Biden's America

[Nebfanatic]

Weren't we expecting inflation and economic depression by May 2020? Pretty sure the wheels of our economic situation were set in motion nearly a year before Biden took office.

[suh_fan93]

 

 

 

[Born N Bled Red]

1 hour ago, BigRedBuster said:

This thought process is just flat out flawed.  Companies have to do what they need to do and that's not some nefarious action.

 

Take our industry.  Going back to winter 2020/2021.  Inflation was starting.  Everyone was saying it was temporary.  Our industry (which is a pretty big industry) resisted raising prices.  Raw material costs were skyrocketing, labor costs were going up, delivery costs were going up.  Everything was going up.  Again, constantly told it was temporary so, everyone resisted raising prices.  Result?  Everyone was hit pretty hard financially.  Once spring of 2021 started and costs still were going up, we had no choice but to raise prices and those prices have constantly gone up because our costs constantly have gone up.  Right now, our industry is sitting on lead times of 16-20 weeks because the demand is so high.  I have absolutely no clue what our costs are going to be at that time.  So, you have to protect yourself and raise prices a little more than what you would normally do.  The construction supply industry typically works on pretty tight margins.  You can't expect companies to just exist into perpetuity not knowing if they are going to cover their costs or not.

 

Sure, you can point out certain examples of price gouging.  But, from my experience, that's not the norm.  Companies are trying to work within an extremely difficult cost environment right now when they really don't know where their costs are going to go.  If companies like ours guess wrong, what happens?  People lose their jobs.  Is that what people would prefer?

 

You do recognize that your industry is not controlling the prices of things that drive inflation right? The ones driving inflation the ones setting the price at the grocery store and the gas pumps. Those prices are controlled by a small handful of corporate conglomerates that have a monopoly and can set prices at whatever price they want. People need food, people need fuel. They can't simply stop buying them. That is where the price gouging is at. I think this is 90% of the issue with our politics today. Small and medium sized businesses think everyone is talking about them when discussing tax rates and unfair practices of the unimaginably wealthy and global conglomerates. 

 

You're caught in the same situation we are. Doing what you need to survive. They are not. 

[Born N Bled Red]

12 hours ago, JJ Husker said:

No, by all means point it out. I just don’t expect them to behave in a less than revolting way. But when this discussion started, I sensed that some were equating rising prices due to inflation with large corporation malfeasance. My point is and was, some of it is (like always) and some of it is just businesses doing what they do without ill intent. I think it can be hard to tell the difference in this economic environment. The only evidence cannot be rising prices. But sure if their execs are getting huge pay increases, the workers getting screwed, etc. then sure we can complain about them.

 

What's incredibly remarkable to me. Is that the same people who sit and argue that a business has every right to raise prices and maximize profits will on the flip side sit and condemn workers for making the same argument. A family's finances is a small business, you have profit centers and expenses. Employees ban together and say, "the cost of maintaining my family business and providing my services have increased, therefore I must charge a higher rate for the services you are employing." and all he!! breaks lose, their condemned and called lazy.  

[JJ Husker]

30 minutes ago, Born N Bled Red said:

 

What's incredibly remarkable to me. Is that the same people who sit and argue that a business has every right to raise prices and maximize profits will on the flip side sit and condemn workers for making the same argument. A family's finances is a small business, you have profit centers and expenses. Employees ban together and say, "the cost of maintaining my family business and providing my services have increased, therefore I must charge a higher rate for the services you are employing." and all he!! breaks lose, their condemned and called lazy.  

I guess I haven’t seen many instances of people condemning workers or calling them lazy. I think it’s pretty widely accepted that the bottom 90% are getting the shaft. But I’ll still generally defend price increases in this inflationary environment. I raised my prices because I had to and it allowed me to give all my employees much needed raises as well. 

[Guy Chamberlin]

3 hours ago, BigRedBuster said:

This thought process is just flat out flawed.  Companies have to do what they need to do and that's not some nefarious action.

 

Take our industry.  Going back to winter 2020/2021.  Inflation was starting.  Everyone was saying it was temporary.  Our industry (which is a pretty big industry) resisted raising prices.  Raw material costs were skyrocketing, labor costs were going up, delivery costs were going up.  Everything was going up.  Again, constantly told it was temporary so, everyone resisted raising prices.  Result?  Everyone was hit pretty hard financially.  Once spring of 2021 started and costs still were going up, we had no choice but to raise prices and those prices have constantly gone up because our costs constantly have gone up.  Right now, our industry is sitting on lead times of 16-20 weeks because the demand is so high.  I have absolutely no clue what our costs are going to be at that time.  So, you have to protect yourself and raise prices a little more than what you would normally do.  The construction supply industry typically works on pretty tight margins.  You can't expect companies to just exist into perpetuity not knowing if they are going to cover their costs or not.

 

Sure, you can point out certain examples of price gouging.  But, from my experience, that's not the norm.  Companies are trying to work within an extremely difficult cost environment right now when they really don't know where their costs are going to go.  If companies like ours guess wrong, what happens?  People lose their jobs.  Is that what people would prefer?

 

You seem to be missing the difference between covering your costs and actually increasing executive compensation.

 

The thought process is that consumers are always asked to sacrifice and be resilient, but for some reason it's both naive and flawed that corporations do the same.

 

As mentioned, we are only talking about SOME companies, whereas other companies try not to penalize their customers and suppliers for as long as possible. Good for you. Good for them. Our contractor gave us an itemized list of the increased price of raw materials. I wasn't mad at anyone. Just irritated at the timing. 

 

General Mills is a different story. A lot of different stories out there. Why would you think I want companies to stand pat, lose money, and fire people? 

 

So if you're cool with pointing out certain examples of price gouging using inflation as cover, then we should be cool. 

[Guy Chamberlin]

15 hours ago, admo said:

I don't know if you are talking current events while Biden is in office, since he is the focal point.  But I promise to read thru it during breakfast, with toast and coffee   I hope you aren't trying to bring up former presidents to make a point, or republicans that you disapprove of.  Can't wait to see!

 

 

Hey chief, you opened by suggesting Biden was getting credit Trump deserved, then asked for an assessment of where we're at, which generally requires a comparison to where we've been. Think you could do that without bringing up a former President?  Or a party you disapprove of?  Too late. You already did. 

 

Tell me I'm wrong, but I'm actually sensing more disapproval of Joe Biden for being the President during a war, than of Vladimir Putin for starting the war. 

[Guy Chamberlin]

2 hours ago, JJ Husker said:

I guess I haven’t seen many instances of people condemning workers or calling them lazy. I think it’s pretty widely accepted that the bottom 90% are getting the shaft. But I’ll still generally defend price increases in this inflationary environment. I raised my prices because I had to and it allowed me to give all my employees much needed raises as well. 

 

50% of America votes for a party that would love to destroy unions forever, and has systematically made life more difficult for the working and middle class, to the benefit of remarkably few. Because money buys messaging, they've done a brilliant job of getting hardworking Americans like yourself not to question their motives, and indeed to consider legitimate criticism part of an anti-business crusade.  It sounds like your company is thoughtful, practical, and employee-centered. That doesn't mean the system is working just fine. 

[admo]

26 minutes ago, Guy Chamberlin said:

 

Hey chief, you opened by suggesting Biden was getting credit Trump deserved, then asked for an assessment of where we're at, which generally requires a comparison to where we've been. Think you could do that without bringing up a former President?  Or a party you disapprove of?  Too late. You already did. 

 

Tell me I'm wrong, but I'm actually sensing more disapproval of Joe Biden for being the President during a war, than of Vladimir Putin for starting the war. 

Yeah your senses are completely wrong.  f#&% Putin There is no earthly way I would support him.  To think I would just because I vote republican and not democrat is stupid of you. I don't want war, I've said that. I also said I am not in favor of american boots on the ground.  I also said I wouldn't want to be the president during this time, because it's no-win situation.  It's all in the Russian thread from the other day.  I want peace in our country.  But contrary to what some posters on here think, it is ok to criticize the current president.  One person even said to criticize Biden is dangerous and unamerican...lol, wow.  And Some posters criticized the former president every day for 4 years.  I'm not a fan of Biden, but he is American, the leader of the country, so I support that the best I can.  I am a republican, a texan, an american, and I do not support Russia or Putin ever.  I think we need to support Ukraine, and I am curious to see what Biden will do, or not do.  This is the Biden thread.  All I read from several posters is Trump stuff and republican stuff.  It's pitiful and sad, because this is a great opportunity for Biden.  Hopefully he does the best thing for our Nation.  I'd like to hear updates on him.  Because Biden said when he becomes president, Putin's days of tyranny and trying to intimidate the United States and those in Eastern Europe are over,"   So I'd like to see some accountability. 

[Guy Chamberlin]

14 hours ago, Archy1221 said:

Not true

 

I was going to wait till after breakfast to find some stats, but reading this morning's paper I got even fresher news:

 

Jobless claims just fell to the lowest level since 1970.

 

U.S. 4th Quarter GDP up 7%, an upgrade over the government's previous estimate, and part of a 5.7% overall jump in 2021, representing the biggest GDP surge since 1984.

 

Meanwhile: 

 

Stock market up 5.8% over a year ago, also reaching historic highs.

 

Consumer Confidence Index reporting a steady rise to 115.8 at the end of 2021, shrugging off COVID and inflation worries.

 

Hey! Why aren't you celebrating?

 

Do you really hate America that much?

[admo]

1 minute ago, Guy Chamberlin said:

 

I was going to wait till after breakfast to find some stats, but reading this morning's paper I got even fresher news:

 

Jobless claims just fell to the lowest level since 1970.

 

U.S. 4th Quarter GDP up 7%, an upgrade over the government's previous estimate, and part of a 5.7% overall jump in 2021, representing the biggest GDP surge since 1984.

 

Meanwhile: 

 

Stock market up 5.8% over a year ago, also reaching historic highs.

 

Consumer Confidence Index reporting a steady rise to 115.8 at the end of 2021, shrugging off COVID and inflation worries.

 

Hey! Why aren't you celebrating?

 

Do you really hate America that much?

Are you on drugs?  You are trolling. 

[Guy Chamberlin]

3 minutes ago, admo said:

Yeah your senses are completely wrong.  f#&% Putin There is no earthly way I would support him.  To think I would just because I vote republican and not democrat is stupid of you. I don't want war, I've said that. I also said I am not in favor of american boots on the ground.  I also said I wouldn't want to be the president during this time, because it's no-win situation.  It's all in the Russian thread from the other day.  I want peace in our country.  But contrary to what some posters on here think, it is ok to criticize the current president.  One person even said to criticize Biden is dangerous and unamerican...lol, wow.  And Some posters criticized the former president every day for 4 years.  I'm not a fan of Biden, but he is American, the leader of the country, so I support that the best I can.  I am a republican, a texan, an american, and I do not support Russia or Putin ever.  I think we need to support Ukraine, and I am curious to see what Biden will do, or not do.  This is the Biden thread.  All I read from several posters is Trump stuff and republican stuff.  It's pitiful and sad, because this is a great opportunity for Biden.  Hopefully he does the best thing for our Nation.  I'd like to hear updates on him.  Because Biden said when he becomes president, Putin's days of tyranny and trying to intimidate the United States and those in Eastern Europe are over,"   So I'd like to see some accountability. 

 

This is a great post. I appreciate you clarifying your position.

 

But your original post, including the little guy with popcorn itching for an argument, didn't suggest any of this. You asked for a defense of Biden based on how awful you think he already is. I gave it my best, which was pretty good. 

 

If there was a poster stupid enough to say we should never criticize Biden, I didn't see it.

[Guy Chamberlin]

7 minutes ago, admo said:

Are you on drugs?  You are trolling. 

 

I'm high on hash browns with applesauce, and I literally read the first two stats in this morning's paper. Over breakfast.

[JJ Husker]

28 minutes ago, Guy Chamberlin said:

 

50% of America votes for a party that would love to destroy unions forever, and has systematically made life more difficult for the working and middle class, to the benefit of remarkably few. Because money buys messaging, they've done a brilliant job of getting hardworking Americans like yourself not to question their motives, and indeed to consider legitimate criticism part of an anti-business crusade.  It sounds like your company is thoughtful, practical, and employee-centered. That doesn't mean the system is working just fine. 

I agree with all of this except your interpretation of my position. I question their motives. I think I’ve said a few times in this discussion alone that I expect the worst from most large corps. But, if we’re going to call them out for behaving badly and with greed, please preface it with more than “they are raising prices” or “record profits”.  Those alone are not an indicator. 
 

I’m not defending these scumbags or our broken system. I just want the malfeasance and bad behavior well defined. Otherwise people may start to think all cases of increasing prices are simply the result of greedy businesses and corrupt execs.

[knapplc]

25 minutes ago, Guy Chamberlin said:

Jobless claims just fell to the lowest level since 1970.

 

U.S. 4th Quarter GDP up 7%, an upgrade over the government's previous estimate, and part of a 5.7% overall jump in 2021, representing the biggest GDP surge since 1984.

 

Meanwhile: 

 

Stock market up 5.8% over a year ago, also reaching historic highs.

 

Consumer Confidence Index reporting a steady rise to 115.8 at the end of 2021, shrugging off COVID and inflation worries.

 

CC:  @nic

 

And that's in addition to what Biden has NOT done, which is bend the knee to Putin. By this time in his occupation of the White House, TFG had already had at least one private meeting with Putin and several private phone calls. None of which are documented.

 

So between the stuff @Guy Chamberlin posted, the infrastructure bill, and just acting like a normal non-treasonous American, I'd say Biden has done better than the guy half the people posting here voted for.