Do We Have the Talent We Need?

[RedSavage]

2 hours ago, Corn55 said:

 

 

There are seriously any good teams in the West? The Big Ten West is the worst division in the entire Power 5. Our talent composite ranking of 24th is mediocre, but it's the best in the division. The second best talent ranking in the division is Purdue  at 38th.

 

I don't think we have the talent to do much more than win the awful BIG West division. But since Frost is going into year 4, that's his fault.

This is a steaming hot trash pile of a take

[bugeater17]

Perhaps I'm buying to much into the recent transfer additions, but I think the 2021 team will have the most overall talent that Frost has had. I know Toure hasn't played a down yet, but when was the last time we had a WR on our roster who was a legit draft pick after his Junior season? Stanley Morgan was legit, don't get me wrong, but I don't think he had the draft prospects Toure does. I think Betts will see a big jump after getting his feet wet this year and continued learning of the playbook. Martin will be a solid possession receiver. The tight-end spot and depth is the best its been for quite some time as Allen has proven to be an effective weapon and adding Fidone to the mix may take some time but he will be a mis-match at some point next year. RB is still somewhat of a question even with Stepp but the talent is there (just none with the game breaking ability of Mo Wash).

 

The defense is also bringing back the most talent in 10 years and since 2009. I am not saying the defense will be on the same level or caliber (and still expect that 2009 to be better come seasons end) but this is the closest to that talent level we have had.

[admo]

 

41 minutes ago, Mavric said:

 

I mean ... we had the B1G kicker of the year.  I think there are plenty of things to be frustrated at without making more up.

 

LOL my bad, just a type-Oh.  I thought I typed "kickoffs"  ( anything to do with kickoffs -  meaning coverage/returns).  And yes, Culp was best in B1G. That's exactly why I can't just say special teams.

[Husker in WI]

9 minutes ago, hunter49 said:

special teams play is a nightmare. a dedicated coach could fix this, Frost could fix this if he wanted to.

 

Right, Frost could fix and would just rather play at a disadvantage. 

 

I'm probably too optimistic, but Hail Varsity pointed out our Special Teams analyst has had pretty meh first years compared to the teams' baselines, and then huge jumps in year two. We did immediately improve field goals, and I think we'd feel a lot better about the punt team if Cerni had been able to play. I'm willing to give Rutledge year 2, Culp (K), Cerni (P), Meyer/Cerni (KOS). The lack of progress in the coverage teams was unsettling, but I do think the hang time on punts and distance/hang time on kickoffs is an underrated aspect of good coverage teams. Kick returns looked hopeless.

[HANC]

So much negative talk about Jurgens.  I understand and see first hand how bad the snaps are and how many times it has cost us negative plays, including the timing issues in the passing game.

 

I also know how hard it is to play center (technique alone), especially if you are going to run 99.9% from the gun.  This is not a natural feat.  Throw in the more demanding task of understanding defensive fronts and having to learn all the line calls at the D1 level.  Jurgens is a FREAK athlete.  I am as frustrated as the rest of you, but I refuse to banish him and constantly harp.  For anyone who hasn't experience "turf toe", which may be the most difficult injury to play through, it limits a ton of movement.  Considering a Center has a lot of weight transfer at the snap, yes it can play a part.  No excuses, but a little insight.

As a coach, I am personally waiting to see what the beginning of next season holds.  If he struggles, then I am all on board with the "Jurgens must go" side, but I just have a gut feeling that many will be eating their words when he is playing Center in the NFL.  

[BigRedBuster]

19 hours ago, Undone said:

The overall results seem to stem from bad coaching, bad preparation, and bad culture - which to me are indicative of a staff that's just going through the motions.

We have issues with turnovers and penalties on offense.  However, I strongly disagree that our offensive coaches are "just going through the motions".  I believe they strongly want this to change and will do what they think is necessary to change it.  Weather that is successful is what is in question.

[J-MAGIC]

2 hours ago, Corn55 said:

 

 

There are seriously any good teams in the West? The Big Ten West is the worst division in the entire Power 5. Our talent composite ranking of 24th is mediocre, but it's the best in the division. The second best talent ranking in the division is Purdue  at 38th.

 

I don't think we have the talent to do much more than win the awful BIG West division. But since Frost is going into year 4, that's his fault.

 

Last year the Big Ten West was rated the fourth-toughest division in the country behind only the SEC West, Big Ten East, and SEC East. It was significantly better from top to bottom than the Big 12, Pac-12 and both ACC divisions.

[NoLongerN]

3 hours ago, Lightfighter214 said:

If his snapping is fixed, which it seems it is, we absolutely do.

 

Not to many centers that can move and pull like he does.

Most certainly.  The staff did the study and knows that on drives where there wasn't a penalty, bad snap or turnover, that we score on 90% of those drives.  I'm curious how much that study cost ... I think most of us on this board could have done a poll and given them that.  Yet, the key is in your post ... "IF".  

I'll hold out hope that he can be taught, trained and become disciplined in his trade ... but that still doesn't mean that one can't have fun that something so many Division I Centers have absolutely no problems with.  It's not rocket science.  If this guy was an a golfer at the college level he would be missing three or four 2' putts a round easily.  It's great that he can drive the ball 350 yards though ... that's cool!

[Undone]

3 hours ago, Corn55 said:

I don't think we have the talent to do much more than win the awful BIG West division. But since Frost is going into year 4, that's his fault.

 

So your vote then is that we have the talent to get the better of Wisconsin, Northwestern, & Iowa but that it's the coaching that is lacking?

[Undone]

14 hours ago, BigRedN said:

Do we have the talent at Center we need?  For me, NO!

 

If he just fixed the bad snaps for an entire season I think we're fine there.

[desertshox]

13 minutes ago, BigRedN said:

but that still doesn't mean that one can't have fun that something so many Division I Centers have absolutely no problems with.

 

Wut

[NoLongerN]

3 hours ago, HANC said:

So much negative talk about Jurgens.  I understand and see first hand how bad the snaps are and how many times it has cost us negative plays, including the timing issues in the passing game.

 

I also know how hard it is to play center (technique alone), especially if you are going to run 99.9% from the gun.  This is not a natural feat.  Throw in the more demanding task of understanding defensive fronts and having to learn all the line calls at the D1 level.  Jurgens is a FREAK athlete.  I am as frustrated as the rest of you, but I refuse to banish him and constantly harp.  For anyone who hasn't experience "turf toe", which may be the most difficult injury to play through, it limits a ton of movement.  Considering a Center has a lot of weight transfer at the snap, yes it can play a part.  No excuses, but a little insight.

As a coach, I am personally waiting to see what the beginning of next season holds.  If he struggles, then I am all on board with the "Jurgens must go" side, but I just have a gut feeling that many will be eating their words when he is playing Center in the NFL.  

I apology to anyone who believes I'm "harping on this".  I read the whole thread and their was not one post stating what to me is the "obvious" ... so I did [there was enough praise in the thread for the OL ... but nothing on this].  Not trying to add insult to injury.

For me, I'll be personally really upset if Jurgens is playing Center in the NFL ... and during his five [5] years hear he couldn't make it through a game with a bad snap.  That would really show me the development issue.  So, just to communicate, I'm not saying "Jurgens must go", but Frost has his guy ... he's said it's a problem and it must get fixed ... that it will get fixed.  HEY COACH, I'M HOLDING YOU TO THAT!  I'm waiting ... that is all.

I do find it humorous that the same behavior by a player can continue for three years ... but a comment on a post about this issue has been said too many times [didn't realize I had said it 20 times in the past day].  Too funny.

Edited January 13, 2021 by Enhance
Message has been edited. Political commentary is not allowed outside of the P&R forum.

[Husker in WI]

38 minutes ago, Undone said:

 

So your vote then is that we have the talent to get the better of Wisconsin, Northwestern, & Iowa but that it's the coaching that is lacking?

You can call it coaching or whatever you want, but we played well enough to beat NW and Iowa this year. Yes, it all comes back to coaching, but there were plenty of non-coach mistakes that swung those games.

 

22 minutes ago, BigRedN said:

I apology to anyone who believes I'm "harping on this".  I read the whole thread and their was not one post stating what to me is the "obvious" ... so I did [there was enough praise in the thread for the OL ... but nothing on this].  Not trying to add insult to injury.

For me, I'll be personally really upset if Jurgens is playing Center in the NFL ... and during his five [5] years hear he couldn't make it through a game with a bad snap.  That would really show me the development issue.  So, just to communicate, I'm not saying "Jurgens must go", but Frost has his guy ... he's said it's a problem and it must get fixed ... that it will get fixed.  HEY COACH, I'M HOLDING YOU TO THAT!  I'm waiting ... that is all.

I do find it humorous that the same behavior by a player can continue for three years ... but a comment on a post about this issue has been said too many times [didn't realize I had said it 20 times in the past day].  Too funny.  That is truly the politics of today's generation ... hope nobody impeaches me for it.

 

I think it's stretching quite a bit to say he hasn't made it through a game without a bad snap. I am also frustrated they popped back up early in the year, but they were not really present later in the year. And if we're saying he has 3 years of bad snaps, you're counting his year as an injured freshman TE. Can't say I care a lot about what his snaps were like then. 

[NoLongerN]

10 minutes ago, Husker in WI said:

You can call it coaching or whatever you want, but we played well enough to beat NW and Iowa this year. Yes, it all comes back to coaching, but there were plenty of non-coach mistakes that swung those games.

 

 

I think it's stretching quite a bit to say he hasn't made it through a game without a bad snap. I am also frustrated they popped back up early in the year, but they were not really present later in the year. And if we're saying he has 3 years of bad snaps, you're counting his year as an injured freshman TE. Can't say I care a lot about what his snaps were like then. 

Agreed.  I'm probably a head case at this stage.  It's probably my own HTSD [Hiking Traumatic Stress Disorder].

[Undone]

44 minutes ago, Husker in WI said:

You can call it coaching or whatever you want, but we played well enough to beat NW and Iowa this year. Yes, it all comes back to coaching, but there were plenty of non-coach mistakes that swung those games.

 

Getting into game-specific analysis is really more of my thing.

 

In the Northwestern game we missed a field goal - and even though Culp is a pretty good field goal kicker, it still goes back to how special teams just continues to nag our team.

McCaffrey then does a great job of taking us down the field but then gets us into the wrong formation on the two yard line and Mills gets stuffed. Then he gets a pass tipped and it gets picked off. We would have had to then convert a two point conversion just to tie it, and who knows what happens after that.

 

Were we close in that game? I'd agree to describe it that way, yes. But I still see that game as 'the glass being half empty' instead of it being 'half full.'

 

Negative Nancy over here...I know.