** What did we learn **

[3rd and long]

Mavric, how dare you present facts about what actually happened offensively in the second half.

17 points and 273 yards against a team who gives up 27 ppg and 360 ypg against the 66th best schedule (Sagarin).

Again, Beck's fault, two fumbles and a very key pass drop?

 

[tschu]

Tim Beck just can't win. For weeks the offense is too cute, he goes away from what works (only with the running game), and is trying to do too much. Now he's predictable and not creative enough. He's not perfect, nor is any OC in the nation, but give him some credit that he's able to dial up a drive when we really need it.

I thought Beck was fine today for the most part

I really thought that other than the 3rd and four play where TA tried to throw down the left sideline he called a really good game. I thought that was four down territory, but if he completes that pass because the defense is looking for a run, everyone hails it as a great call. And none of us really know where the ball was supposed to go on that play.

And the 2nd and 6 play where we threw it deep down the sideline. And the 3rd and 3 at like the 6 yard line where we just lined up in a power formation and tried to run Cross up the middle with our banged-up O-line. Everyone knew what was coming and everyone knew it wouldn't work. But I mean, overall, thought it was good. Played to our strengths for the most part.

 

[JTrain]

Mavric, how dare you present facts about what actually happened offensively in the second half.

17 points and 273 yards against a team who gives up 27 ppg and 360 ypg against the 66th best schedule (Sagarin).

Again, Beck's fault, two fumbles and a very key pass drop?

Point to where I said those three play were Beck's fault. Please. Link.

Because I'm sure all the other teams Michigan played didn't have three mistakes. (sarcasm)

 

[Mavric]

Point to where I said those three play were Beck's fault. Please. Link.

You didn't. But you call his play calling "atrocious" but the only play you'll mention is one where you don't even know if Armstrong ran it correctly. Then you complain about our lack of production but won't admit that it could have been significantly better if the players simply make a few more routine plays. You'll do just enough so you can attempt to make your point without actually having to defend it.

 

[JTrain]

won't admit that it could have been significantly better if the players simply make a few more routine plays.

See post #53. Of course if the players made less mistakes the output would have been better. Who would deny that?

 

[It'sNotAFakeID]

Mavric, how dare you present facts about what actually happened offensively in the second half.

17 points and 273 yards against a team who gives up 27 ppg and 360 ypg against the 66th best schedule (Sagarin).

Final stats, while the ultimate judgment of how successful a team was, don't really tell the whole story. Were there plays called that, if converted, would have produced more points and yards? You can't say no.

 

[JTrain]

Look at Beck's output in the important games: UCLA, Minnesota, Northwestern, Michigan. Compare to the other opponents of those teams. Those are the stats. Those are the facts. To run away from them you will have to do a lot of interpretation, and apparently 3-4 mistakes per game by the players does the explaining. So anytime players make three mistakes in a game, the coordinator is no longer responsible. That is what you're implying. He can only be judged if his players execute flawlessly.

 

[clyde40]

Tim Beck just can't win. For weeks the offense is too cute, he goes away from what works (only with the running game), and is trying to do too much. Now he's predictable and not creative enough. He's not perfect, nor is any OC in the nation, but give him some credit that he's able to dial up a drive when we really need it.

I thought Beck was fine today for the most part

I really thought that other than the 3rd and four play where TA tried to throw down the left sideline he called a really good game. I thought that was four down territory, but if he completes that pass because the defense is looking for a run, everyone hails it as a great call. And none of us really know where the ball was supposed to go on that play.

Agreed, it made me wonder if a short route was covered up. I thought he called a fine game, but there still have been a few negative comments about today.

 

[It'sNotAFakeID]

won't admit that it could have been significantly better if the players simply make a few more routine plays.

See post #53. Of course if the players made less mistakes the output would have been better. Who would deny that?

So then I don't get what you're getting at...you would say that players would gain more yards if they would've executed, but when they don't, it's on Beck?

Honestly, I don't think he had one call that was truly atrocious. There were some calls that I wouldn't have made, but, they weren't bad.

 

[It'sNotAFakeID]

Look at Beck's output in the important games: UCLA, Minnesota, Northwestern, Michigan. Compare to the other opponents of those teams. Those are the stats. Those are the facts. To run away from them you will have to do a lot of interpretation, and apparently 3-4 mistakes per game by the players does the explaining. So anytime players make three mistakes in a game, the coordinator is no longer responsible. That is what you're implying. He can only be judged if his players execute flawlessly.

Because every team the opponent faced has a banged up offensive line, their senior quarterback on the sideline, and a couple of WR not at 100%.

 

[JTrain]

Mavric, how dare you present facts about what actually happened offensively in the second half.

17 points and 273 yards against a team who gives up 27 ppg and 360 ypg against the 66th best schedule (Sagarin).

Final stats, while the ultimate judgment of how successful a team was, don't really tell the whole story. Were there plays called that, if converted, would have produced more points and yards? You can't say no.

I give a narrative/interpretation and am told I need to present facts.

I present facts and am told they aren't sufficient to "tell the whole story" (narrative).

Basically there are people who want to stick up for certain coaches no matter what. I like to call it as I see it. I will give credit when it's due and don't have any hatred for any of these coaches.

 

[JTrain]

Look at Beck's output in the important games: UCLA, Minnesota, Northwestern, Michigan. Compare to the other opponents of those teams. Those are the stats. Those are the facts. To run away from them you will have to do a lot of interpretation, and apparently 3-4 mistakes per game by the players does the explaining. So anytime players make three mistakes in a game, the coordinator is no longer responsible. That is what you're implying. He can only be judged if his players execute flawlessly.

Because every team the opponent faced has a banged up offensive line, their senior quarterback on the sideline, and a couple of WR not at 100%.

Every team has injuries. Our senior quarterback is not that great. And every team has WR or other positions "not at 100%". Doesn't make Beck a good playcaller.

Also, what about UCLA and Minnesota when all those things weren't even the case?

 

[Mavric]

I give a narrative/interpretation and am told I need to present facts.

I present facts and am told they aren't sufficient to "tell the whole story" (narrative).

What facts have you presented? The only specific play you've talked about is one where you don't even know if Armstrong threw to the primary receiver. And you've made some vague reference to throwing out half the playbook on 2nd and 10. Then, after complaining about not running when it's our strength, you complain that it's too predictable when we run Cross in short yardage situations.

It's classic "it's bad because it didn't work" logic (and I use "logic" very loosely).

 

[It'sNotAFakeID]

Look at Beck's output in the important games: UCLA, Minnesota, Northwestern, Michigan. Compare to the other opponents of those teams. Those are the stats. Those are the facts. To run away from them you will have to do a lot of interpretation, and apparently 3-4 mistakes per game by the players does the explaining. So anytime players make three mistakes in a game, the coordinator is no longer responsible. That is what you're implying. He can only be judged if his players execute flawlessly.

Because every team the opponent faced has a banged up offensive line, their senior quarterback on the sideline, and a couple of WR not at 100%.

Every team has injuries. Our senior quarterback is not that great. And every team has WR or other positions "not at 100%". Doesn't make Beck a good playcaller.

Also, what about UCLA and Minnesota when all those things weren't even the case?

You are missing the point. You are comparing Beck's output to how opponents have done, and that's not a fair comparison because every team isn't the same.

UCLA and Minnesota were bad days for Beck. But I don't think it's fair to say that today was a bad day for him.

 

[JTrain]

You'll do just enough so you can attempt to make your point without actually having to defend it.

Your defense was basically two fumbles and a drop? Am I remembering that correctly?