Floyd Case Verdict

[knapplc]

1 minute ago, BigRedBuster said:

Nobody is blaming the victim for the bad behavior. 

 

8 minutes ago, JJ Husker said:

resisting will only lead to worse outcomes

 

Resisting arrest is stupid, on that we all agree.

 

But resisting arrest does not need to result in injury or death. That we're having this conversation in the George Floyd thread is kind of amazing, actually. 

 

 

[Cdog923]

18 hours ago, knapplc said:

 

It's pretty amazing how people have utterly forgotten how this country was born.

 

But, but, but....they gently threw that tea into the harbor! 

 

 

19 hours ago, JJ Husker said:

 

He is and will be a martyr to a whole bunch of people whether or not we agree or think it is right.

 

I don't disagree with the verdict in this case but people need to realize that when you have a criminal record....when you resist arrest or try to escape....when you don't follow lawful orders from LEO's...when you're all jacked up on drugs, etc., sh#t can go south for ya in a hurry. So many of these cases could've been prevented by the victims. That does not absolve the cops of their responsibility but it sure would go long ways towards not having so many of these situations ending in a death.

 

Resisting arrest is dumb, but also not punishable by death. 

[DevoHusker]

41 minutes ago, knapplc said:

 

Inevitably people are going to have police contact, we can't stop that. Right? Fair?

 

The problem this social movement has formed around is that when that contact happens, police are abusing their power. 

 

The answer can't be to stop people from doing things to generate police contact. No society has figured that out. 

 

The answer has to be better policing. No other wealthy nation's police force kills its citizens at the rate of America's. Every other country has police and police contact with their civilians. 

 

10,000,000 arrests and 50,000,000+ police citizen contacts a year. 

 

Have you ever had an interaction with a cop? Did they abuse their power with you? You said you don't have to respect cops. Did you yell epithets at them? Did you refuse to do what they asked?  In my interactions with police, they were respectful to me because I was respectful to them. 

 

My son is in a related field, and has lots of cop friends. He said they abide by the tenet "ask-(sometimes more than once)tell-make". If the action is completed with "ask" then 99.9% of the time there are no other issues.

[knapplc]

Just now, DevoHusker said:

 

10,000,000 arrests and 50,000,000+ police citizen contacts a year. 

 

Have you ever had an interaction with a cop? Did they abuse their power with you? You said you don't have to respect cops. Did you yell epithets at them? Did you refuse to do what they asked?  In my interactions with police, they were respectful to me because I was respectful to them. 

 

My son is in a related field, and has lots of cop friends. He said they abide by the tenet "ask-(sometimes more than once)tell-make". If the action is completed with "ask" then 99.9% of the time there are no other issues.

 

I said I don't have to be respectful to police, but of course I have had contact with the police and I am very respectful. 

 

I, too, have had family members on the force. I'm quite familiar with what they go through. 

[DevoHusker]

1 minute ago, knapplc said:

 

I said I don't have to be respectful to police, but of course I have had contact with the police and I am very respectful. 

 

I, too, have had family members on the force. I'm quite familiar with what they go through. 

 

That would seem to be the applicable answer for most situations. 

 

There will still be outliers, but that simple common courtesy would seem to solve a lot of issues. And, for the record, I am talking about respectful interaction by both sides of the equation.  

[knapplc]

1 minute ago, DevoHusker said:

 

That would seem to be the applicable answer for most situations. 

 

There will still be outliers, but that simple common courtesy would seem to solve a lot of issues. And, for the record, I am talking about respectful interaction by both sides of the equation.  

 

It won't, and @BigRedBuster gave a perfect example of why.

 

 

 

 

[DevoHusker]

1 minute ago, knapplc said:

 

It won't, and @BigRedBuster gave a perfect example of why.

 

 

 

 

 

hence my use of the qualifier

[teachercd]

57 minutes ago, ColoradoHusk said:

I agree that most of the time, cops are pulling people over for "doing something wrong".  However, they do pull over people for no reason at all, and then look for reasons to give them a ticket or arrest them.  When I was in high school, I was driving with some friends in Omaha.  A cop pulled me over, and his reason was "There was a robbery at a nearby bar, and the guy was wearing a hat and jacket, so you fit the description."  He then had me get out of the car, walk back to his police car, checked my driver's license, looked in my car with a flash light where my friends were sitting.

 

I didn't do anything out of line, but looking back on it, I didn't do anything to get pulled over.  I am not a lawyer, but doesn't that cop supposed to have probable cause to pull me over?  Also, to this day, nearly 30 years later, I wonder what that cop would have done if me and my friends were black.  He may have done nothing differently, or he may have treated me very poorly just from the color of my skin.

Story doesn't check out.

[teachercd]

I don't know about you all but the people I have personally seen be dicks to cops...are women.  I don't know why but good lord do they go off on cops (sometimes).  Like at bars and tailgates and s#!t like that.

 

It is like they have no fear at all.  I am scared of anyone in a uniform, even the mailman, but women will freak the f#&% out on cops, verbally.  Can I get a plus 1?

 

I still wave to cops when I see them drive down my street.  I mean, I put away my drugs first, but then I wave.

 

 

[ColoradoHusk]

6 minutes ago, teachercd said:

Story doesn't check out.

You're right, they were mannequins I like to drive around with.

[teachercd]

4 minutes ago, ColoradoHusk said:

You're right, they were mannequins I like to drive around with.

Weekend at Bernies!

[Guy Chamberlin]

1 hour ago, JJ Husker said:

Sorry. I said what I said and I meant it.

 

I have this weird propensity to solve problems by the easiest means available to me. After all that is all any of us can do in the moment. Fixing institutional and societal issues is lot more involved and complicated and largely out of any one person’s control. If you want to live through a police interaction, listen to what I said. If you don’t agree with what I said, just go ahead and fight back, resist, go around jacked up on drugs, run and let me know how that goes for ya.

 

Some, a lot, of these people could have ended up not being victims. That’s just a fact and does not absolve the police at all of any of their malfeasance or wrongdoing.

 

First, as you say, resisting arrest puts you at greater risk, but it shouldn't be a death warrant. 

 

Second, as evidence has made painfully clear, many of these incidents involve people doing nothing wrong, and the confrontation is escalated by police with faulty information, mistakenly identifying a weapon, and sometimes just being pricks. Derrick Chauvin  had a history of  being a prick. 

 

Thirdly, both scenarios apply more often to Black people. 

 

I mean, you literally blamed the victim in the previous post. 

 

Even with  your rationale, it still feels like proclaiming "ALL lives matter."  While the sentiment is true, it's being used to distract from the real issue. 

[Guy Chamberlin]

I've posted this in here before. It came up when I was hanging with some old Nebraska buddies, remembering the most legendary hijinks of our youth. Almost all of these guys are Trump supporters.. They've done pretty well in their lives.  We may not agree on much, but they did have to agree that had we been black in our hell-raising days, we would have been dead or in jail years ago. 

 

That's they part some people just don't get. 

[teachercd]

41 minutes ago, Guy Chamberlin said:

I've posted this in here before. It came up when I was hanging with some old Nebraska buddies, remembering the most legendary hijinks of our youth. Almost all of these guys are Trump supporters.. They've done pretty well in their lives.  We may not agree on much, but they did have to agree that had we been black in our hell-raising days, we would have been dead or in jail years ago. 

 

That's they part some people just don't get. 

 So you are saying that old white guys, thinking back on their youth, understand what it like for black kids today?

 

 

 

[Guy Chamberlin]

35 minutes ago, teachercd said:

 So you are saying that old white guys, thinking back on their youth, understand what it like for black kids today?

 

 

 

 

I'm literally saying that old white guys thinking back on their youth, who then envision themselves doing the same thing with black skin, are inclined to say "oh sh!t....we could have gotten shot for that."