisconsin is the goal but actually they're 5-2 so we should aim higher.

 

We got embarrassed by Ohio State. They also got embarrassed by Ohio State. 

 

When we played Illinois we managed 690 yards of offense somehow. We allowed them to score 38 points. 

 

Wisconsin's offense wasn't able to overcome their turnovers but did hold the Illini to only 24 points. I'm willing to bet that our season record and Wisconsin's season record are drastically different, and that it will be in large part thanks to our anemic defense.

[TheSker]

2 minutes ago, Undone said:

 

Please don't veer towards strawman-ing my argument into being that Wisconsin is the goal but actually they're 5-2 so we should aim higher.

 

We got embarrassed by Ohio State. They also got embarrassed by Ohio State. 

 

When we played Illinois we managed 690 yards of offense somehow. We allowed them to score 38 points. 

 

Wisconsin's offense wasn't able to overcome their turnovers but did hold the Illini to only 24 points. I'm willing to bet that our season record and Wisconsin's season record are drastically different, and that it will be in large part thanks to our anemic defense.

Ohio State is the goal.

 

I like our chances of obtaining that with Frost versus Wisconsin with Christ.

[Landlord]

4 hours ago, ColoradoHusk said:

Are people mad about the quote, or possibly upset with his language?  If so, wow.

 

No. At least, I haven't seen anyone mad? Have you? 

 

 

 

 

3 hours ago, Hayseed said:

But if Pelini had said that... HOLY BALLS!!!.... it would be national headlines!

The Husker Goody Two Shoes Gang would be petitioning to run him out of town.

 

First of all I doubt it, but even if you're right it wouldn't have been about the words as much as the words with the combo of Bo's nasty pissy face and tone of voice and general sentiment that he'd punch the reporter if he was allowed to. Frost comes across as frustrated but considerate/respectful of the media doing their jobs. Bo came across as a resentful a$$ who hated every question ever posed.

[Undone]

1 minute ago, TheSker said:

Ohio State is the goal.

 

100% agree - Ohio State is the goal.

 

Can we get there with Chinander at the helm on defense? We don't know. We'll have to give it multiple more seasons to find out. What we do know is what Frost said last year verbatim in a weekly presser - he doesn't coach the defense, Chinander does. 

 

Again...a large cohort of fans will again make no end of excuses for Erik if our defense performs poorly next year. Hopefully he makes some adjustments and we finally have a good squad on that side of the ball next year.

[Decoy73]

55 minutes ago, Undone said:

 

Everyone that posts regularly on this board understands this. I have said this exact thing verbatim multiple times. However, what other metric would we possibly use if we are going to have a discussion about relative talent? Please think critically about that and then answer that question. You can cross-reference my posts in that other thread where I looked up stats on 24/7 Sports' page.

 

 

This is the convenient excuse; Chinander couldn't possibly coach some of the bad play out of some of these guys. Their brains are wrecked for good and they can't play football anymore because they were on a Mike Riley staff. If you really believe that, that's fine. I don't.

The fact is that we are not a good defensive team now. That’s pretty much indisputable. Whether that’s a talent issue, culture issue or a coaching issue, who the heck knows.  Probably some combination of all three.  I just think it would be wise to give the younger players at least 3 seasons with the same coaches and system before we can properly evaluate this.  

[Undone]

1 minute ago, Decoy73 said:

I just think it would be wise to give the younger players at least 3 seasons with the same coaches and system before we can properly evaluate this.  

 

Meaning, by the end of next season this judgment will be fair? I ask in earnest; going to add it to the running tally I have going.

[Decoy73]

8 minutes ago, Undone said:

 

Meaning, by the end of next season this judgment will be fair? I ask in earnest; going to add it to the running tally I have going.

Seems fair to me that if after next season, we haven’t seen defensive improvement, the needle points more to a coaching problem.  

[dtbugeater]

3 hours ago, Hayseed said:

But if Pelini had said that... HOLY BALLS!!!.... it would be national headlines!

The Husker Goody Two Shoes Gang would be petitioning to run him out of town.

What year? Bo 2008-2012 would have been loved for it. After that it would have been national news only because he had the reputation for saying and doing some crass things and became an easy target. 

[Igetbored216]

2 hours ago, TheSker said:

You are welcome to your interpretation, but I'm not interested in discussing because it would be a circular debate.

 

You're welcome to be as critical as you like.

 

It seems like it's been mentioned 1,000 times why recruiting rankings prior to Frost's arrival are meaningless.  A high percentage of those guys were part of the attrition of roster flipping.

 

Reading your above post, it seems rather obvious you don't think Frost is the right guy.

While the overall recruiting ratings would not be accurate for the reason you mention above (attrition), the actual ratings of the players that are starters on the depth chart show Nebraska with the slightest edge over Minnesota, and more of an edge over Indiana. If you looked at the ratings, and everything else was equal, you would say that Nebraska and Minnesota should be in a close game, and Nebraska should win comfortably against Indiana. 

 

So, I think Undone's interpretation might be closer to the truth than the "no talent" argument I keep seeing. 

 

A few notes:

1) The rating is from 247 sports, which I feel is a fair evaluation of talent

2) I got the depth charts from the team website. Just seeing Nebraska's week-to-week, the depth charts for other teams may not be 100% accurate. If there are mistakes, I would be happy to fix them

3) There were two players for Minnesota I couldn't find a composite rating for: Sam Renner and Jordan Howden. From what I understand, Sam is a walkon that had no other offers; Jordan had one other offer from Idaho St. 

ratings.pdf

[TheSker]

7 minutes ago, Igetbored216 said:

While the overall recruiting ratings would not be accurate for the reason you mention above (attrition), the actual ratings of the players that are starters on the depth chart show Nebraska with the slightest edge over Minnesota, and more of an edge over Indiana. If you looked at the ratings, and everything else was equal, you would say that Nebraska and Minnesota should be in a close game, and Nebraska should win comfortably against Indiana. 

 

So, I think Undone's interpretation might be closer to the truth than the "no talent" argument I keep seeing. 

 

A few notes:

1) The rating is from 247 sports, which I feel is a fair evaluation of talent

2) I got the depth charts from the team website. Just seeing Nebraska's week-to-week, the depth charts for other teams may not be 100% accurate. If there are mistakes, I would be happy to fix them

3) There were two players for Minnesota I couldn't find a composite rating for: Sam Renner and Jordan Howden. From what I understand, Sam is a walkon that had no other offers; Jordan had one other offer from Idaho St. 

ratings.pdf 39.24 kB · 1 download

I understand the debate of the actual player ratings from when they were in high school.

 

Football is not general ledger accounting, especially when the original numbers are up to 5 years old.

[Igetbored216]

10 minutes ago, TheSker said:

I understand the debate of the actual player ratings from when they were in high school.

 

Football is not general ledger accounting, especially when the original numbers are up to 5 years old.

What would change the ratings? Coaching? 

[TheSker]

1 minute ago, Igetbored216 said:

What would change the ratings? Coaching? 

Nothing would change the ratings.

 

But do some players develop better than others?  My vote would be obviously.

 

The Davis twins, as an example, have had how many defensive line coaches in college, how many strength and conditioning coaches, how many defensive coordinators?

[Maized & Confused]

2 hours ago, Decoy73 said:

Seems fair to me that if after next season, we haven’t seen defensive improvement, the needle points more to a coaching problem.

 

Agreed, it's way too early to start with rash judgments that any coaches need to be fired, but it seems fair to me that evaluations can be be made ongoing and if we continue with this crapshow on defense through this season and into the middle of next season, please do something about it before the end of next season.