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2020 Quarterback Competition


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5 hours ago, The Dude said:

 

10 TDs to 9 INTs is bad.  There's no getting around it.

But there is a way around it.  If you understand all the dynamics from the season, those stats are likely much better than what many QBs would have produced.  Those unwilling to truly understand all elements from the season will almost always blame the QB when results aren't good.  Reality is they can only control so much of what happening.  

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8 minutes ago, Landlord said:

 

 

There's an easy way getting around it. We never called pass plays in the red zone. Like hardly ever. 

 

Is being in the top 3 of the conference all season in total yards per game bad?

Red zone offense was a challenge for Frost as a play caller.  There wasn't a receiver who could create separation or make plays with size and athleticism.  There is less space in the red zone, so it required Martinez to make quick decisions and accurate passes,  which he struggled in 2019.  Frost also didn't trust the o-line for most of the year to just plow ahead with run plays.  Frost tried to get creative (which some people would call cute) and it didn't always work.  I think the biggest thing the red zone struggles showed was that there is a need for talent upgrade across the skill positions, and continued development of the o-line.

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17 hours ago, The Dude said:

 

10 TDs to 9 INTs is bad.  There's no getting around it.

If farniok and Wilson make two of the easier blocks I’ve seen against Purdue and Wisconsin that’s 12 td to 9 int.  My point is not many ppl are saying AM had a good yr, the point is that his struggles were shared by failures across ALL players on offense.  I’ve seen good AM, I have yet to see GOOD Wilson or farniok.  

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There was plenty of blame to go around.  Missed passes QBs should be able to make in their sleep.  Running out of bounds for a 5 yd loss (throw it away for crying out loud).  Embarrassingly whiffed blocks it open space.  Undependable snaps.  WRs failing to create separation or sustain blocks.  Ridiculously poor kick coverage.  Team defensive hustle dried up after the 1st half of the Colorado game (Where'd the gang tackling go?).  Nonexistent pass rush.  The list goes on.  Inconsistency was the killer.  Play makers can be game changers, but until we can field 11 player who can execute play in and play out, the games that should be "blow outs" will be close and many of the close games will be losses.  Lets hope year 3 is the year where consistency in execution reigns.

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10 hours ago, N is for nowledge said:

If farniok and Wilson make two of the easier blocks I’ve seen against Purdue and Wisconsin that’s 12 td to 9 int.  My point is not many ppl are saying AM had a good yr, the point is that his struggles were shared by failures across ALL players on offense.  I’ve seen good AM, I have yet to see GOOD Wilson or farniok.  

 

12 TDs to 9 INTs would still be extraordinarily bad.

 

We can play "what if" like this and hypothetically improve every QB's stats in the country if we wanted to.  It doesn't  work like that.

 

The fact of the matter is Martinez was bad.

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15 hours ago, Landlord said:

 

 

There's an easy way getting around it. We never called pass plays in the red zone. Like hardly ever. 

 

Just so we're perfectly clear what's going on here.  Everyone agrees Martinez was extremely bad in terms of one of the most important criteria to judge a QB's performance (TD-INT ratio), lot of you are simply trying to blame everyone but him. 

Let's ignore the fact this is the same mental gymnastics everyone performed to pretend Tanner Lee was good.

 

15 hours ago, Landlord said:

 

Is being in the top 3 of the conference all season in total yards per game bad?

 

No, it's top 3.

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2 hours ago, The Dude said:

 

12 TDs to 9 INTs would still be extraordinarily bad.

 

We can play "what if" like this and hypothetically improve every QB's stats in the country if we wanted to.  It doesn't  work like that.

 

The fact of the matter is Martinez was bad.

Correct.  Look at pretty much every other top QB in the country and his TD/INt ratio. That is what AMart needs to be at (or whoever the starter is). 

 

He is and has been turnover prone and many times at costly points in the game.  

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3 hours ago, The Dude said:

 

12 TDs to 9 INTs would still be extraordinarily bad.

 

We can play "what if" like this and hypothetically improve every QB's stats in the country if we wanted to.  It doesn't  work like that.

 

The fact of the matter is Martinez was bad.

You are missing the point several people are trying to make.  The stat itself is bad.  However, Martinez is only part of the equation that goes into td/int ratio.  You can't throw TDS to people that aren't open.  You have to force passes occasionally when playing from a big deficit.  You get jumpy when snaps are rarely on target.  You get jumpy when you don't have faith in your line.  You can only run the plays called.  It was a bad situation to be in last year for a QB.

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3 hours ago, The Dude said:

 

12 TDs to 9 INTs would still be extraordinarily bad.

 

We can play "what if" like this and hypothetically improve every QB's stats in the country if we wanted to.  It doesn't  work like that.

 

The fact of the matter is Martinez was bad.

That literally wasn’t what I said.  I said AM was not good.  My larger point is it was a failure of 11 guys not one, AM doesn’t play in some sort of bubble.  We’ve seen what good AM looks like, I’m still waiting to see what good Wilson or farniok looks like.  

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Many of his critics are not impressed with his raw stats last year and they are not good by any reasonable comparative look but the biggest issue for me is more the lack of “it” factor plays.   I understand that his supporting cast was not good.  This hurts him too.  One can look past those things but its hard to point to very many special plays he made something out of nothing for example.  His highlight video would be pretty short so far with “difference maker” kinds of plays. In my opinion Frost’s offense by design requires a very special player as QB - its QB centric essentially and being a basic manager is not enough.  He needs to have and actually use exceptional run skills as well as read and throw with rare accuracy. Being average is not good enough to help the team overcome problems.   Maybe none of our QBs have this “it factor” but until we see it in AM there will be plenty of interest in trying other guys to see what happens.  We are not winning for many reasons and less than stellar QB play is one major one.  

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4 hours ago, The Dude said:

 

12 TDs to 9 INTs would still be extraordinarily bad.

 

We can play "what if" like this and hypothetically improve every QB's stats in the country if we wanted to.  It doesn't  work like that.

 

The fact of the matter is Martinez was bad.

 

Exactly, and for example Martinez's TD to Spielman in the Maryland game was almost picked by two players before falling into Spielman's arms. The 'what if' game would result in a 9 TD to 10 INT ratio. 

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1 hour ago, Hilltop said:

You are missing the point several people are trying to make.  The stat itself is bad.  However, Martinez is only part of the equation that goes into td/int ratio.  You can't throw TDS to people that aren't open.  You have to force passes occasionally when playing from a big deficit.  You get jumpy when snaps are rarely on target.  You get jumpy when you don't have faith in your line.  You can only run the plays called.  It was a bad situation to be in last year for a QB.

Then what about the missed td or drive killing missed passes when people ARE open?  It goes both ways.  Plenty of examples of both.

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