The P&R Plague Thread (Covid-19)

[Guy Chamberlin]

1 hour ago, Jason Sitoke said:

I hear you. My take away wasn’t necessarily the ‘living in fear’ angle. I think the point is to ask ourselves at each stage why we’re doing what we’re doing, and saying ‘well, kids aren’t complaining’ is a cop out. We’ve established that the risk to kids is minimal, and yet we feel justified to take measures to reduce this risk from some small value to some slightly smaller value. However, when the potential fallout to these same kids might be more than zero, we seem to dismiss it out of hand. So on one hand our kids should be uber protected, but on the other hand…’eh, they’re probably fine’.  If the answer is that kids need to be masked or school remotely to protect adults at all costs, then it’s kinda proving the point that The NY Times article (linked in the article I posted) was making. 

 

There has definitely been self-righteous finger-wagging among the "stay home, stay safe" set, but while I heard many people say their kids were doing better than expected, I never heard anyone say that was evidence they were doing fine, or didn't need to get back to school as soon as possible. 

 

Again, so much of this was driven in different directions by different school districts and teacher's unions that it's unfair to lay this at the feet of parents -- which this essay tries to do -- or science, which dutifully reported that kids appeared relatively unaffected at various stages of the pandemic. 

 

But if you're a school administrator or elected official and you answer to parents, you might think a mask requirement is a reasonable compromise to get teachers, students and staff back to school, without arguing efficacy stats. A kid who wears a mask in class isn't being resilient or exploited. They're just wearing a mask. The COVID vaccine they got joins several other lifesaving vaccines that pediatricians have required for years.  It's going to be over soon.

 

The U.S. probably got the school thing wrong, and fear-mongering played a role. But we got a lot of other things wrong, including the 880,000 dead folks, many who didn't need to die. 

[teachercd]

19 minutes ago, Guy Chamberlin said:

 

There has definitely been self-righteous finger-wagging among the "stay home, stay safe" set, but while I heard many people say their kids were doing better than expected, I never heard anyone say that was evidence they were doing fine, or didn't need to get back to school as soon as possible. 

 

Again, so much of this was driven in different directions by different school districts and teacher's unions that it's unfair to lay this at the feet of parents -- which this essay tries to do -- or science, which dutifully reported that kids appeared relatively unaffected at various stages of the pandemic. 

 

But if you're a school administrator or elected official and you answer to parents, you might think a mask requirement is a reasonable compromise to get teachers, students and staff back to school, without arguing efficacy stats. A kid who wears a mask in class isn't being resilient or exploited. They're just wearing a mask. The COVID vaccine they got joins several other lifesaving vaccines that pediatricians have required for years.  It's going to be over soon.

 

The U.S. probably got the school thing wrong, and fear-mongering played a role. But we got a lot of other things wrong, including the 880,000 dead folks, many who didn't need to die. 

The US did get it wrong but then crazy parents helped with that and then crazy teacher unions helped with that.  By helped I mean, helped make it worse.

[Guy Chamberlin]

Other countries did better. At least a little better. At least some of the time. Or not. 

 

Turns out global pandemics are pretty messy, and nobody got everything right.

 

Americans want definitive answers and we want them now, preferably answers that don't inconvenience us. At the very least, we demand someone to blame. 

 

 

[Guy Chamberlin]

I do think that folks with an anti-vax, anti-mask agenda have a reasonable overlap with legitimate researchers and risk analysts in that the psychological and socializing damage of Covid restrictions on kids deserves every bit as much consideration as the physical risks. 

 

When the science doesn't support your argument, it doesn't mean it's playing into the hand of your enemy. Sometimes it's just the science. 

 

My beef with the essay is that she created a straw man parent to blame, having introduced herself as the more courageous and savvy mother. 

[teachercd]

29 minutes ago, Guy Chamberlin said:

I do think that folks with an anti-vax, anti-mask agenda have a reasonable overlap with legitimate researchers and risk analysts in that the psychological and socializing damage of Covid restrictions on kids deserves every bit as much consideration as the physical risks. 

 

When the science doesn't support your argument, it doesn't mean it's playing into the hand of your enemy. Sometimes it's just the science. 

 

My beef with the essay is that she created a straw man parent to blame, having introduced herself as the more courageous and savvy mother. 

My only issue would be with parents that think it is better for their kids to be at home and with teachers that think they should teach from home.  

 

I do get it MORE from the teacher side though because they might be a lot older and have health issues.

[Guy Chamberlin]

57 minutes ago, teachercd said:

My only issue would be with parents that think it is better for their kids to be at home and with teachers that think they should teach from home.  

 

I do get it MORE from the teacher side though because they might be a lot older and have health issues.

 

Did you have a lot of parents fighting to keep the schools from re-opening? My understanding is that there was always an opt-out for parents who wanted to keep their kids at home for whatever reason, but they could not prevent other students from attending in-person. 

 

I'm guessing the schools that never re-opened had a lot of issues even in non-Covid times. 

 

Also, don't underestimate the number of shy, bullied, or naturally introverted people who considered pandemic social distancing a dream come true. 

[Jason Sitoke]

13 minutes ago, Guy Chamberlin said:

 

Did you have a lot of parents fighting to keep the schools from re-opening? My understanding is that there was always an opt-out for parents who wanted to keep their kids at home for whatever reason, but they could not prevent other students from attending in-person. 

 

I'm guessing the schools that never re-opened had a lot of issues even in non-Covid times. 

 

Also, don't underestimate the number of shy, bullied, or naturally introverted people who considered pandemic social distancing a dream come true. 

Fair point. I’m introverted and probably would’ve been thrilled to stay home. However most of the friends I have/had were because I was forced to sit with someone during class or lunch. Wouldn’t have found my circle otherwise. 

[Guy Chamberlin]

2 minutes ago, Jason Sitoke said:

Fair point. I’m introverted and probably would’ve been thrilled to stay home. However most of the friends I have/had were because I was forced to sit with someone during class or lunch. Wouldn’t have found my circle otherwise. 

 

I like to think of myself as an extrovert, but I really need people to kick me out of the house and comfort zone. 

 

 

[teachercd]

20 minutes ago, Guy Chamberlin said:

 

Did you have a lot of parents fighting to keep the schools from re-opening? My understanding is that there was always an opt-out for parents who wanted to keep their kids at home for whatever reason, but they could not prevent other students from attending in-person. 

 

I'm guessing the schools that never re-opened had a lot of issues even in non-Covid times. 

 

Also, don't underestimate the number of shy, bullied, or naturally introverted people who considered pandemic social distancing a dream come true. 

At my school?  If I had to guess I would say like 75 to 25 in favor of being opened.

 

And we don't have a "learn from home" option but I am sure some districts do.

 

 

[Jason Sitoke]

11 minutes ago, Guy Chamberlin said:

 

I like to think of myself as an extrovert, but I really need people to kick me out of the house and comfort zone. 

 

 

The best definition(s) I ever heard were:

If you feel energized by talking to people, you’re an extrovert. If you feel drained, you’re an introvert. You can be extremely charismatic and funny, and still be introverted. I am definitely an introvert. I have fun with groups of people, but I always have to make an excuse to leave the room periodically just to recharge. Even around family and friends that I’ve known for years. 

[teachercd]

38 minutes ago, Jason Sitoke said:

The best definition(s) I ever heard were:

If you feel energized by talking to people, you’re an extrovert. If you feel drained, you’re an introvert. You can be extremely charismatic and funny, and still be introverted. I am definitely an introvert. I have fun with groups of people, but I always have to make an excuse to leave the room periodically just to recharge. Even around family and friends that I’ve known for years. 

Bro, everyone makes an excuse to get away from their family for a little bit.  Haha

[BigRedBuster]

55 minutes ago, Jason Sitoke said:

The best definition(s) I ever heard were:

If you feel energized by talking to people, you’re an extrovert. If you feel drained, you’re an introvert. You can be extremely charismatic and funny, and still be introverted. I am definitely an introvert. I have fun with groups of people, but I always have to make an excuse to leave the room periodically just to recharge. Even around family and friends that I’ve known for years. 

I'm pretty much an extrovert.  However, the older I get, I find myself being less so.  I love being around people and friends.  However, I really love my alone time.  Give me a weekend where the wife is gone and I might not leave the house.

[funhusker]

If I'm not getting paid to be around people, I rarely have the desire to be.

 

Maybe it's the people I spend my time with that wears me out though.  I teach middle school....

[BigRedBuster]

16 hours ago, funhusker said:

Maybe it's the people I spend my time with that wears me out though.  I teach middle school....

That would ruin it for me.

[Archy1221]

From the looks of the Covid tracker, @Jason Sitokewas right almost to the day on when Omicron peaked in the US.  Some individual states may have yet peaked, but overall the worst may be behind us. 
 

https://www.google.com/search?q=us+covid+cases&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&hl=en-us&client=safari

 

Its also interesting that the 2021 and 2022 peaks occurred within one week of each other