Frost and AM talking about 2022

[MdStine]

49 minutes ago, lo country said:

Going into year 5 it is very evident how poorly the O staff has done.  No serviceable back up QB (or truly developed/improved returning starter) and no RB depth (or development) to speak of.  That staff should have been jettisoned after 2019.  

 

Could it be there IS a serviceable QB on the roster but Frost is deficient in evaluating talent and knowing when to adjust and change?  Prior to the Baylor game look at OU's situation Rattler was the pre-season Heisman frontrunner but was so gawd awful on the field Riley had to make a change, something Scott hasn't or it hasn't dawned on him to do.

[RedDenver]

2 minutes ago, MdStine said:

 

Could it be there IS a serviceable QB on the roster but Frost is deficient in evaluating talent and knowing when to adjust and change?  Prior to the Baylor game look at OU's situation Rattler was the pre-season Heisman frontrunner but was so gawd awful on the field Riley had to make a change, something Scott hasn't or it hasn't dawned on him to do.

Backup QB's have played in each of the last 3 seasons. It has gone poorly.

[TGHusker]

Just now, BigRedN said:

This is how I see it as well [holding nose].  Scott believes he still 1-2 players away ... as do those who are glad we stayed the course [as I see it].

We will always be one or two players away if that is the belief. We'll always be reaching but not obtaining.  There is some kind of weird cultural thing going on.  Sometimes a big shake up is needed to get us back on track. That is why I wanted to make the HC change now.  Under Mike Riley, losing became familiar.  He was familiar with it as he was always a .500 coach.  Under Frost, it has become the culture.  They can't get over the hump because that is all they know. Frost must not be the inspiring coach and or disciplinarian that can change the core beliefs of the team.   I'll be shocked, but pleased, if they turn it around next year.  It will take a unique OC to make it happens. If it does happen then doesn't it mean that the new OC may be the better HC than Frost??  Would Frost have the courage to hire his potential replacement??  That is my I would not be surprised to see Helfrich hired as the OC.  

[MdStine]

2 hours ago, RedDenver said:

Backup QB's have played in each of the last 3 seasons. It has gone poorly.

 

In your opinion did it go poorly based on the talent or preparation of the backup's or something else?  Regardless who on the payroll own's the poor results?

[BoNeyard]

Nice guy, great individual, bad quarterback. Keep him on as a GA or something if you want him on the team so bad, but this guys days of playing QB are done. Bad OLine or not, I've seen him have 6 seconds in the pocket before and still make bad throws and decisions as as 4 year starting QB. 

[Lorewarn]

57 minutes ago, BoNeyard said:

Nice guy, great individual, bad quarterback.

 

This is still absolutely insane to me that anyone could call him a BAD quarterback.

 

There's a massive gap between bad and not the best. Martinez isn't the best but he's a long, long ways from bad. Bad quarterbacks can't do the things he's done.

[All Hail Herbie]

4 hours ago, MdStine said:

 

Could it be there IS a serviceable QB on the roster but Frost is deficient in evaluating talent and knowing when to adjust and change?  Prior to the Baylor game look at OU's situation Rattler was the pre-season Heisman frontrunner but was so gawd awful on the field Riley had to make a change, something Scott hasn't or it hasn't dawned on him to do.

You are on point here.  Player development is one root cause of our struggles the past 4 years, and will continue in Year 5.  The most alarming item in my opinion is the fact that our Head Coach does not even recognize that a problem exists.  This remains the best evidence that change is inevitable.  

[BoNeyard]

34 minutes ago, Lorewarn said:

 

This is still absolutely insane to me that anyone could call him a BAD quarterback.

 

There's a massive gap between bad and not the best. Martinez isn't the best but he's a long, long ways from bad. Bad quarterbacks can't do the things he's done.

I dont know the real number, but just guessing as I know he missed some games in his career due to injury, but Martinez is 12-24(ish)? as a starting QB. That's bad. I might take any Big Ten starting QB over Martinez on my team. As I typed that, I initially typed that as a joke, but now thinking about it, I think there is truth to it. Would he get picked last in the Big Ten if people were picking QB's for their teams?

[Lorewarn]

16 minutes ago, BoNeyard said:

Would he get picked last in the Big Ten if people were picking QB's for their teams?

 

 

Depends, is it coaches picking, or idiot fans?

 

He'd get picked 3rd at the latest if it were actual coaches.

[Undone]

Frost knows whether he'll be back or not next year already, he's just intentionally not saying it so it doesn't throw any more gas on the flaming dumpster fire.

 

There'll be a huge contingency of fans that will say that next season will be carved in stone as another losing year if Martinez comes back.

For me, Smothers is a Taylor Martinez kind of guy; he's a track star who's a really tough runner and will be able to take a lot of bruises in the run game and get back up over and over and do it again...but he doesn't seem like he has much pedigree as a passer.

 

And I'm getting really tired of that. Smothers, Adrian, Tommy Armstrong, T-Magic...these guys are "run-first" QBs. They're not really a threat when they throw.

 

In my opinion this system needs the "throw first, run second" kind of guy like McKenzie Milton, Todd Reesing, Chase Daniel, etc. Without that QB at the helm, the system needs to be slightly tweaked to become more dependent on RB handoff plays.

 

We'll see if Frost can put two & two together on these concepts that are plain as day, or whether his own stubbornness will shoot him in the foot.

[Dogs In A Pile]

7 hours ago, huskered17 said:

So is Smothers not even a choice to start, if AM doesn't return ? 

I keep seeing "portal" for our next Q/B. 

If Smothers isn't even in the running, can't see him sticking around. 

Then we have no proven back up, to whoever the starter is.

2022 is going to be ..........

 

GBR!!!

 

When AM had a broken jaw and was hobbling around with an ankle sprain HCSF still went with him over Smothers or any of the other backups. That's got to tell you something.

 

A lot of people were screaming for McCaffrey last year. After seeming him on the field the overwhelming majority were happy to have AM back the next week. Careful what you wish for.

[runningblind]

24 minutes ago, Lorewarn said:

 

 

Depends, is it coaches picking, or idiot fans?

 

He'd get picked 3rd at the latest if it were actual coaches.

I think he comes back, but if he leaves people are gonna get what they're asking for.  Throw any other less athletic QB behind that line that gave up 100+ pressures and see if we manage to score more than 15 per game in conference.

[MasterPulverizer]

15 minutes ago, Undone said:

Frost knows whether he'll be back or not next year already, he's just intentionally not saying it so it doesn't throw any more gas on the flaming dumpster fire.

 

There'll be a huge contingency of fans that will say that next season will be carved in stone as another losing year if Martinez comes back.

For me, Smothers is a Taylor Martinez kind of guy; he's a track star who's a really tough runner and will be able to take a lot of bruises in the run game and get back up over and over and do it again...but he doesn't seem like he has much pedigree as a passer.

 

And I'm getting really tired of that. Smothers, Adrian, Tommy Armstrong, T-Magic...these guys are "run-first" QBs. They're not really a threat when they throw.

 

In my opinion this system needs the "throw first, run second" kind of guy like McKenzie Milton, Todd Reesing, Chase Daniel, etc. Without that QB at the helm, the system needs to be slightly tweaked to become more dependent on RB handoff plays.

 

We'll see if Frost can put two & two together on these concepts that are plain as day, or whether his own stubbornness will shoot him in the foot.

[Undone]

Smothers is a 4 star talent who also got an offer from Ole Miss. He's obviously extremely athletic, he's tough, and he's a great runner.

 

But he just doesn't seem like he has the arm talent to do much better than Martinez. INB4 "Martinez is a turnover machine."

That is definitely a problem with 2AM. But it doesn't mean Smothers will help yield any better results in the Win/Loss column. We either need a QB from the transfer portal that is "pass first, run second" to run the playbook Frost laid out this year or we need to modify the system to be more dependent on running backs.

 

But I'm thinking Frost is too stubborn to compromise either way, personally.

[Lorewarn]

26 minutes ago, Undone said:

For me, Smothers is a Taylor Martinez kind of guy; he's a track star who's a really tough runner and will be able to take a lot of bruises in the run game and get back up over and over and do it again...but he doesn't seem like he has much pedigree as a passer.

 

And I'm getting really tired of that. Smothers, Adrian, Tommy Armstrong, T-Magic...these guys are "run-first" QBs. They're not really a threat when they throw.

 

 

Taylor and Adrian, maybe Tommy as well, are all better throwers than Frazier, Frost, Crouch, Lord etc. were.

 

That's part of what's crazy about how so many fans are overly critical about Adrian as if a major part of our program's history and identity isn't quarterbacks that weren't good at throwing.