For Comparison....

[Huskerchief]

2 hours ago, SFW said:

How did Clemson (Dabo) go from a below average team to perennial national title contenders??

 

He fired his defensive and offensive coordinators, and went out a got the best he could get.  Not friends not promoting from within.

 

Frosts assistants will make or break him.

 

Another year of 30 point Chinander and Frosts seat will be red hot.

This is a very good point, especially given what Dabo has done at Clemson. In my opinion, Dabo is kind of an outlier when it comes to Elite coaches as it took him 7 years to finally get it done. But part of that was definitely getting the right personnel in there. He got a lot of heat in 2010-2011 and finally in 2012 he made a change at defense coordinator by firing Kevin Steele. 

 

PPG for Clemson

Under Kevin Steele

2009- 21.8

2010- 18.6

2011- 29.5 

2012(Kevin Steele fired, Brent Venables hired)- 26.3

2013- 24.5 

2014- 17.5

2015- 20.8

2016- 19.3 

2017- 14.4

2018- 13.6

2019- 11.4 (currently)

 

Do you guys see a trend after Steele was fired, this is why you fire coordinators when they cant get it done, I wish Scott could see that sometimes.. 

[Nebfanatic]

2 minutes ago, Huskerchief said:

This is a very good point, especially given what Dabo has done at Clemson. In my opinion, Dabo is kind of an outlier when it comes to Elite coaches as it took him 7 years to finally get it done. But part of that was definitely getting the right personnel in there. He got a lot of heat in 2010-2011 and finally in 2012 he made a change at defense coordinator by firing Kevin Steele. 

 

PPG for Clemson

Under Kevin Steele

2009- 21.8

2010- 18.6

2011- 29.5 

2012(Kevin Steele fired, Brent Venables hired)- 26.3

2013- 24.5 

2014- 17.5

2015- 20.8

2016- 19.3 

2017- 14.4

2018- 13.6

2019- 11.4 (currently)

 

Do you guys see a trend after Steele was fired... 

Looks kinda like us post diaco......

[Cdog923]

3 hours ago, alexhortdog95 said:

 

 

Here's a thought - okay, let's not fire a guy.  Let's bring in a co-coordinator.  That's not a foreign idea.  Right now, the Buckeyes, Michigan, and other teams have a ton of co-coordinators.  And it seems to help, tremendously.  Buckeyes had one of the worst Ds last year, and it turned around and is the #2 Total D, #1 Scoring D in the country this year.

 

My thought is that you're not going to get a top flight coordinator like a Venables or Mattison.  You gotta get someone that is up and coming, but proven at the same time.

 

Thoughts?

 

Which coach are you going to fire to bring in this "co-coordinator"?

2 hours ago, SFW said:

How did Clemson (Dabo) go from a below average team to perennial national title contenders??

 

He fired his defensive and offensive coordinators, and went out a got the best he could get.  Not friends not promoting from within.

 

Frosts assistants will make or break him.

 

Another year of 30 point Chinander and Frosts seat will be red hot.

 

Counterpoint: no it won't. 

[Husker in WI]

2 minutes ago, Huskerchief said:

This is a very good point, especially given what Dabo has done at Clemson. In my opinion, Dabo is kind of an outlier when it comes to Elite coaches as it took him 7 years to finally get it done. But part of that was definitely getting the right personnel in there. He got a lot of heat in 2010-2011 and finally in 2012 he made a change at defense coordinator by firing Kevin Steele. 

 

PPG for Clemson

Under Kevin Steele

2009- 21.8

2010- 18.6

2011- 29.5 

2012(Kevin Steele fired, Brent Venables hired)- 26.3

2013- 24.5 

2014- 17.5

2015- 20.8

2016- 19.3 

2017- 14.4

2018- 13.6

2019- 11.4 (currently)

 

Do you guys see a trend after Steele was fired... 

 

And Steele's defenses at Auburn have done this:

 

2016 - 17.1

2017 - 18.5

2018 - 19.2

2019 - 17.4

 

He hasn't exactly been a slouch, so you could argue given more time and Clemson's improved recruiting they would  still be fine. Chins numbers are currently going down, and I don't know who the Brent Venables would be this year. Notice the biggest improvement is in Venables' 3rd year - lets see what Chins 3rd year is like.

[KingBlank]

3 hours ago, alexhortdog95 said:

 

No, YOU say I am saying that.  I know what I'm saying.

 

Like I said before:  I am in with the guy. 

But we've all heard "we're gonna fix it," and "it's on us," from now FOUR DIFFERENT COACHING STAFFS.

 

Bill Callahan:

“The bottom line is we need to make tackles. We need to make plays. That’s football and that’s life.  We have got to get better. We have to find a way to get better. It’s frustrating. We found ways to come back in this game and it still slipped away.  I’m taking it one game at a time. We will assess where we are after we watch game film. We are going to keep marching on. We make no excuses, none whatsoever. I take total accountability for what has happened.  We are going to keep working, keep pounding the rock. We are persistent and insistent on our philosophy we have tried to ingrain. We are going to keep pounding the rock."

Bo Pelini:
“Like I said all along, there's character in the room, we have to play smarter. We're not about moral victories. Nebraska never will be as long as I'm head coach. If we start being about moral victories, you need to get a new coach.  (This game) doesn't change what we have to do. We've got to go back to work. I told them one thing; this shows us is the potential we have as a football team. You can't get too high or too low, you've got to just go. This doesn't change what we've got to do tomorrow or the next game. We've got to keep progressing as a football team. You put in the hard work, you practice well, you learn the game plan, you do some things and execute.”

Mike Riley:

"When I go to bed tonight, I'll be hoping for that, because I would love to do this. I truly believe I'm exactly the right person to do this. The football parts, I've been doing it so long, we know how to fix, and we also are doing a good job recruiting."

 

Scott Frost:

"We had a long talk just that we all need to get better: coaches, players, everybody needs to get better," Frost said. "You know, the thing that I know how to do as a coach to keep moving it forward is just work harder. Keep practicing harder, keep trying to get guys better. And I told them that I think the last two games are games that we easily could have won, and we didn't for a lot of reasons and  there's stuff we can all do better. And the guys are hurting right now."

 

Don't know about you, but after you've heard the same thing over and over and over for over 15 years now....you get kinda tired of it.

Don't give me coach speak.  Give me results.  If you're willing to do what it takes to win, show me.  Because there have been two football coaches fired for on the field performance (Banker and Bohl), as far as I know.  Your commitment to win shows when you show me you don't practice nepotism (like the majority of the coaching ranks at the pro and college levels do).

Lol dude I was agreeing with that happens in these threads.  I know you don't think he should be fired.  I was making the joke that if you criticize him you get an immediate response from people "that you want him fired".  I have had the same accusation come at me before.  Sorry you had to run through I agree that criticism is warranted but it doesn't equal wanting him fired. 

 

Also Bo had it pretty fixed and his team was set to be really good, but that's another story for another day.

[Nebfanatic]

Using the information above Venables improved the defense 3.2ppg in year 1 and another 1.8ppg in year 2

 

For comparison Chinander improved our defense ppg 3.1 ppg in year 1 and another 4.2 ppg in year 2 

[Nebfanatic]

3 minutes ago, Husker in WI said:

 

And Steele's defenses at Auburn have done this:

 

2016 - 17.1

2017 - 18.5

2018 - 19.2

2019 - 17.4

 

He hasn't exactly been a slouch, so you could argue given more time and Clemson's improved recruiting they would  still be fine. Chins numbers are currently going down, and I don't know who the Brent Venables would be this year. Notice the biggest improvement is in Venables' 3rd year - lets see what Chins 3rd year is like.

Chinander has shaved more points off our point per game average than Venables did in his first 2 years so I don't know what point is trying to be made

[Huskerchief]

3 minutes ago, Husker in WI said:

 

And Steele's defenses at Auburn have done this:

 

2016 - 17.1

2017 - 18.5

2018 - 19.2

2019 - 17.4

 

He hasn't exactly been a slouch, so you could argue given more time and Clemson's improved recruiting they would  still be fine. Chins numbers are currently going down, and I don't know who the Brent Venables would be this year. Notice the biggest improvement is in Venables' 3rd year - lets see what Chins 3rd year is like.

 

Yeah I agree with you. Chin would be easier to analyze but he hasn't been anywhere more than two years 

 

2014 Oregon- 23

2015 Oregon- 37.2

 

2016 UCF- 26.7

2017 UCF- 24.7

 

2018 NEB- 33.3 

2019 NEB- 29.1

 

I hope year three has a dramatic flip somehow but its just hard too see.. 

[Husker in WI]

Just now, Nebfanatic said:

Chinander has shaved more points off our point per game average than Venables did in his first 2 years so I don't know what point is trying to be made

 

Right, I'm with you on that. And again, the biggest jump for Venables was year 3 - let's see Chins year 3 at least. The point of the Huskerchief's post was their defense reversed a slide after firing Steele, but as you pointed out our defense is still improving with Chinander so it's not the same. My additional point is I think Clemson probably still has similar success if they kept Steele, he's still considered a good DC.

[TheSker]

4 hours ago, alexhortdog95 said:

 

No, YOU say I am saying that.  I know what I'm saying.

 

Like I said before:  I am in with the guy. 

But we've all heard "we're gonna fix it," and "it's on us," from now FOUR DIFFERENT COACHING STAFFS.

 

Bill Callahan:

“The bottom line is we need to make tackles. We need to make plays. That’s football and that’s life.  We have got to get better. We have to find a way to get better. It’s frustrating. We found ways to come back in this game and it still slipped away.  I’m taking it one game at a time. We will assess where we are after we watch game film. We are going to keep marching on. We make no excuses, none whatsoever. I take total accountability for what has happened.  We are going to keep working, keep pounding the rock. We are persistent and insistent on our philosophy we have tried to ingrain. We are going to keep pounding the rock."

Bo Pelini:
“Like I said all along, there's character in the room, we have to play smarter. We're not about moral victories. Nebraska never will be as long as I'm head coach. If we start being about moral victories, you need to get a new coach.  (This game) doesn't change what we have to do. We've got to go back to work. I told them one thing; this shows us is the potential we have as a football team. You can't get too high or too low, you've got to just go. This doesn't change what we've got to do tomorrow or the next game. We've got to keep progressing as a football team. You put in the hard work, you practice well, you learn the game plan, you do some things and execute.”

Mike Riley:

"When I go to bed tonight, I'll be hoping for that, because I would love to do this. I truly believe I'm exactly the right person to do this. The football parts, I've been doing it so long, we know how to fix, and we also are doing a good job recruiting."

 

Scott Frost:

"We had a long talk just that we all need to get better: coaches, players, everybody needs to get better," Frost said. "You know, the thing that I know how to do as a coach to keep moving it forward is just work harder. Keep practicing harder, keep trying to get guys better. And I told them that I think the last two games are games that we easily could have won, and we didn't for a lot of reasons and  there's stuff we can all do better. And the guys are hurting right now."

 

Don't know about you, but after you've heard the same thing over and over and over for over 15 years now....you get kinda tired of it.

Don't give me coach speak.  Give me results.  If you're willing to do what it takes to win, show me.  Because there have been two football coaches fired for on the field performance (Banker and Bohl), as far as I know.  Your commitment to win shows when you show me you don't practice nepotism (like the majority of the coaching ranks at the pro and college levels do).

Show you.

 

Lol.

[Huskerchief]

4 minutes ago, Nebfanatic said:

Chinander has shaved more points off our point per game average than Venables did in his first 2 years so I don't know what point is trying to be made

 

Well for one the number of points overall....

 

I think its a little easier to lower some PPG when you are giving up 30 every-game as opposed to 10-20

[Courtesy Flush]

Fortitude is something we expect from our players and coaches, but apparently not something we can expect of our fan base. If this program falls apart, it will be due to constant change and lack of fortitude from the fans living in the past. At some point we have to show we stand for something, anything, other than constant change.
 

This article is spot on in my opinion:

 

https://www.orlandosentinel.com/sports/mike-bianchi-commentary/os-sp-ucf-scott-frost-nebraska-cornhuskers-20191030-5rh3kc2jf5hzhhvvpc6zscwyky-story.html

 

 

[Nebfanatic]

Just now, Husker in WI said:

 

Right, I'm with you on that. And again, the biggest jump for Venables was year 3 - let's see Chins year 3 at least. The point of the Huskerchief's post was their defense reversed a slide after firing Steele, but as you pointed out our defense is still improving with Chinander so it's not the same. My additional point is I think Clemson probably still has similar success if they kept Steele, he's still considered a good DC.

Yep its just too early with Chin right now. Will he forever be the answer? Maybe not but right now its too early too tell and honestly I think we benefit more from the continuity than we would from finding the best possible DC.

 

Just now, Huskerchief said:

 

Well for one the number of points overall....

But they didn't start from the same place so how is that a fair comparison? The defense Chinander inherited was giving up 8 more points per game than the one Venables inherited. He didn't magically take them from 29.5 ppg allowed to 11 in one season. He gradually improved the defense in the same way Chinander is doing now.

[Husker in WI]

4 minutes ago, Huskerchief said:

 

Yeah I agree with you. Chin would be easier to analyze but he hasn't been anywhere more than two years 

 

2014 Oregon- 23

2015 Oregon- 37.2

 

2016 UCF- 26.7

2017 UCF- 24.7

 

2018 NEB- 33.3 

2019 NEB- 29.1

 

I hope year three has a dramatic flip somehow but its just hard too see.. 

 

Well include the baselines too.. UCF was 37.7 the year before he got there. We were 36.4. He also had to have been the worst OLB coach of all time for us to credit much of Oregon's implosion solely to him. If we got stagnant in year 3 I'll be a little more concerned for sure, we don't have a lot to go on yet.

[Nebfanatic]

2 minutes ago, Husker in WI said:

 

Well include the baselines too.. UCF was 37.7 the year before he got there. We were 36.4. He also had to have been the worst OLB coach of all time for us to credit much of Oregon's implosion solely to him. If we got stagnant in year 3 I'll be a little more concerned for sure, we don't have a lot to go on yet.

So whenever he has been DC his unit allows less points than they did the year before. Hmmmm......