Good news for us re: Obamacare/ACA

Carl-What would you like JJ to say?

JJ has a problem with the fact his premiums were up year over year by a consistent 14-16%. Soon it will go up 30+% due to what he feels are provisions based on ACA/Obamacare.

Of course he can't prove that without ACA, the premium wouldn't have been lower just like you can't prove it wouldn't have been higher. But a rational mind would sense that based on history, it would not have been higher and actually stayed consistent.

And so since ACA will lower premiums for "some people", JJ shouldn't care or actually be happy to pay the higher premiums?

 
But a rational mind would sense that based on history, it would not have been higher and actually stayed consistent.
And what do you think would be consistent? The "trend" from the past decade? 50 years? 2 years? What do you think that trend is?

And so since ACA will lower premiums for "some people", JJ shouldn't care or actually be happy to pay the higher premiums?
I can't recall ever saying that.

 
But a rational mind would sense that based on history, it would not have been higher and actually stayed consistent.
And what do you think would be consistent? The "trend" from the past decade? 50 years? 2 years? What do you think that trend is?

And so since ACA will lower premiums for "some people", JJ shouldn't care or actually be happy to pay the higher premiums?
I can't recall ever saying that.
I see you are going to play this game again where somebody asks you a question and you respond with more questions.

What do you want JJ to say?

Did I imply you said the statement above? I asked you a question. I asked you if that is the response you are looking for from JJ.

 
In the three years since, a steady accumulation of evidence has amassed to the contrary. Through a thousand tiny nudges, the law has transformed the entire medical field from one that encouraged more, and more expensive, care with no regard for outcome into one geared toward paying for quality. Some of the changes have been blunt and simple. The old pay-for-quantity system rewarded hospitals for doing a bad job, since patients who contracted an infection or received poor treatment would come back for more treatment, bringing in a second Medicare reimbursement. Obamacare created penalties for hospitals with high rates of infection or patient readmission. Lo and behold, this year, Medicare announced that its patient-readmission rates fell—“a feat that long seemed beyond reach,” the Washington Post reported.
Obamacare also imposed a tax on the most expensive insurance plans, and though the tax does not take effect until 2018, employers have already started shopping around to avoid its bite. “Companies hoping to avoid the tax,” reported the New York Times last spring, “are beginning to scale back the more generous health benefits they have traditionally offered and to look harder for ways to bring down the overall cost of care.”

The most dramatic change underfoot is an entrepreneurial wave encouraged in sundry ways by Obamacare. The law encourages the creation of Accountable Care Organizations—doctors who band together and get paid based on their patients’ medical outcomes rather than on how many tests and procedures they perform. As Bloomberg News reported in June, “Hospitals are improving care and saving millions of dollars with one of the least touted but potentially most effective provisions of the law.” Walgreens is making a huge investment in its own ACOs, and the consulting firm Accenture predicts the law will continue to prompt an explosion of walk-in clinics. The significant increase in doctors and hospitals converting to electronic medical records and other technological innovations has helped create “a new marketplace and platform for innovation—a health-care Silicon Valley,” as an awed Thomas Friedman reported.

All these reforms have added up to a revolution in modern medical economics. Health-care inflation since 2011 has fallen to its lowest level in half a century. The Congressional Budget Office estimates of Obamacare’s costs, widely derided at the time of its passage as too optimistic, have thus far proven too pessimistic. The agency has already cut $600 billion off the expected ten-year spending total for Medicare and Medicaid. If the reforms continue to bear fruit, costs will come in even lower.

And health experts increasingly expect the reforms will bear fruit. “The ongoing slowdown in the health-care growth rate defies historical post-­recession patterns and is likely to be ­sustained,” concluded Price­water­house­Coopers in June. “It appears that the reforms will stick and health-care exchanges and other policies will bring competitive pressure to markets,” says Randall Ellis, a professor of health-care economics. “Although the proof for this point of view is not yet definitive,” reports the Health Affairs blog, “the depth and breadth of change suggest that significant transformation in the nation’s delivery system is under way.” Among health-care wonks, this is no longer a controversial assertion: The evidence thus far suggests Obamacare’s cost reforms are a staggering success.
http://nymag.com/new...re-plot-2013-9/

Much, much more at the link.

Edit, Have to add this part:

The policy wonks who most closely share the administration’s worldview—analysts like Ezra Klein, Jonathan Cohn, and Sarah Kliff—have acted like real wonks, weighing the bad alongside the good, re-creating the Nate Silver–versus–unskewedpolls.com imbalance of assuredness. Nobody can honestly argue the law is certain to succeed. You can’t honestly argue it’s certain to fail, either, but that hasn’t stopped some from doing so.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Letter from Trader Joe's:

Thank you for writing to us. It's possible you have been misled, at least to some degree, by the headlines in some articles regarding our reasons for implementing the [Affordable Care Act] in January. We'd like to take this opportunity to clarify some facts.
For over 77% of our Crew Members there is absolutely no change to their healthcare coverage provided by Trader Joe's.

The ACA brings a new potential player into the arena for the acquisition of health care. Stated quite simply, the law is centered on providing low cost options to people who do not make a lot of money. Somewhat by definition, the law provides those people a pretty good deal for insurance ... a deal that can't be matched by us -- or any company. However, an individual employee (we call them Crew Member) is only able to receive the tax credit from the exchanges under the act if we do not offer them insurance under our company plan.

Perhaps an example will help. A Crew Member called in the other day and was quite unhappy that she was being dropped from our coverage unless she worked more hours. She is a single mom with one child who makes $18 per hour and works about 25 hours per week. We ran the numbers for her. She currently pays $166.50 per month for her coverage with Trader Joe's. Because of the tax credits under the ACA she can go to an exchange and purchase insurance that is almost identical to our plan for $69.59 per month. Accordingly, by going to the exchange she will save $1,175 each year ... and that is before counting the $500 we will give her in January.

While we understand her fear of change, at her income level this is a big benefit that we will help her achieve.

Clearly, there are others who will go to the exchanges and will be required to pay more. That is usually because they have other income and typically a spouse who had a job with no benefits and they do not qualify for the subsidies under the ACA. One example of that we had yesterday was the male Crew Member who worked an average of 20 hours per week but had a spouse who is a contract consultant who makes more than $200,000 per year. The Crew Member worked for the medical benefits and unfortunately for them they are likely to have to pay more because of their real income. We understand how important healthcare coverage is to our Crew Members and we are pleased to be able to provide and support this program.

We do hope this information helps, and we appreciate your interest in Trader Joe's.
http://www.washingto...e-of-the-story/

 
Last edited by a moderator:
But a rational mind would sense that based on history, it would not have been higher and actually stayed consistent.
And what do you think would be consistent? The "trend" from the past decade? 50 years? 2 years? What do you think that trend is?

And so since ACA will lower premiums for "some people", JJ shouldn't care or actually be happy to pay the higher premiums?
I can't recall ever saying that.
Maybe we can put this to bed. One question for Carl;

Carl, based on what I have offered as evidence in the last few pages of this thread, about my company's specific situation with our renewal, would you agree that implementation of the ACA on Jan 1, 2014 is directly causing my plans (ours, not anybody else's) renewal rates to be about 24% higher than they would have been without Obamacare?

 
Carl, based on what I have offered as evidence in the last few pages of this thread, about my company's specific situation with our renewal, would you agree that implementation of the ACA on Jan 1, 2014 is directly causing my plans (ours, not anybody else's) renewal rates to be about 24% higher than they would have been without Obamacare?
I can't agree because we don't know what your pre-Jan 1 rate would have been without the ACA.

I'm not sure how I can state that any more clearly. It's obvious that it's not getting through.

Edit:

I agree that your December 1 post-ACA rate would be approximately 24% lower than your January 1 post-ACA rate. Beyond that, we'd both be speculating.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Ball back in the union's court. Request denied.

Dear Leader Reid and Leader Pelosi:

When you and the President sought our support for the Affordable Care Act (ACA), you pledged that if we liked the health plans we have now, we could keep them. Sadly, that promise is under threat. Right now, unless you and the Obama Administration enact an equitable fix, the ACA will shatter not only our hard-earned health benefits, but destroy the foundation of the 40 hour work week that is the backbone of the American middle class.

Like millions of other Americans, our members are front-line workers in the American economy. We have been strong supporters of the notion that all Americans should have access to quality, affordable health care. We have also been strong supporters of you. In campaign after campaign we have put boots on the ground, gone door-to-door to get out the vote, run phone banks and raised money to secure this vision.

Now this vision has come back to haunt us.

<snip>

On behalf of the millions of working men and women we represent and the families they support, we can no longer stand silent in the face of elements of the Affordable Care Act that will destroy the very health and wellbeing of our members along with millions of other hardworking Americans.

We believe that there are common-sense corrections that can be made within the existing statute that will allow our members to continue to keep their current health plans and benefits just as you and the President pledged. Unless changes are made, however, that promise is hollow.

We continue to stand behind real health care reform, but the law as it stands will hurt millions of Americans including the members of our respective unions.

We are looking to you to make sure these changes are made.

James P. Hoffa

General President

International Brotherhood of Teamsters

Joseph Hansen

International President

UFCW

D. Taylor

President

UNITE-HERE
WSJ

 
Mavric said:
Ball back in the union's court. Request denied.

Dear Leader Reid and Leader Pelosi:

When you and the President sought our support for the Affordable Care Act (ACA), you pledged that if we liked the health plans we have now, we could keep them. Sadly, that promise is under threat. Right now, unless you and the Obama Administration enact an equitable fix, the ACA will shatter not only our hard-earned health benefits, but destroy the foundation of the 40 hour work week that is the backbone of the American middle class.

Like millions of other Americans, our members are front-line workers in the American economy. We have been strong supporters of the notion that all Americans should have access to quality, affordable health care. We have also been strong supporters of you. In campaign after campaign we have put boots on the ground, gone door-to-door to get out the vote, run phone banks and raised money to secure this vision.

Now this vision has come back to haunt us.

<snip>

On behalf of the millions of working men and women we represent and the families they support, we can no longer stand silent in the face of elements of the Affordable Care Act that will destroy the very health and wellbeing of our members along with millions of other hardworking Americans.

We believe that there are common-sense corrections that can be made within the existing statute that will allow our members to continue to keep their current health plans and benefits just as you and the President pledged. Unless changes are made, however, that promise is hollow.

We continue to stand behind real health care reform, but the law as it stands will hurt millions of Americans including the members of our respective unions.

We are looking to you to make sure these changes are made.

James P. Hoffa

General President

International Brotherhood of Teamsters

Joseph Hansen

International President

UFCW

D. Taylor

President

UNITE-HERE
WSJ

But...but...but.....it's such a wonderful program......

 
carlfense said:
JJHusker1 said:
Carl, based on what I have offered as evidence in the last few pages of this thread, about my company's specific situation with our renewal, would you agree that implementation of the ACA on Jan 1, 2014 is directly causing my plans (ours, not anybody else's) renewal rates to be about 24% higher than they would have been without Obamacare?
I can't agree because we don't know what your pre-Jan 1 rate would have been without the ACA.

I'm not sure how I can state that any more clearly. It's obvious that it's not getting through.
Fail

 
carlfense said:
JJHusker1 said:
Carl, based on what I have offered as evidence in the last few pages of this thread, about my company's specific situation with our renewal, would you agree that implementation of the ACA on Jan 1, 2014 is directly causing my plans (ours, not anybody else's) renewal rates to be about 24% higher than they would have been without Obamacare?
I can't agree because we don't know what your pre-Jan 1 rate would have been without the ACA.

I'm not sure how I can state that any more clearly. It's obvious that it's not getting through.
Fail

Miserably.

 
default_sad.png


 
Back
Top