Wisconsin Post Game Thread

[lo country]

1 minute ago, Mavric said:

 

Just making things up now?

 

Held was #40 in 2018.  He was half-time on the job for less than three weeks before the vast majority of recruits signed.  So you picked a year when he had almost no time to actually recruit and still slighted him. 

 

Good work.  Very objective.

 

And he's currently #27, not #40.  Just keep pulling numbers out of thin air.

@Mavric  So where does the staff at say Clemson/Bama/OSU etc rank.  Do these teams have top 25 guys (several) or like on etop guy and everyone else is scattered throughout the rankings.

[Mavric]

9 hours ago, Mavric said:

Per the 247 Composite, we have 11 four-stars on defense (Jackson, Lee, Henrich, NPG, TRobinson, Dismuke, Darrion Daniels, Wildeman, Tannor, Anderson and Green). 

 

Two of those are Pelini recruits (Lee and Anderson)

Two are Riley recruits (Jackson and Dismuke)

The other seven are all Frost recruits.  Four of them are on the defensive line.  Five of them have barely played because this is their first year in the program.

 

Add Gray to the seven and Frost has gotten more four-star recruits then Riley left him in three years.  Even though Pelini hasn't been here for five years he's still contributing as much to these numbers as Riley is.

 

Carlos Davis (Pelini) is our next highest-rated defensive player.  The next three are Frost recruits (Hannah, Honas and DWilliams) followed by Khalil Davis (Pelini).  Meaning Riley left Chinander a grand total of two of our 16 highest-rated defensive players.  Only six of our 16 highest-rated defensive players were not recruited by Frost.  

 

And all that is coming off back-to-back 4-8 seasons.

 

I think they deserve a little time to right the ship before passing too much judgement.

 

One further note on this:

 

Out of those Top 16 defensive players, only four of them are linebackers.  All four are Frost recruits.  Two of them are true freshmen that basically haven't played yet (Henrich and Hannah).  

 

So they were left no decently-rated linebackers to work with in a defense where over a third of the guys one the field are linebackers.

[lo country]

Just saw Mills only got 5 carries the second half.......

[Nebfanatic]

33 minutes ago, KingBlank said:

Ok give me the facts then boss

Asks for the facts, ignores them when they don't support his narrative.

3 minutes ago, lo country said:

@Mavric  So where does the staff at say Clemson/Bama/OSU etc rank.  Do these teams have top 25 guys (several) or like on etop guy and everyone else is scattered throughout the rankings.

Who cares? Clemson and Bama have multiple 5 and 4 star guys a stones throw away. We aren't going to ever be right with them in any of these sort of rankings. What Moos meant we are doing. Bama wanted Robinson and Pola Gates but we got them. Clemson wanted Jimmy Fritze(sp.) We got him.

[TheSker]

9 hours ago, Mavric said:

 

 

Per the 247 Composite, we have 11 four-stars on defense (Jackson, Lee, Henrich, NPG, TRobinson, Dismuke, Darrion Daniels, Wildeman, Tannor, Anderson and Green). 

 

Two of those are Pelini recruits (Lee and Anderson)

Two are Riley recruits (Jackson and Dismuke)

The other seven are all Frost recruits.  Four of them are on the defensive line.  Five of them have barely played because this is their first year in the program.

 

Add Gray to the seven and Frost has gotten more four-star recruits then Riley left him in three years.  Even though Pelini hasn't been here for five years he's still contributing as much to these numbers as Riley is.

 

Carlos Davis (Pelini) is our next highest-rated defensive player.  The next three are Frost recruits (Hannah, Honas and DWilliams) followed by Khalil Davis (Pelini).  Meaning Riley left Chinander a grand total of two of our 16 highest-rated defensive players.  Only six of our 16 highest-rated defensive players were not recruited by Frost.  

 

And all that is coming off back-to-back 4-8 seasons.

 

I think they deserve a little time to right the ship before passing too much judgement.

This is a great look at the talent level and how badly Riley hurt the program.

 

With several more additions needed to this year's recruiting class, hopefully Frost finishes it strong and the juco signees can help right away.

[Mavric]

1 minute ago, lo country said:

@Mavric  So where does the staff at say Clemson/Bama/OSU etc rank.  Do these teams have top 25 guys (several) or like on etop guy and everyone else is scattered throughout the rankings.

 

For 2020, Clemson has #1, #14, #15 and #56 (in the Top 100)

Ohio State has #2, #4 and #66

Georgia has #3 and #60

Texas has #5 (Tim Beck, if you're curious), #34, #39, #48 and #67

LSU has #6, #7, #11, #41 and #74

Notre Dame has #8, #47, #68 and #87

Oklahoma has #9 and #82

Auburn has #10, #37, #38 and #73

Oregon has #12, #42, #59 and #63

Alabama has #13, #21, #24 and #43

Texas A&M has #16, #17, #54, #79 and #92

 

That's nearly half of the Top 100 on those 11 teams.

 

But I don't think those recruiter rankings are all that reliable.  It requires 247 to apply the proper guy recruiting a player to each player.  I'm far from convinced that actually gets done correctly and uniformly.  And it's skewed to the teams that have have traditionally recruited well.

 

For example, Ohio State almost always pulls in a Top 5 class but only has two of the Top 60 recruiters and Larry Johnson doesn't even make the Top 100.  Georgia has the #5 class in the country and only has one inside the Top 60.  Oklahoma has the #10 class and only has one of the Top 80.  

 

It's just a fluff piece to get clicks, imo.

[Wistrom Disciple]

19 minutes ago, lo country said:

Just saw Mills only got 5 carries the second half.......

Frustrating but we were down two scores so we got pass happy.

[Waldo]

1 hour ago, lo country said:

Just saw Mills only got 5 carries the second half.......

We are making adjustments!!

[PaulCrewe]

1 hour ago, Mavric said:

 

One further note on this:

 

Out of those Top 16 defensive players, only four of them are linebackers.  All four are Frost recruits.  Two of them are true freshmen that basically haven't played yet (Henrich and Hannah).  

 

So they were left no decently-rated linebackers to work with in a defense where over a third of the guys one the field are linebackers.

Just curious here.

 

Since the 2013 recruiting classes per 247 composite rankings, Wisky, Iowa and Minny have each only had 1 “decently ranked” (ie four star) linebacker sign with them.  So maybe coaching?

[grandpasknee]

1 hour ago, Mavric said:

 

For 2020, Clemson has #1, #14, #15 and #56 (in the Top 100)

Ohio State has #2, #4 and #66

Georgia has #3 and #60

Texas has #5 (Tim Beck, if you're curious), #34, #39, #48 and #67

LSU has #6, #7, #11, #41 and #74

Notre Dame has #8, #47, #68 and #87

Oklahoma has #9 and #82

Auburn has #10, #37, #38 and #73

Oregon has #12, #42, #59 and #63

Alabama has #13, #21, #24 and #43

Texas A&M has #16, #17, #54, #79 and #92

 

That's nearly half of the Top 100 on those 11 teams.

 

But I don't think those recruiter rankings are all that reliable.  It requires 247 to apply the proper guy recruiting a player to each player.  I'm far from convinced that actually gets done correctly and uniformly.  And it's skewed to the teams that have have traditionally recruited well.

 

For example, Ohio State almost always pulls in a Top 5 class but only has two of the Top 60 recruiters and Larry Johnson doesn't even make the Top 100.  Georgia has the #5 class in the country and only has one inside the Top 60.  Oklahoma has the #10 class and only has one of the Top 80.  

 

It's just a fluff piece to get clicks, imo.

And, if you look at those programs and the recruiting level of their respective recruiters, you need to take into account the recent success of those programs.  A program like Alabama or Clemson will certainly allow an average recruiter to look like a superstar,  just because of the product they are selling.  None of them are recruiting to teams that have been in the dumpster for 10 years.  The fact we get any four star recruits is a freaking miracle in my book, considering our recent lack of success on the field.

[Hayseed]

1 hour ago, Mavric said:

 

Just making things up now?

 

Held was #40 in 2018.  He was half-time on the job for less than three weeks before the vast majority of recruits signed.  So you picked a year when he had almost no time to actually recruit and still slighted him. 

 

Good work.  Very objective.

 

And he's currently #27, not #40.  Just keep pulling numbers out of thin air.

I don't have a lot of confidence in these self-appointed rankers anyway. Half of their supposed 4 star players don't pan out and a 10 year old could tell you the team that gets all the highest ranked players will have more options. They just don't seem very useful once you get out of the top ten schools and try to rank ordinary teams.

[Danimal]

20 hours ago, EngineeringHusker said:

Probably based off the two whole times they were forced to punt...

 

If Chryst sticks to what they were gouging us with not sure we even get that. He and Frost both repeatedly went away from what was working. 

[teachercd]

Offense looked pretty good.

 

I think Frost even knows that the defense is not working.

[KingBlank]

1 hour ago, Nebfanatic said:

Asks for the facts, ignores them when they don't support his narrative.

Who cares? Clemson and Bama have multiple 5 and 4 star guys a stones throw away. We aren't going to ever be right with them in any of these sort of rankings.   Moos meant we are doing. Bama wanted Robinson and Pola Gates but we got them. Clemson wanted Jimmy Fritze(sp.) We got him.

You just put some arbitrary numbers a website is giving out, because we sure don't before like the classes we bring in.  Secondly you arguing against that exact same website in this thread bro.  Again the actual games talk. 

[BetterDayByDay]

The instant gratification crowd that "want it now" mentality. Not wasting my energy on them. Why even bother with that mess. Everyone knew going into this with a new coach that things were in shambles. Being on the outside looking in, we just dont know how bad it was.  We dont know what residue is still there from two different coaches and just how deep some of that rot is left behind. Obviously, Tyrin Ferguson could of been some of that rot. But we just dont know. What I do see is most of the team is on board but I am sure there are a handful of holdouts. But if they are the "best" you have and they are not totally rotten. Then you go with what you have. The most childish thing I read on here and on other social media posts are the worst. Fire Frost, Fire Chinander, blah, blah, blah. Those kinds of people lack patience and definitely do not fit the bill of "grown up" by any means. 

 

Heard the same crap for the first 20 years of Osborne's tenure as football coach. The best, and most intelligent thing out of that was the powers that be had the patience and resolve to stick with it. Sometimes, you just have to block out the insanity and role with the punches. So the "instant gratification" crowd and pound sand. Why? Sitting on the outside, looking in, and only seeing a small fraction of what is truly going on does not allow those to make educated, or intelligent assessments. The team is getting better and it shows. You can see those that truly give their all. Firing a defensive coach in year two is not the answer. There is just no real talent on the team at this time to provide a good pass rush. 

 

In the end, it takes less time to destroy something. Takes longer to build something worth while. Be happy someone wants to be here and correct the damage. It is written in his face, and emotions. You want instant gratification? Go buy a box of lucky charms. I hear their "magically" delicious.