Sipple - Frost to make “multiple changes” on his offensive staff…

[Jeremy]

2 hours ago, Gorillahawk said:

 

I know I have stated that I don't believe that switching to an offense like the flex bone and running a ton of triple option would be successful and I stand by that. I feel like the proof is in the pudding so to speak. There is a reason why no team in a P5 conference runs it. Georgia Tech with Paul Johnson was the last to do so, and he was never uber successful in the ACC with it. It is a great offense in it's own right, however it is typically used when you are going to be out athleted against just about every team you face, so you hope that you can take advantage of teams potential lack of discipline on defense, and cause them trouble.

 

And guess what....it works every once in awhile. BUT when you play in a conference like the BIG or SEC where pretty much every team has lots of speed on defense, and are typically coached extremely well it doesn't work. When is the last time Navy beat Notre Dame? It was 2016, before that it was 2010. The service academies are currently 0-3 against P5 conference opponents.                                  

 

Now I know the argument against what I am saying is that we have better athletes than the schools who currently run that particular offense. And yes you are right, so I can't say for sure that we wouldn't have more success against P5 schools than them. Again I have to continue to go back to there is a reason no P5 schools run it. The offensive scheme Frost has been using isn't terrible, however I agree with the fact that we do indeed need to have more of a power rushing element to what we have been doing, because too many of our drives have stalled out because we can't get 1 or 2 yards when we need it. I am hoping that a new OC, OL Coach and RB coach can remedy that issue.

Paul Johnson and Georgia Tech won the ACC TWICE, and won the Orange Bowl against Mississippi State, Dak Prescott, and all that $EC speed. That's pretty 'uber successful.' They didn't just beat them, they set the Orange Bowl RUSHING RECORD against all that speed. Georgia Tech and their high admission standards make their recruiting challenging, and yet, they still competed very well most years. Since Johnson retired, the Yellow Jackets have stunk it up trying to run spread stuff that everyone else is doing. Like us. 

 

Thank you for bringing up Navy. Navy won 11 games 2 years ago, so it doesn't work 'every once in a while.' Guess what kind of offense we ran the last time we won 11 games? How many games have we won trying what we're doing now? The fact that Navy could EVER beat a WAY more talented program like Notre Dame is a real testament to the Middies as a program, and I think this offense contributes a lot to that. They beat Kansas State and all their Big 12 speed, too. Navy is definitely rebuilding this year, but they did beat a very talented UCF squad. 

 

Army won 9 games last year. Air Force ALSO won 11 games in 2019. Don't TELL me it doesn't work. Every team the service academies play are way more talented than they are.

 

I would argue that Frost's offensive scheme HAS been terrible. Sure it gained some yards, but we don't win with the most yards. We win with the most points. Frost has averaged a whopping 26 points per game against P5 competition. That's not nearly enough when our defense is out on the field for WAY more than half the game. 

 

Nebraska never won anything by caring what everyone else was doing. When the rest of the country started going to passing attacks, Osborne stuck to his guns and ran the ball even more. We've tried nearly every offense besides this for the last 18 years, and we have NOTHING to show for it. Literally, what do we have to lose? 

[Jeremy]

2 hours ago, runningblind said:

You are essentially making yourself one dimensional by doing that, teams will dare you to beat them throwing the ball and loading the box.  This has played out in thousands of games, that is the proof you are ignoring.  That is the goal of a defense to make an offense one dimensional and therefore easier to defend.  You are helping them do that with this change.

 

What proof am I ignoring? Navy's 11 win season 2 years ago? Air Force's 11 wins the same year? Georgia Tech's 2 ACC championships and Orange Bowl berths? Army's 9 wins last year? That's a lot of success 'playing out' very recently against defenses that absolutely loaded the box over and over. And yet...they still couldn't stop it. 

 

Oh yeah, Army scored 56 points against Wake Forest, their loaded box, and all that ACC 'speed.'

[Stumpy1]

8 minutes ago, Gorillahawk said:

Wouldn’t be a bad hire, but we’d have to throw a ton of money at him to make a lateral move from a team that is greatly improved. I’d be willing to bet he’d say no and hedge his bets he’ll be a HC somewhere soon if he stays at Arkansas 

His name is being thrown around for the Texas Tech HC job. 

[runningblind]

30 minutes ago, Jeremy said:

What proof am I ignoring? Navy's 11 win season 2 years ago? Air Force's 11 wins the same year? Georgia Tech's 2 ACC championships and Orange Bowl berths? Army's 9 wins last year? That's a lot of success 'playing out' very recently against defenses that absolutely loaded the box over and over. And yet...they still couldn't stop it. 

 

Oh yeah, Army scored 56 points against Wake Forest, their loaded box, and all that ACC 'speed.'

Does Navy or Army play that competition all year long? No, they don't.  I will give you a couple good years for GT in down years for the ACC.

 

We can agree to disagree and you can quote me if an option type team ever wins the Big Ten or the SEC.  I will gladly eat crow then.

[RedDenver]

21 minutes ago, Jeremy said:

What proof am I ignoring? Navy's 11 win season 2 years ago? Air Force's 11 wins the same year? Georgia Tech's 2 ACC championships and Orange Bowl berths? Army's 9 wins last year? That's a lot of success 'playing out' very recently against defenses that absolutely loaded the box over and over. And yet...they still couldn't stop it. 

 

Oh yeah, Army scored 56 points against Wake Forest, their loaded box, and all that ACC 'speed.'

Well let's look at Navy, Air Force, and Army records over the last few years:

Navy:

2021 2-7

2020 3-7

2019 11-2

2018 3-10

2017 7-6

 

Air Force:

2021 6-3

2020 3-3

2019 11-2

2018 5-7

2017 5-7

 

Army:

2021 5-3

2020 9-3

2019 5-8

2018 11-2

2017 10-3

 

A few good seasons but mostly unimpressive records. Even Army, which has the best record over that span, their record before 2017 is abysmal.

 

So let's look at GT under Paul Johnson:

2018 7-6

2017 5-6

2016 9-4

2015 3-9

2014 11-3 (Orange bowl win)

2013 7-6

2012 7-7

2011 8-5

2010 6-7

2009 11-3 (Orange bowl loss)

2008 9-4

 

That's 2 really good seasons over 11 years with 3 losing seasons. Pretty mixed bag. Doesn't really support the conclusion of "a lot of success".

[ColoradoHusk]

2 hours ago, Jeremy said:

What proof am I ignoring? Navy's 11 win season 2 years ago? Air Force's 11 wins the same year? Georgia Tech's 2 ACC championships and Orange Bowl berths? Army's 9 wins last year? That's a lot of success 'playing out' very recently against defenses that absolutely loaded the box over and over. And yet...they still couldn't stop it. 

 

Oh yeah, Army scored 56 points against Wake Forest, their loaded box, and all that ACC 'speed.'

Yes, Army ran all over Wake Forest this year, but Wake Forest's defense is average to below average.

 

The past few years, when Army has played a P5 school, they tend to make the games competitive, but they still don't score many points.  These games against the P5 schools are an outlier for these P5 schools, as they play Army, and then don't play them again for years.  If a Big Ten team were to try Army's offense, they would be facing some of the top defenses in the country EVERY YEAR.  The Big Ten DC's would figure out how to defend that offense quickly.  The Big Ten currently has 5 of the best rushing defenses in the country, including 3 of the top 14 being in Nebraska's division.  I am not saying NU needs to not forget about running the ball better, but using Army's style of offense is not the way to do it.  

[3gunhusker]

1 hour ago, RedDenver said:

Well let's look at Navy, Air Force, and Army records over the last few years:

Navy:

2021 2-7

2020 3-7

2019 11-2

2018 3-10

2017 7-6

 

Air Force:

2021 6-3

2020 3-3

2019 11-2

2018 5-7

2017 5-7

 

Army:

2021 5-3

2020 9-3

2019 5-8

2018 11-2

2017 10-3

 

A few good seasons but mostly unimpressive records. Even Army, which has the best record over that span, their record before 2017 is abysmal.

 

So let's look at GT under Paul Johnson:

2018 7-6

2017 5-6

2016 9-4

2015 3-9

2014 11-3 (Orange bowl win)

2013 7-6

2012 7-7

2011 8-5

2010 6-7

2009 11-3 (Orange bowl loss)

2008 9-4

 

That's 2 really good seasons over 11 years with 3 losing seasons. Pretty mixed bag. Doesn't really support the conclusion of "a lot of success".

what is also obvious are those records are a lot more successful than the frost era.

[RedDenver]

49 minutes ago, 3gunhusker said:

what is also obvious are those records are a lot more successful than the frost era.

That's not really an argument for the triple option offense though, which is what @Jeremy is arguing for.

[3gunhusker]

4 hours ago, RedDenver said:

That's not really an argument for the triple option offense though, which is what @Jeremy is arguing for.

And neither was your weak assessment based on win-loss records.

[Toe]

On 11/9/2021 at 5:41 PM, HuskerNation1 said:

 

 

 

 

OT: It takes a special kind of stupid to cover the ears and the back of the head, but not the nose...

[Husker1994]

8 hours ago, Stumpy1 said:

His name is being thrown around for the Texas Tech HC job. 

Job was already filled. 
 

But speaking of TTU, wouldn’t be surprised if Sonny Cumbie gets serious consideration for the OC opening here. 
 

[Lorewarn]

9 hours ago, Jeremy said:

Army won 9 games last year. Air Force ALSO won 11 games in 2019. Don't TELL me it doesn't work.

 

 

It doesn't work. Ha.

[The Dude]

I like how people pretend you're not allowed to throw the ball if you're an option team.

 

If you follow those acadmy schools you'll notice they tend to have their best seasons when they have a QB that can throw a little too.  We have that in Martinez; an option QB that can throw a little.  Frost just seems to think he's a pocket passer. 

 

We can attract much better QBs than the academy schools.

[desertshox]

3 hours ago, The Dude said:

We can attract much better QBs than the academy schools.

 

not if you are running an option based offense.

[The Dude]

3 hours ago, desertshox said:

 

not if you are running an option based offense.

 

That's true if you ignore the entire history of Nebraska football, I suppose.