NBA 2023-24

[AZRaiderH8r]

15 minutes ago, Guy Chamberlin said:

As a basketball fan with only Warriors allegiance, I have no idea who I'm going to root for in the Finals. I like both teams and the way they got here. 

Sounds like you have the all too rare opportunity to just watch the games and hopefully enjoy some good basketball, without a team to root for. That's honestly kind of nice I think. I usually find myself with either a great like or dislike for the teams in the final, which probably says more about me than anything else. It would be nice to sit back and just enjoy the ride. 

 

That being said, you obviously have to root for the nuggets. 

[Guy Chamberlin]

1 hour ago, AZRaiderH8r said:

Sounds like you have the all too rare opportunity to just watch the games and hopefully enjoy some good basketball, without a team to root for. That's honestly kind of nice I think. I usually find myself with either a great like or dislike for the teams in the final, which probably says more about me than anything else. It would be nice to sit back and just enjoy the ride. 

 

That being said, you obviously have to root for the nuggets. 

 

I was surprised just how hard I was rooting for both Denver and Miami. 

[admo]

3 hours ago, AZRaiderH8r said:

Sounds like you have the all too rare opportunity to just watch the games and hopefully enjoy some good basketball, without a team to root for. That's honestly kind of nice I think. I usually find myself with either a great like or dislike for the teams in the final, which probably says more about me than anything else. It would be nice to sit back and just enjoy the ride. 

 

That being said, you obviously have to root for the nuggets. 

On point 1000%.  

 

Everything you said that I bolded is exactly how I feel !   

 

But also, it is rare to enjoy that anymore.  Because of the storylines and the media hot takes....  the league's superstar and the favorites, spearheaded by ESPN Stephen A. Smith and Michael Wilbon.....   talking non-stop about Lebron, Steph, KD, Clay, Kyrie Irving, Kawhi Leonard, Giannis, Westbrook, Harden, Duncan, Kobe, Paul Pierce, Wade, Tony Parker, Popovich, Phil Jackson.........

 

I mean, that is what the voices from the ESPN/Disney and the league (NBA) have advocated about immensely during the playoffs and the Finals for the last 20 years - over and over again.  

 

20 years of life with that.  So awful.

 

But like you said, it is so good to see 2 teams playing seriously good team basketball....... and without rooting for or against a certain team or player..... and without media agenda and bias....... to just enjoy the ride like we should  

[Lorewarn]

4 hours ago, Guy Chamberlin said:

 

The thing that impresses me about Jokic, and Denver, and the Heat for that matter, is that they don't seem to ruffle or get streaky. Every game, all four quarters, No drama, except the good stuff. 

 

 

re: Jokic,

 

He might be the best fundamental (physically and mentally) basketball player ever. It's a hot take, and that doesn't mean he's the GOAT, and it's too early to say, but I've never seen anybody like him. Tim Duncan is in the same vein, and no doubt an all-time great, but nowhere near his level of just pure transcendent mastery of every facet of the game, always knowing exactly what to do and how to do it.

[admo]

1 hour ago, Lorewarn said:

 

 

re: Jokic,

 

He might be the best fundamental (physically and mentally) basketball player ever. It's a hot take, and that doesn't mean he's the GOAT, and it's too early to say, but I've never seen anybody like him. Tim Duncan is in the same vein, and no doubt an all-time great, but nowhere near his level of just pure transcendent mastery of every facet of the game, always knowing exactly what to do and how to do it.

Good point, and not a bad comparison.  Duncan was loved for a bank shot off the glass. Like he invented it in the late 90s and the 2000s.  Loved to stare down the officials when he got a foul call on him (average 2 per game).  Great defender.  Grabbed a lot of rebounds.  Played under the NBA's best coach.  But I do think they are comparable for having their own game - which is out of the box.....  or out of the norm.  

[admo]

I will say this about these two International ballers - Jokic and Nowitzki

 

And put yourself in their shoes (wish everyone did).

 

 

Here you are.  19 years old (Dirk) (Jokic 20)

Could you leave your country?  Move to South America or South Africa or Spain (for example).  Learn their language, their culture, their slang, their music?  And learn how to drive in their cities, eat their food, learn the metric system, the holidays and weather, the highs and lows of being independent of fam and friends, and also play basketball against the greatest basketball athletes in the world?  And be expected to perform?  And have a microphone in your face after a game, with media asking you in their own language to explain to them why you lost?  And then go back to your apartment each night wondering why are you there, regardless of the money?  

 

I think I recall that Dirk lived in an apartment in Dallas during his first 4 years in the NBA, went home to Germany every summer and lived with his parents in the house he grew up in.  And never had an agent.

 

I guess my point is, with all due respect to Ja Morant, Booker, Tatum, Lebron, KD, Kyrie Irving, (name your American Superstar) .......... there is no earthly way they take the steps that Dirk and Jokic take, leave America, speak fluent in another country's language (english is not their primary language), learn how to co-exist in a country with a different culture, then excel in the game against the best players in the NBA........ and lead your team to a championship game/series/title.  

[AZRaiderH8r]

14 hours ago, admo said:

On point 1000%.  

 

Everything you said that I bolded is exactly how I feel !   

 

But also, it is rare to enjoy that anymore.  Because of the storylines and the media hot takes....  the league's superstar and the favorites, spearheaded by ESPN Stephen A. Smith and Michael Wilbon.....   talking non-stop about Lebron, Steph, KD, Clay, Kyrie Irving, Kawhi Leonard, Giannis, Westbrook, Harden, Duncan, Kobe, Paul Pierce, Wade, Tony Parker, Popovich, Phil Jackson.........

 

I mean, that is what the voices from the ESPN/Disney and the league (NBA) have advocated about immensely during the playoffs and the Finals for the last 20 years - over and over again.  

 

20 years of life with that.  So awful.

 

But like you said, it is so good to see 2 teams playing seriously good team basketball....... and without rooting for or against a certain team or player..... and without media agenda and bias....... to just enjoy the ride like we should  

Exactly! I don't think any other sport has the media bias that basketball does. They just take it to an extreme. I know that I'm biased, but after the Nuggets swept the Lakers, what was the big storyline? The King might retire. Very little about the actual games, the narrative immediately flipped to LeBron, which is exactly how he wanted it. It's nauseating. 

13 hours ago, Lorewarn said:

 

 

re: Jokic,

 

He might be the best fundamental (physically and mentally) basketball player ever. It's a hot take, and that doesn't mean he's the GOAT, and it's too early to say, but I've never seen anybody like him. Tim Duncan is in the same vein, and no doubt an all-time great, but nowhere near his level of just pure transcendent mastery of every facet of the game, always knowing exactly what to do and how to do it.

This is exactly what I have been telling people these past few seasons. Jokic is just so incredibly talented in many facets of the game, and I think he's overlooked for how truly great he is. Only now are people nationally starting to see it because of the run that the Nuggets are on. He is so fundamentally sound, but I really appreciate his willingness to not be "the guy" all the time if someone else is playing well, or if there's a better play available. The one area that I wish he would clean up a bit is the tendency to commit some (at times) bad turnovers, but I'm happy to overlook those because of everything else he brings to the game. He is probably the most unselfish superstar that I've ever seen.

[Guy Chamberlin]

Honestly? I don't get the anger about media bias. If we can agree there are superstars, then surely we understand why they get superstar treatment. LeBron James has been the biggest story in the game for 20 years, often irritatingly so, but the way the game ended and the possibility it might be his last in LA or the NBA, is a big story. The same announcers and commentators have spoken with awe and superlatives about Nikola Jokic the entire playoffs. He's moving on. LeBron isn't. I've seen no one diminish what the Nuggets have accomplished. 

 

And given the chance to just watch basketball for the love of the game, the same media has done a good job pointing out how the non-superstars are earning appreciation; the Michael Porters, Bruce Browns, Austin Reeves', Rui Hachamuras, Gabe Vincents and Caleb Martins. The same media is a role player's best friend. 

 

I don't get the specific ESPN hate, either, although I prefer the TNT crews. 

 

But I do hate the "hot take" culture that has taken over sports radio and social media. Lot of stupid and biased hot takes out there in every sport, and they constantly bandwagon:  if a team loses Game One it's because their weaknesses were finally exposed. Same team comes back and wins Game Two?  Its because a superstar player finally woke up. They lose Game Three? That same superstar player doesn't care anymore. Just hyper over-reactive clickbait by guys with no skin in the game. 

[Guy Chamberlin]

I'm no analyst, but doesn't it feel like there are games where the ball is just dropping? Or not?  And it might be different the next game, without making any adjustments? 

[AZRaiderH8r]

2 hours ago, Guy Chamberlin said:

Honestly? I don't get the anger about media bias. If we can agree there are superstars, then surely we understand why they get superstar treatment. LeBron James has been the biggest story in the game for 20 years, often irritatingly so, but the way the game ended and the possibility it might be his last in LA or the NBA, is a big story. The same announcers and commentators have spoken with awe and superlatives about Nikola Jokic the entire playoffs. He's moving on. LeBron isn't. I've seen no one diminish what the Nuggets have accomplished. 

 

And given the chance to just watch basketball for the love of the game, the same media has done a good job pointing out how the non-superstars are earning appreciation; the Michael Porters, Bruce Browns, Austin Reeves', Rui Hachamuras, Gabe Vincents and Caleb Martins. The same media is a role player's best friend. 

 

I don't get the specific ESPN hate, either, although I prefer the TNT crews. 

 

But I do hate the "hot take" culture that has taken over sports radio and social media. Lot of stupid and biased hot takes out there in every sport, and they constantly bandwagon:  if a team loses Game One it's because their weaknesses were finally exposed. Same team comes back and wins Game Two?  Its because a superstar player finally woke up. They lose Game Three? That same superstar player doesn't care anymore. Just hyper over-reactive clickbait by guys with no skin in the game. 

That's fair. My anger about the media bias is also deeply rooted in decades of being a Nuggets fan with few opportunities to be in the limelight, so admittedly, we're a bit salty about anything we deem to be a lack of respect towards our team. Completely unfair, I understand. But it goes back a long time with this team. Personally, I'm just tired of LeBron. I don't deny that he's one of the greatest ever, that can't be argued. I don't for one second think that he's going to retire, but I could be wrong about that. I'm just thrilled that he was swept out of the playoffs in the last round.

[Guy Chamberlin]

10 minutes ago, AZRaiderH8r said:

Personally, I'm just tired of LeBron. I don't deny that he's one of the greatest ever, that can't be argued. I don't for one second think that he's going to retire, but I could be wrong about that. I'm just thrilled that he was swept out of the playoffs in the last round.

 

I would have preferred one round earlier. 

[admo]

Eh, just seen it too many times when a real underdog pulls out a miracle win (regular season).  And instead of giving that underdog fanbase something to be excited about with highlights and analyst and love, the media talks mostly about the super product (I.E., the league's best team that just lost) and shows highlights about them instead.  That is just so wrong to do that IMO.

 

I remember far too many games seeing the mighty Spurs (Duncan/Parker/Ginobli), or mighty Lakers (Shaq/Kobe/Kobe/Kobe/Kobe), or the mighty "whoever" that they talk about every night - get beat and lose a game - and the focus and highlights and discussion is about how they lost ...........  instead of giving the glory and honor to who beat them.  

 

If that makes sense. 

 

Been like that for 20 years now with Sports Networks, so we know it won't change.  And although I have been forced to be accustomed to that type of post-game production,  it sure doesn't mean I have to like it.  So I vent.  Especially here 

[AZRaiderH8r]

Come on Miami, get it together already! 

[JJ Husker]

2 hours ago, AZRaiderH8r said:

Come on Miami, get it together already! 

Or, and hear me out, the Celtics come back from down 0-3, win the series, and THEN the Nuggets trounce Boston. Huh? How fun would that be?

 

Not many outside of Miami and Denver would care about that finals but toss Boston into it and you have a whole bunch more people pulling for Denver cuz nobody in their right mind likes any Boston team.

[sho]

23 minutes ago, JJ Husker said:

Or, and hear me out, the Celtics come back from down 0-3, win the series, and THEN the Nuggets trounce Boston. Huh? How fun would that be?

 

Not many outside of Miami and Denver would care about that finals but toss Boston into it and you have a whole bunch more people pulling for Denver cuz nobody in their right mind likes any Boston team.

I don't want to give those dirty c-bags any history.  being the 1st team to come back from 0-3 is just too much.  Regardless that Denver should curb stomp them in the Finals.   They only deserve pain and suffering and nothing that they can say we made history.