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The P&R Plague Thread (Covid-19)


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10 minutes ago, Redux said:

 

He literally did not say drink fish tank CLEANER.  He mentioned a drug a fish tank CLEANER contains.  This should be obvious to not do that.  Coffee shouldn't need a warning.  But this is our world.  He shouldn't even say things, duh.  Let his Doctor do that.  But my god, come on.

Just maybe the piece of s#!t needs to stop playing doctor on TV.

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2 minutes ago, Redux said:

 

Yup, lying if you look at it one way.  I know the shtick, the number skewing.  It's all bulls#!t.  He doesn't need to say anything other than "we are working on it".  But he is Trump and he's going to say crap that can be put under a microscope so people can get in a tizzy and waste days poking holes in what he said.  He does it on purpose, has been for 3.5 yrs.

Lying if you look at it any way. Skewing the numbers is lying. Sort of like the whole we only have 15 cases it will be zero soon thing. That's a LIE not optimism, not skewing the numbers, but a lie. An important lie that makes people think the media is the one lying and all of this isn't so bad. Trump said there is 1 million tests, so the media is lying about the difficulties of getting tested. These are outright lies that have direct consequences for us all.

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4 minutes ago, Redux said:

But he is Trump and he's going to say crap that can be put under a microscope so people can get in a tizzy and waste days poking holes in what he said.  He does it on purpose, has been for 3.5 yrs.

And, it's why we need someone else for the next 4.  It doesn't absolve him of harsh criticism simply because "It's trump and he's been doing it for 3.5 years."

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I will say this about the current situation.  The President needs to be honest with the American people.  Filling everyone with BS is not helping anyone.  Everyone (except the staunchest Trumpees) knows he's full of s#!t.

 

However, I cringe when people are all pissed off because we don't have enough ventilators or PPE and start pointing fingers.  This pandemic literally came on very very fast.  Yes, Trump should have taken it more seriously between December and February.  That is 100% all on him and he should be nailed for it.

 

BUT....we had a stock pile of ventilators and PPE.  Problem was, it wasn't enough for this specific pandemic.  They are ramping up production of everything.  Look at what companies like Ford are doing to produce ventilators.  

 

The media is right to report on the shortages.  What bothers me is the pointing of fingers claiming someone personally is responsible for people dying because we didn't have 100,000 more ventilators in the US.

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4 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said:

I will say this about the current situation.  The President needs to be honest with the American people.  Filling everyone with BS is not helping anyone.  Everyone (except the staunchest Trumpees) knows he's full of s#!t.

 

However, I cringe when people are all pissed off because we don't have enough ventilators or PPE and start pointing fingers.  This pandemic literally came on very very fast.  Yes, Trump should have taken it more seriously between December and February.  That is 100% all on him and he should be nailed for it.

 

BUT....we had a stock pile of ventilators and PPE.  Problem was, it wasn't enough for this specific pandemic.  They are ramping up production of everything.  Look at what companies like Ford are doing to produce ventilators.  

 

The media is right to report on the shortages.  What bothers me is the pointing of fingers claiming someone personally is responsible for people dying because we didn't have 100,000 more ventilators in the US.

The problem with all of that is when Trump is telling NY they don't need as many ventilators as they are asking for and is not invoking the Defense Production Act to increase ventilator production 

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27 minutes ago, Nebfanatic said:

The problem with all of that is when Trump is telling NY they don't need as many ventilators as they are asking for and is not invoking the Defense Production Act to increase ventilator production 

Nothing I said absolves him of the BS he's spewing daily.  But, we already have companies switching over to make ventilators and PPEs.  I scratch my head wondering would the DPA really make that big of a difference speeding up the transition.

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2 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said:

Nothing I said absolves him of the BS he's spewing daily.  But, we already have companies switching over to make ventilators and PPEs.  I scratch my head wondering would the DPA really make that big of a difference speeding up the transition.

It's not just spewing BS though, that will directly affect how much production capability they think they need and how many are actually produced. If they under produce because Trump is saying so because he doesn't think NY needs that many ventilators that directly leads to unnecessary deaths.

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3 minutes ago, teachercd said:

Are any of you in a factory/production type job?  Is it hard/easy to switch over what you are making?

I said earlier, I would love to see a documentary some time on how Ford is doing this.  It has to be an amazing task to switch a factory over from making cars to making ventilators.  

 

For us, if I were to want to produce something similar, but different it would take 4-6 months at the earliest.  That's using the same equipment, just new tooling.

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6 minutes ago, Nebfanatic said:

It's not just spewing BS though, that will directly affect how much production capability they think they need and how many are actually produced. If they under produce because Trump is saying so because he doesn't think NY needs that many ventilators that directly leads to unnecessary deaths.

Not sure how much more I can agree with you that he needs to stop spewing his BS.

 

 

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51 minutes ago, BigRedBuster said:

However, I cringe when people are all pissed off because we don't have enough ventilators or PPE and start pointing fingers.  This pandemic literally came on very very fast.  Yes, Trump should have taken it more seriously between December and February.  That is 100% all on him and he should be nailed for it.

 

BUT....we had a stock pile of ventilators and PPE.  Problem was, it wasn't enough for this specific pandemic.  They are ramping up production of everything.  Look at what companies like Ford are doing to produce ventilators.  

 

The media is right to report on the shortages.  What bothers me is the pointing of fingers claiming someone personally is responsible for people dying because we didn't have 100,000 more ventilators in the US.

 

I think before you get too far up on the stump to defend Trump's response to these shortages you should look further into what he has done directly to address them, what he could have done, and who that inaction is most affecting. 

 

Instead of all the BS he spewed in the first several weeks of the pandemic, he could have stood at his podium and encouraged manufacturers to switch production to PPE and respirators. We lost weeks because of his inaction, or outright lies, and now we are the epicenter of this crisis.

 

Specifically, New York is. And that's politically expedient for Trump. And that makes any defense of him pretty questionable.

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Abstract from the paper (emphasis mine):

Quote

Abstract
What are the economic consequences of an influenza pandemic? And given the pandemic, what are the economic costs and benefits of non-pharmaceutical interventions (NPI)? Using geographic variation in mortality during the 1918 Flu Pandemic in the U.S., we find that more exposed areas experience a sharp and persistent decline in economic activity. The estimates imply that the pandemic reduced manufacturing output by 18%. The downturn is driven by both supply and demand-side channels. Further, building on findings from the epidemiology literature establishing that NPIs decrease influenza mortality, we use variation in the timing and intensity of NPIs across U.S. cities to study their economic effects. We find that cities that intervened earlier and more aggressively do not perform worse and, if anything, grow faster after the pandemic is over. Our findings thus indicate that NPIs not only lower mortality; they also mitigate the adverse economic consequences of a pandemic.

 

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