Did Bo concentrate too much on scheme?
- Thread starter Haspula
- Start date
Eric the Red
Team HuskerBoard
Were there any other players that seem to be pushed back due to this? It seems if you can't learn the system you can't play. is that really a bad thing. Like a RB that can't hold on to the ball they just can't play.Haspula said:
StPaulHusker
Banned
Count 'Bility
Banned
All I know is looking back, and knowing what we know now and plenty of evidence to back it up, had Compton and Fisher not been hurt preseason 2010, we may very well have no idea who Lavonte David is to this day. He got thrown into a spot, went out, and played football. Ive brought this up before, had this discussion with friends with very little disagreement, and its pretty obvious in my eyes. And that is a shame.
ColoradoHusk
Heisman Trophy Winner
Coaches are generally going to play the guys who practice well and who "play within the scheme". Most coaches need to have a "trust" factor that the players are going to do what is asked on a certain play.
Lavonte David isn't the only guy who used his athletic ability to make plays. Damon Benning has said on his radio show that Terrell Farley would drive the coaches nuts when he was at NU. Farley was a terrible "practice player" and was always doing "his own thing". Farley didn't start right away in 1995, but after a couple games of making big plays on defense, the coaches decided that they couldn't leave him off the field. It got to the point to where the coaches had to tell other LB's and safeties to alter their scheme to be a safety-net for Farley, because Farley was always going to freelance.
Some coaches are able to devise schemes that allow that type of "freelancing", and some coaches will want to force the players into their schemes. I am sure there are successes with both types of coaches.
Lavonte David isn't the only guy who used his athletic ability to make plays. Damon Benning has said on his radio show that Terrell Farley would drive the coaches nuts when he was at NU. Farley was a terrible "practice player" and was always doing "his own thing". Farley didn't start right away in 1995, but after a couple games of making big plays on defense, the coaches decided that they couldn't leave him off the field. It got to the point to where the coaches had to tell other LB's and safeties to alter their scheme to be a safety-net for Farley, because Farley was always going to freelance.
Some coaches are able to devise schemes that allow that type of "freelancing", and some coaches will want to force the players into their schemes. I am sure there are successes with both types of coaches.
NUance
Assistant Coach
Ha ha! Farley was exactly who I was thinking of when I opened this thread. Used to drive guys like Mike Minter crazy, that is, guys who understood the schemes/reads and were always in place making the right reads. Man, I wish we had guys like Farley and Minter playing for us now.
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True2tRA
Banned
Just off the top of my head I'd say Eric Martin was a guy I thought should have found his way onto the field a lot sooner than he did.
Charles Jackson should have played from the day he got here IMO. If I was the coach, I would have found a spot for him at least. I know his injury destroyed those chances last year.
What happened to Courtney Osborne, that safety that seemed to be coming along pretty well and then vanished?
There's more but I don't have time to list them right now.
Obviously most of this is pure speculation, there could be real reasons these guys didn't see the field earlier, so please Huskerboarders....save the "you think you know better than the coaches" garbage. I KNOW I don't know better than the coaches. As a fan, I can speculate and gossip as much as I want unless somebody makes me stop.
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I think that Bo had the experience of seeing that process and scheme was critical to success and I think that he was right. The part that he was missing was the ability to consistently be creative and flexible so his teams were at times left exposed as they could not quickly adjust an adapt. I it was the small things that left Bo unable to respond well when he team started to back peddle in games against good teams.
True2tRA
Banned
There comes a point where you determine that 1: your scheme is too complicated 2: your assistant coaches cannot coach your scheme at a high level, resulting in some of your better talent not seeing the field. You then either alter/simplify your scheme or you hire better assistants/teachers who can teach your players to execute the system.
Or you just continue the same scheme, with the same coaches. You continually get exposed by the same opponents when your same players can't execute the same scheme year after year.
Or you just continue the same scheme, with the same coaches. You continually get exposed by the same opponents when your same players can't execute the same scheme year after year.
ColoradoHusk
Heisman Trophy Winner
That's a great point. Bo was so hell-bent on his "scheme" working so well, that when things went wrong, it was only natural for players to start questioning the scheme and themselves. As soon as that seed of doubt is planted, the team was screwed.
Of course, there were a lot of players after the Wisconsin massacre in the 2012 Big Ten title game who said it was just one or two guys who "were doing their own thing" and the scheme "busted". I have no idea who or what to believe from that game, but it was scary to see another "scheme" bust again against Wisconsin this past season.
zoogs
Assistant Coach
Courtney Osborne was reported to have had concussion issues, so they were only able to clear him to play on kickoff coverage units. And a few other plays. Heh.
That was always a mystery to me, too.
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True2tRA
Banned
Good post +1. There are probably just as many examples of ultra talented guys who got on the field and hurt their team versus ultra talented guys who weren't given the chance to hurt their team.
Funny thing is, when talking about Bo Pelini's tenure here, is that we saw guys who "just didn't execute" week after week according to Bo. So at what point is there some accountability or a change made? When your starters aren't executing your scheme week after week, year after year, doesn't something have to give eventually? I guess I would think so.....
BigRedBuster
International Man of Mystery
I get confused as to what people talk about when this subject comes up.
My view is, any player in a team sport needs to be playing within the scheme. They need to know the scheme and be able to play within the realm of what the coaches and the team expects them to do. One heck of a lot of very good teams failed because players didn't play within the team.
Now, personally, I just think Bo's scheme sucked and certain players knew it. They didn't want to play in this read and react defense that allow them to use their athletic ability.
It's no different than our HS basketball team. There is a kid that just thinks he can do what ever he wants out there and doesn't work with his team mates to do what the coach wants. He could be a pretty decent player. But, he ends up not getting much playing time because he just doesn't communicate and play within the system the rest of the players are playing.
So, in short, I understand getting the best athletes on the field. But, it isn't as simple as, just put them out there and let them use their athleticism and play. They have to still understand their assignments and play within what ever system the coach wants them to play.
My view is, any player in a team sport needs to be playing within the scheme. They need to know the scheme and be able to play within the realm of what the coaches and the team expects them to do. One heck of a lot of very good teams failed because players didn't play within the team.
Now, personally, I just think Bo's scheme sucked and certain players knew it. They didn't want to play in this read and react defense that allow them to use their athletic ability.
It's no different than our HS basketball team. There is a kid that just thinks he can do what ever he wants out there and doesn't work with his team mates to do what the coach wants. He could be a pretty decent player. But, he ends up not getting much playing time because he just doesn't communicate and play within the system the rest of the players are playing.
So, in short, I understand getting the best athletes on the field. But, it isn't as simple as, just put them out there and let them use their athleticism and play. They have to still understand their assignments and play within what ever system the coach wants them to play.
SuperBigFan69
Head Coach
I coached with a guy that played at NU...he said during film study the secondary coach would use this "format" each time
1. Okay guys...what coverage are we in?
2. Good...cover 2
3. Okay guys...what is player X doing (I can't remember the guys name now but he was a starter and pretty good)
4. That is right, player X is in Man, doing his own thing (everyone would laugh)
5. But, he got away with it and made a great play...
Basically the DB in question didn't "get it" in practice but made plays in the games...so they didn't yell at him all that much.