Who should be our starting QB?

[Archy1221]

4 hours ago, Hilltop said:

I watched it again as well.  AM wasn't really that bad but the team did have a different vibe with Luke in.  I would be surprised if Luke didn't get the start but won't be upset either way.  They are both plenty capable if the other parts of the team are clicking.  

I respectfully disagree.  AM was not good when throwing the ball.  12-27 with a short passing game is beyond bad.  He should be completing a 65-70% clip with as many short passes as he throws.  If all he really contributes is a running aspect to his game then NU needs to either changes offenses or change QB’s

[gossamorharpy]

4 hours ago, J-MAGIC said:

 

Two of those were drops, one was the hail mary at the end of the half and two were batted down at the line, so the numbers aren't as bad as they seem from the box score. And I'm not flippantly dismissing anything; it was a bad series for him, but everyone has bad series, and this bad series and one interception seem to be overwhelmingly and unfairly coloring an otherwise pretty average/fine game from him in which he did make plenty of good plays. 

 

And to say that it doesn't matter what a QB can do with his legs in Frost's offense is absurd. He averaged eight yards a carry against the No. 5 defense in the country; that counts for something. He needs to be better through the air, but passing success isn't only on the QB as so many people here would have you believe. I think he deserves another chance.

Lol, bro. He was trash man. He wouldn’t have that pick on his record if he didn’t have a horrendous display of decision making on a pass thrown a second too late. The guy can’t lead receivers open if his life depended on it and he takes so long to make up his mind by the time it gets to a receiver all of 3 yards past the line of scrimmage but 15 yards in the flat, the wr is tackled immediately and can’t do a thing.

 

If this was the second bad game I get it, but this is the same inconsistent crap we saw last year.  The guy clearly hasn’t improved at all and coaches/defenses now have tape on the guy- literally all of his passing stats have declined each year:

 

If we lose this game we’re gonna go 12 months without a damn win. You’re right about one thing, passing success isn’t everything but IT IS THE MOST IMPORTANT AS A QB.  Even his running, he takes too long to run and would rather juke his way for 3-5 yards then take a for sure 6-7.  While it’s not 100% on him, QB is literally the most valuable position in all of sports due to strong correlation historically between a teams success and the level of play at QB.

 

Real question- what would you actually need to see for you to say it’s time to make a change? 

[krc1995]

49 minutes ago, gossamorharpy said:

Lol, bro. He was trash man. He wouldn’t have that pick on his record if he didn’t have a horrendous display of decision making on a pass thrown a second too late. The guy can’t lead receivers open if his life depended on it and he takes so long to make up his mind by the time it gets to a receiver all of 3 yards past the line of scrimmage but 15 yards in the flat, the wr is tackled immediately and can’t do a thing.

 

If this was the second bad game I get it, but this is the same inconsistent crap we saw last year.  The guy clearly hasn’t improved at all and coaches/defenses now have tape on the guy- literally all of his passing stats have declined each year:

 

If we lose this game we’re gonna go 12 months without a damn win. You’re right about one thing, passing success isn’t everything but IT IS THE MOST IMPORTANT AS A QB.  Even his running, he takes too long to run and would rather juke his way for 3-5 yards then take a for sure 6-7.  While it’s not 100% on him, QB is literally the most valuable position in all of sports due to strong correlation historically between a teams success and the level of play at QB.

 

Real question- what would you actually need to see for you to say it’s time to make a change? 

You know what I need to see? The backup quarterback play better.  

[LumberJackSker]

6 hours ago, J-MAGIC said:

 

I rewatched the game in 60 on BTN and I don't even think Adrian was that bad. He missed those short throws on that one series backed up on our own end (that weren't going anywhere anyways), he threw the pick, he airmailed the throw in the endzone to Allen, and he one-hopped the ball to Wandale. But otherwise he was fine and doing a ton with his legs. We were only in position to throw the pick because he made two monster runs on broken plays.

Yeah if you take out all those bad plays he played ok.

[gossamorharpy]

22 minutes ago, krc1995 said:

You know what I need to see? The backup quarterback play better.  

You and me both.  Besides, what do we have to lose at this point? 

[Hilltop]

10 hours ago, Archy1221 said:

I respectfully disagree.  AM was not good when throwing the ball.  12-27 with a short passing game is beyond bad.  He should be completing a 65-70% clip with as many short passes as he throws.  If all he really contributes is a running aspect to his game then NU needs to either changes offenses or change QB’s

Agree, 12 for 27 is terrible.  My comment was based on his ability to turn some bad plays into good ones with his feet and his one Patrick Mahomes throw.  He was fairly decisive when he needed to run which is an improvement from last year.  All of that said, I think LM should get his shot to start.  He appears to have the hot hand and the support of his teammates.    

[BigRedBuster]

4 hours ago, Hilltop said:

Agree, 12 for 27 is terrible.  My comment was based on his ability to turn some bad plays into good ones with his feet and his one Patrick Mahomes throw.  He was fairly decisive when he needed to run which is an improvement from last year.  All of that said, I think LM should get his shot to start.  He appears to have the hot hand and the support of his teammates.    

 

So....2AM made very good plays with his legs when plays weren't there in the passing game.  He should be replaced because LM can make plays with his feet when it turns into a bad play.

 

Now....I voted for LM to get the start.  But, I'm confused on your reasoning because he can make plays with his feet.

[Undone]

15 hours ago, Archy1221 said:

He should be completing a 65-70% clip with as many short passes as he throws.

 

What's weird is that he was 80% on the day versus Ohio State. 

 

If he doesn't throw that pick in the end zone (against Northwestern) and we win that game on a last second field goal, he doesn't become the convenient scapegoat he is this week. 

 

Our rushing game with Dedrick Mills hasn't gone all that well in two games so far in my opinion. That is a bigger issue to me than Martinez's play, but maybe I'm in the minority there.

[WyoHusker56]

4 minutes ago, Undone said:

 

What's weird is that he was 80% on the day versus Ohio State. 

 

If he doesn't throw that pick in the end zone and we win that game on a last second field goal, he doesn't become the convenient scapegoat he is this week. 

 

Our rushing game with Dedrick Mills hasn't gone all that well in two games so far in my opinion. That is a bigger issue to me than Martinez's play, but maybe I'm in the minority there.

 

Our rushing game is my concern too. The QB is important, but honestly I think you get about the same from LM and AM when it's all said and done.

 

The fact is our QBs are the leading rusher on the team week after week. That's not a recipe for success and just wears them down by the end of the game. We have got to get the rushing game going without the QB somehow or another.

 

My other big issue is the disappearance of Wan'Dale. Obviously teams are going to try and take him away, but you have got to design something to get him the ball in space. He's too dynamic and too good to have what 10 touches in 2 games? Get him the freaking ball somehow.

[Undone]

3 minutes ago, WyoHusker56 said:

 

Our rushing game is my concern too. The QB is important, but honestly I think you get about the same from LM and AM when it's all said and done.

 

The fact is our QBs are the leading rusher on the team week after week. That's not a recipe for success and just wears them down by the end of the game. We have got to get the rushing game going without the QB somehow or another.

 

My other big issue is the disappearance of Wan'Dale. Obviously teams are going to try and take him away, but you have got to design something to get him the ball in space. He's too dynamic and too good to have what 10 touches in 2 games? Get him the freaking ball somehow.

 

Yeah, man.

 

I'm starting to lend my ear more towards the crowd saying "this is a throwaway year anyway; just get the young guys out there."

I'd love to see more from Scott, Thompkins, Fleming, & Betts if it comes to it. I wouldn't mind watching Luke get a start and a full game if for nothing else to force him to use a regular game plan that involves him standing in the pocket throwing multiple plays just to see how he fares doing that.

 

But there are bigger fish to fry, I think.

[WyoHusker56]

3 minutes ago, Undone said:

 

Yeah, man.

 

I'm starting to lend my ear more towards the crowd saying "this is a throwaway year anyway; just get the young guys out there."

I'd love to see more from Scott, Thompkins, Fleming, & Betts if it comes to it. I wouldn't mind watching Luke get a start and a full game if for nothing else to force him to use a regular game plan that involves him standing in the pocket throwing multiple plays just to see how he fares doing that.

 

But there are bigger fish to fry, I think.

 

Ya I agree. I mean I get the arguments that could come for not playing the young guys, but at this point what's really the risk? Warner, Liewer and Falck aren't getting it done and we're losing game so you throw in the young guys and they don't get it done and we lose games, but at least they got experience. Plus from what I saw last week Fleming and Betts and likely Brown are a lot more dangerous than the walk on guys. At RB we just need to throw guys in and see what happens.

[DefenderAO]

23 minutes ago, Undone said:

 

What's weird is that he was 80% on the day versus Ohio State. 

 

If he doesn't throw that pick in the end zone (against Northwestern) and we win that game on a last second field goal, he doesn't become the convenient scapegoat he is this week. 

 

Our rushing game with Dedrick Mills hasn't gone all that well in two games so far in my opinion. That is a bigger issue to me than Martinez's play, but maybe I'm in the minority there.

 

Both are an issue, but Adrian is missing very basic, required throws and missing them badly.

 

It's astounding how many people on the board watch him game in and game out and still think he's the guy.  I'm not saying this is you (though your posts suggest you support him as a primary player); we've seen enough football from him, around other teams and leagues, and in different. years to now be able to make a decision on what really good looks like.

 

It isn't #2.  

[Undone]

1 minute ago, DefenderAO said:

It's astounding how many people on the board watch him game in and game out and still think he's the guy.  I'm not saying this is you (though your posts suggest you support him as a primary player); we've seen enough football from him, around other teams and leagues, and in different. years to now be able to make a decision on what really good looks like.

 

Heh, I'm not offended if you don't ever like my takes.   

 

My argument is that analysis of the bigger picture is what a lot of people are missing. I believe Luke is rough around the edges in the passing game and that you can't just run 25 Wildcat plays with him and win in the Big 10; it just wouldn't work.

 

If we had a little bit more of a dynamic starting running back it would take a lot of pressure off of whoever the QB is, as well as having wideouts that can quickly get open. But we don't have those things.

 

So you put Luke in there and what do we really expect to happen? Just have him run 30 QB runs per game and run for 175 yards and win that way?

[TheSker]

5 minutes ago, Undone said:

 

Heh, I'm not offended if you don't ever like my takes.   

 

My argument is that analysis of the bigger picture is what a lot of people are missing. I believe Luke is rough around the edges in the passing game and that you can't just run 25 Wildcat plays with him and win in the Big 10; it just wouldn't work.

 

If we had a little bit more of a dynamic starting running back it would take a lot of pressure off of whoever the QB is, as well as having wideouts that can quickly get open. But we don't have those things.

 

So you put Luke in there and what do we really expect to happen? Just have him run 30 QB runs per game and run for 175 yards and win that way?

I think McCaffrey's accuracy is at least as good as Martinez.  The key reason I think McCaffrey is pulling ahead of Martinez is because he is making quicker decisions.

 

We need a more productive back than Mills to step forward, and Fleming and Betts need to continue to progress rapidly.  And perhaps we'll have an Alante Brown sighting some day.

[Undone]

6 minutes ago, TheSker said:

I think McCaffrey's accuracy is at least as good as Martinez.  The key reason I think McCaffrey is pulling ahead of Martinez is because he is making quicker decisions.

 

We need a more productive back than Mills to step forward, and Fleming and Betts need to continue to progress rapidly.  And perhaps we'll have an Alante Brown sighting some day.

 

On a broader scale of thought, I'm just pretty frustrated with Frosty at the moment. I can't personally give him any excuses for the kind of crappy offensive performance our team put up against Northwestern.

 

Several things he seems to be doing aren't working. If one of those things is needing to start McCaffrey over Adrian, then let's make that change and see if the product is better.

 

My own prediction is that giving Luke a full game doesn't really make the product that much better, but I'm the first person to admit I could be totally wrong about that.