Barney Moving to TE Coach?

[Polarhusker]

Anyone want to take a guess at the last Husker OL drafted in the first 3 rounds?

Pos RD PK Team

2002 Toniu Fonoti OL 2 39 San Diego

2001 Dominic Raiola C 2 50 Detroit

Looks like our system and coaching has sucked since 2001, 2002

 

[Polarhusker]

Buster, don't cherry pick points to support your argument. I think you're missing the point.

Long is an anomaly for the walk ons and we're lucky to have him. But look at Choi and Jackson. Neither garnered national pub. They weren't world beaters, but they WERE the best we had. That is telling.

I think the running game stats are a by product of the offense we run and having a fantastic running QB and one of the best stable of RBs NU has had in years.

When evaluating something, look at the strengths AND weaknesses. Totally agree with Enhance. We're questioning Barney's proficiency in perfecting pass pro and developing and improving kids with good potential.

To a lot of us, it seems they show up in the program with that potential, and it goes largely untapped while here. They don't tend to get noticeably better, and thus aren't highly valued in the eyes of NFL scouts.

I dont really have a dog in the fight. Pretty much indifferent either way. It is what it is. But c'mon, I dont care how good the backs and running qb is. Someone's making the damn holes. It's and 11-man setup. They win as a team and lose as a team.

c'mon everyone knows that the running game has nothing to do with the OL. :dunno

 

[Polarhusker]

So, let me get this straight. A walkon comes here, beats out more physically gifted players, becomes an all American, our running game is top 10 nationally against some pretty decent defenses and it's all because our coaching sucks?

We can't detract from what Spencer Long has done, but as dudeguy pointed out, he's not the rule - he's an exception. When two of your best recruits leave (Moore/Klachko), your linemen aren't being drafted in the first three rounds ever, and the guys you do bring in to actually be major contributors aren't producing to their potential (Andrew Rodriguez), I think there's an issue.

I have no problem with the walk-ons, but let support the argument again. We don't have the system in place nor the coaching to have walk-ons be as big of a staple as they once were. Perhaps we can develop it again, but we don't have it right now. Therefore, losing big recruits or recruits just straight up not panning out really hurts our ability to compete nationally.

Funny how ten to fifteen years ago a walk-on making the two deep was a success story, now it's the failure of the system and coaching. we have a great talent in Long, but according to this board he's "he's not the rule". why can't we see it for what it is, he's a great OL that's a walk-on and (at this point in time) has more talent then the rest at his position. doesn't mean that the rest won't have this talent in the near future, but that they have some more work to do.

when you say "When two of your best recruits leave (Moore/Klachko)", isn't that a little over the top? if Moore was our best OL he would of been starting, but wasn't. some say he was going to be 2nd string. Now Klachko is the one the makes me LOL. he never saw the field, did something that was against the policy's of the football program and is no longer playing football because of medical problems. how is that one of the best?

My point exactly.

So, I guess in some fan's eyes, if I'm the O line coach, I shouldn't ever start a walkon above a "highly recruited player" because that would mean I'm a failure.

He does bring up some good points but I feel they will say anything that will support the "there's an issue" agenda. and to be honest with ya there's not a single person on this board that actually knows what's going on with Bo and the team. it's all pure speculation.

 

[StPaulHusker]

Anyone want to take a guess at the last Husker OL drafted in the first 3 rounds?

Pos RD PK Team

2002 Toniu Fonoti OL 2 39 San Diego

2001 Dominic Raiola C 2 50 Detroit

Looks like our system and coaching has sucked since 2001, 2002

Amazing isn't it? And I believe Zach Wiegert aand Aaron Taylor, who were National Award Winners, went in rounds 3 and up. The argument about walk ons starting over high ranked recruits is so weak.

 

[Enhance]

Funny how ten to fifteen years ago a walk-on making the two deep was a success story, now it's the failure of the system and coaching. we have a great talent in Long, but according to this board he's "he's not the rule". why can't we see it for what it is, he's a great OL that's a walk-on and (at this point in time) has more talent then the rest at his position. doesn't mean that the rest won't have this talent in the near future, but that they have some more work to do.

when you say "When two of your best recruits leave (Moore/Klachko)", isn't that a little over the top? if Moore was our best OL he would of been starting, but wasn't. some say he was going to be 2nd string. Now Klachko is the one the makes me LOL. he never saw the field, did something that was against the policy's of the football program and is no longer playing football because of medical problems. how is that one of the best?

First, fifteen years ago is not today, and that's what I'm trying to express. We had a tenured system with a tenured coaching staff in place when Osborne was here, capable of taking less talented players i.e. walk-ons and turning them into success stories, and even NFL draft picks. This is not to say Long is a poor lineman - he's turned into a very good lineman. But, there's no denying that we have been extremely unsuccessful developing offensive linemen. And, again, I believe our lack of relevance in the NFL draft is evidence enough of this. I'm not saying it's the end-all-be-all, but it's still worthy of mention.

Second, Moore was a freshman, a true freshman, starting at Nebraska. He was a highly touted recruit that Meyer tried to get to come to Florida. He's gone. Klachko was being lauded as another potentially very good linemen. He's gone. Andrew Rodriguez, a four-star linemen and one of the best Nebraska players over the last five years, is behind where I thought he would be. We have a consistent tred of inconsistency along the offensive line, whether it be players leaving or players just not panning out. The line was better last year, but in comparison to where we want to be (Alabama), we don't even compare. They're the standard.

I love our walk-on stories, but I don't think it means the same today as it did 15-20 years ago when we had an entirely different system in place with a coaching staff that'd been together for 20+ years. It'd be one thing if our walk-ons were the best linemen in the conference and going to the NFL, but they're not (with the exception of Long), which means we have a recruiting problem, a coaching problem, or a combination of the two...problem.

 

[StPaulHusker]

Funny how ten to fifteen years ago a walk-on making the two deep was a success story, now it's the failure of the system and coaching. we have a great talent in Long, but according to this board he's "he's not the rule". why can't we see it for what it is, he's a great OL that's a walk-on and (at this point in time) has more talent then the rest at his position. doesn't mean that the rest won't have this talent in the near future, but that they have some more work to do.

when you say "When two of your best recruits leave (Moore/Klachko)", isn't that a little over the top? if Moore was our best OL he would of been starting, but wasn't. some say he was going to be 2nd string. Now Klachko is the one the makes me LOL. he never saw the field, did something that was against the policy's of the football program and is no longer playing football because of medical problems. how is that one of the best?

First, fifteen years ago is not today, and that's what I'm trying to express. We had a tenured system with a tenured coaching staff in place when Osborne was here, capable of taking less talented players i.e. walk-ons and turning them into success stories, and even NFL draft picks. This is not to say Long is a poor lineman - he's turned into a very good lineman. But, there's no denying that we have been extremely unsuccessful developing offensive linemen. And, again, I believe our lack of relevance in the NFL draft is evidence enough of this. I'm not saying it's the end-all-be-all, but it's still worthy of mention.

Second, Moore was a freshman, a true freshman, starting at Nebraska. He was a highly touted recruit that Meyer tried to get to come to Florida. He's gone. Klachko was being lauded as another potentially very good linemen. He's gone. Andrew Rodriguez, a four-star linemen and one of the best Nebraska players over the last five years, is behind where I thought he would be. We have a consistent tred of inconsistency along the offensive line, whether it be players leaving or players just not panning out. The line was better last year, but in comparison to where we want to be (Alabama), we don't even compare. They're the standard.

I love our walk-on stories, but I don't think it means the same today as it did 15-20 years ago when we had an entirely different system in place with a coaching staff that'd been together for 20+ years. It'd be one thing if our walk-ons were the best linemen in the conference and going to the NFL, but they're not (with the exception of Long), which means we have a recruiting problem, a coaching problem, or a combination of the two...problem.

I think you are forgetting also that when Callahan was fired, the cupboard was almost empty of OL. Bo basically started from scratch. So I think it would be unfair in his first 5 years to put too much emphasis on him about not getting any to the next level. He did not have that many to begin with and he just graduated his first full class this year. Give him the next 5 years and if we do not consistently have 1-3 OL in the first 4 rounds, I would say the criticism is warranted.

 

[AFhusker]

Anyone want to take a guess at the last Husker OL drafted in the first 3 rounds?

Pos RD PK Team

2002 Toniu Fonoti OL 2 39 San Diego

2001 Dominic Raiola C 2 50 Detroit

Looks like our system and coaching has sucked since 2001, 2002

It has sucked since Tom retied from coaching. At that point Frank was running out of Tom's recruits to make him look good.

 

[BigRedBuster]

Funny how ten to fifteen years ago a walk-on making the two deep was a success story, now it's the failure of the system and coaching. we have a great talent in Long, but according to this board he's "he's not the rule". why can't we see it for what it is, he's a great OL that's a walk-on and (at this point in time) has more talent then the rest at his position. doesn't mean that the rest won't have this talent in the near future, but that they have some more work to do.

when you say "When two of your best recruits leave (Moore/Klachko)", isn't that a little over the top? if Moore was our best OL he would of been starting, but wasn't. some say he was going to be 2nd string. Now Klachko is the one the makes me LOL. he never saw the field, did something that was against the policy's of the football program and is no longer playing football because of medical problems. how is that one of the best?

First, fifteen years ago is not today, and that's what I'm trying to express. We had a tenured system with a tenured coaching staff in place when Osborne was here, capable of taking less talented players i.e. walk-ons and turning them into success stories, and even NFL draft picks. This is not to say Long is a poor lineman - he's turned into a very good lineman. But, there's no denying that we have been extremely unsuccessful developing offensive linemen. And, again, I believe our lack of relevance in the NFL draft is evidence enough of this. I'm not saying it's the end-all-be-all, but it's still worthy of mention.

Second, Moore was a freshman, a true freshman, starting at Nebraska. He was a highly touted recruit that Meyer tried to get to come to Florida. He's gone. Klachko was being lauded as another potentially very good linemen. He's gone. Andrew Rodriguez, a four-star linemen and one of the best Nebraska players over the last five years, is behind where I thought he would be. We have a consistent tred of inconsistency along the offensive line, whether it be players leaving or players just not panning out. The line was better last year, but in comparison to where we want to be (Alabama), we don't even compare. They're the standard.

I love our walk-on stories, but I don't think it means the same today as it did 15-20 years ago when we had an entirely different system in place with a coaching staff that'd been together for 20+ years. It'd be one thing if our walk-ons were the best linemen in the conference and going to the NFL, but they're not (with the exception of Long), which means we have a recruiting problem, a coaching problem, or a combination of the two...problem.

I think you are forgetting also that when Callahan was fired, the cupboard was almost empty of OL. Bo basically started from scratch. So I think it would be unfair in his first 5 years to put too much emphasis on him about not getting any to the next level. He did not have that many to begin with and he just graduated his first full class this year. Give him the next 5 years and if we do not consistently have 1-3 OL in the first 4 rounds, I would say the criticism is warranted.

And, if you are going to use the fact that Moore and Klachko are gone against the coaching staff, you might want to review why at least Klachko is gone.

 

[StPaulHusker]

Anyone want to take a guess at the last Husker OL drafted in the first 3 rounds?

Pos RD PK Team

2002 Toniu Fonoti OL 2 39 San Diego

2001 Dominic Raiola C 2 50 Detroit

Looks like our system and coaching has sucked since 2001, 2002

It has sucked since Tom retied from coaching. At that point Frank was running out of Tom's recruits to make him look good.

We had great Linemen before Tom retired but the last 1st rounder we had was I think Dean Steinkuhler. I mean, if this doesn't tell you just how difficult it is to develop linemen, I don't know what does.

 

[Mavric]

First, fifteen years ago is not today, and that's what I'm trying to express. We had a tenured system with a tenured coaching staff in place when Osborne was here, capable of taking less talented players i.e. walk-ons and turning them into success stories, and even NFL draft picks. This is not to say Long is a poor lineman - he's turned into a very good lineman. But, there's no denying that we have been extremely unsuccessful developing offensive linemen. And, again, I believe our lack of relevance in the NFL draft is evidence enough of this. I'm not saying it's the end-all-be-all, but it's still worthy of mention.

Bo has had exactly zero recruiting classes go all the way through his system. He really didn't recruit the 2008 class and most of the 2009 class is still playing. That class includes Long, Sirles and Qvale. Ash and Coffey didn't work out but there are two three-year starters - including a 2nd-team All-American, an All-Conference, a 2nd team All-Conference and a Freshman All-American - and a two-year starter out of those five. That is a long ways from unsuccessful in my book.

Second, Moore was a freshman, a true freshman, starting at Nebraska. He was a highly touted recruit that Meyer tried to get to come to Florida. He's gone. Klachko was being lauded as another potentially very good linemen. He's gone. Andrew Rodriguez, a four-star linemen and one of the best Nebraska players over the last five years, is behind where I thought he would be. We have a consistent tred of inconsistency along the offensive line, whether it be players leaving or players just not panning out. The line was better last year, but in comparison to where we want to be (Alabama), we don't even compare. They're the standard.

And these have to be all the coaches' fault? The players have nothing to do with any of this?

I love our walk-on stories, but I don't think it means the same today as it did 15-20 years ago when we had an entirely different system in place with a coaching staff that'd been together for 20+ years. It'd be one thing if our walk-ons were the best linemen in the conference and going to the NFL, but they're not (with the exception of Long), which means we have a recruiting problem, a coaching problem, or a combination of the two...problem.

This coaching staff is supposed to be as good after 5 years as that one was after 20? And there are no other mitigating factors that have changed the situation in the last 20 years?

Convenient how you keep trying to brush aside the successes and concentrate on the failures.

 

[LumberJackSker]

pelini and cotton inherited a crappy situtation when it comes to the offensive line i think we can all agree with that no matter our opinion of cotton but i think its also far to say that the offensive line should be better 5 years in, i dont wont to come off like cotton is the worst coach in the world because he isnt and he has done a decent job but its not were it should be hopefully this move will put the team and the offensive line in a better position to succeed and will get the team over the hump. cottons experience should still help out the staff expecially when you got a young coach like beck making the calls a veteran coach like cotton is a valuable person to have

 

[Polarhusker]

First, fifteen years ago is not today, and that's what I'm trying to express. We had a tenured system with a tenured coaching staff in place when Osborne was here, capable of taking less talented players i.e. walk-ons and turning them into success stories, and even NFL draft picks. This is not to say Long is a poor lineman - he's turned into a very good lineman. But, there's no denying that we have been extremely unsuccessful developing offensive linemen. And, again, I believe our lack of relevance in the NFL draft is evidence enough of this. I'm not saying it's the end-all-be-all, but it's still worthy of mention.

Bo has had exactly zero recruiting classes go all the way through his system. He really didn't recruit the 2008 class and most of the 2009 class is still playing. That class includes Long, Sirles and Qvale. Ash and Coffey didn't work out but there are two three-year starters - including a 2nd-team All-American, an All-Conference, a 2nd team All-Conference and a Freshman All-American - and a two-year starter out of those five. That is a long ways from unsuccessful in my book.

Not saying that I totally disagree with you but I do believe that you’re pulling a lot of crap out of your a$$. So what you're saying is when Bo and the coaches get a walk-on it’s a fluke or the exception because Bo doesn’t have a tenured system with a tenured coaching staff as when Osborne was here. That’s just BS.

Try giving the walk-on players and coaches a little more credit than that.

Second, Moore was a freshman, a true freshman, starting at Nebraska. He was a highly touted recruit that Meyer tried to get to come to Florida. He's gone. Klachko was being lauded as another potentially very good linemen. He's gone. Andrew Rodriguez, a four-star linemen and one of the best Nebraska players over the last five years, is behind where I thought he would be. We have a consistent tred of inconsistency along the offensive line, whether it be players leaving or players just not panning out. The line was better last year, but in comparison to where we want to be (Alabama), we don't even compare. They're the standard.

And these have to be all the coaches' fault? The players have nothing to do with any of this?

Moore as a FR was not the best player on the team. If I remember correctly we had several OL that were injured and when they finally became healthy, Moore lost his starting job. It's good to see that Klachko was the only OL signed that year that had was lauded as another potentially very good linemen. the other players must of really sucked. Klachko should never be mentioned as being one of the best players that left. Never.

I love our walk-on stories, but I don't think it means the same today as it did 15-20 years ago when we had an entirely different system in place with a coaching staff that'd been together for 20+ years. It'd be one thing if our walk-ons were the best linemen in the conference and going to the NFL, but they're not (with the exception of Long), which means we have a recruiting problem, a coaching problem, or a combination of the two...problem.

This coaching staff is supposed to be as good after 5 years as that one was after 20? And there are no other mitigating factors that have changed the situation in the last 20 years?

Convenient how you keep trying to brush aside the successes and concentrate on the failures.

+1

 

[Danny Bateman]

Look, Polar, we're not trashing the staff or the walk on program at all. Both Enhance and I recognize that Long is a damn good lineman and we're lucky to have him. He's an AA and the walk on program deserves some recognition for that.

On the other hand, it says something about the ability of the staff to develop talent if too much of the depth chart is filled with walk ons. The offensive line has traditionally been a very walk-on rich area of the team, as it is easier to find a cornfed Nebraska lineman who is willing to work his tail off, add the necessary size, and give everything he has to get playing time there than it is to find an elite athlete within Nebraska's borders who isn't highly recruited, walks on for us and ends up being a great success story. There just aren't the athletes in Nebraska to provide very many walk-on skill position starters.

But let's not throw the recruiting services totally out the door. Players are ranked on a combination of size, athletic ability, projectability to the next level, and number of offers from big time schools. The reason the scholarship OL get more :star's than walk ons is because it is the consensus that they will be more successful at the college level than a small town Nebraska kid with only regional offers.

If OSU, Florida, Bama, USC, and NU all offer a kid, it's a pretty good bet a lot of people think he will be a pretty good player at the college level.

So lets not throw stars out the window. The reason kids get stars is because the recruiting experts believe they will have success at the college level. So what is wrong with questioning WHY a large number of those kids don't pan out when they come here, and WHY those "high potential" guys don't end up getting drafted higher when they're done at NU?

And yes, it is a legitimate complaint about Moore and Klachko, because when they arrived here, they were the two most heralded OL recruits that year. Sterup and Reeves were both in state kids and thus more lightly recruited (I believe Iowa made a good push at Sterup but that's about it), and Mordi-Price was a late addition who was the lowest rated kid.

I don't think either of us think Barney is a terrible OL coach. He's got the run game working damn good and their ability to grind defenses down throughout games is quite impressive. But we're questioning if he's the BEST we could be doing-- as having the BEST OL coach we can have will make it that much easier to get over the hump and finally win the big games-- as it appears Barney is not very skilled at developing lineman who pass protect well.

Also, Barney's track record of improving and getting the most out of highly rated recruits (who SHOULD be easier to turn into dominant players) is suspect.

 

[Danny Bateman]

In conclusion, why do we have such a hard time turning the highest rated kids we get into dominant college players on the OL?

 

[StPaulHusker]

In conclusion, why do we have such a hard time turning the highest rated kids we get into dominant college players on the OL?

I don't think it is a fair question yet. We need a few cycles of "highly rated" OL to come and go in order to churn them out all the time. Competition breeds dominance. We are on the right track with this class.