Bo Pelini & Ma'Lik Richmond

[NM11046]

Wow.

A few things that resonate with me.

• The kid didn't want or search for a second chance to play football. This coach pursued him, cajoled him. Pellini had the chance to recruit any number of players for the position and he spent time recruiting a felon.
• One (or more) of the reports talked about the girl not remembering the incident because she was unconcious, she found out when pictures were posted publically.

"Bad look" for Pelleni. Um yeah. Honestly I feel somewhat for the kid. He had opted out of playing FB in college, one has to think at least in part to avoid the sort of attention he is getting now. Why is it that he had/chose to attend two colleges prior to going to YSU?

Ask yourself, as a coach responsible for an entire team of men;

• What message does it send to my current and former players if I go to bat for this kid, that I don't know (perhaps there's more to consider if it was a long term relationship with the kid, but my opinion would not change)
• What will this do to my program?
• What will it do to future recruiting?
• How will parents of current players and potential players view this?
• What will the optics be?
• Is it worth it?

No matter what it does for the entire university. I'm sure YSU doesn't want to be in the news for something like this.

The kid made a bad decision and had to pay for it - maybe he already has. It doesn't excuse the horrible decision Bo made by pursuing him and now defending it.

 

[StPaulHusker]

....can this guy ever be treated by like a normal person? Is he still an unemployable, unworthy of anything rapist 25 years from now?

No he shouldn't be treated like a normal person anymore. But he's not unemployable either. And we aren't talking 25 years from now. We are talking right now. Our views of him 25 years from now can be different based on what he does in life between now and then.

 

[Crusader Husker]

The lesson here for people is that in the age of social media you need to be responsible. I remember when this went down. We let kids know that once you do this stuff it is out there forever. I am sure a 5 to 10 minute search you can find the video. Kid has served his time and has moved on, but some actions have consequences that last a long time, if not forever. And in this situation, it probably should. The girl, I am sure is still suffering the consequences all over again since it is in the news. Bo never should have put either kid into this situation. Indiana wouldn't have even let the kid into the school. Society is now in the era of making corrections, albeit in some areas an over correction, in the areas of sexual assault. Campuses are a place of safe spaces and micro aggression. It may be stupid in some circumstances, but there is no way that him playing football flies today. This is the same campus that went after Ron Brown during his brief stay there.

 

[Enhance]

The person who started the petition had this to say in an ESPN article.

"I'm not saying that Richmond should be expelled. He does deserve a second chance at his education," Davis told WKYC. "I do hope that he is successful in life, but he should not be representing YSU as a football player."

These are the kinds of situations I usually avoid offering an opinion - there are so many factors and unknowns, and it's far different than discussing who's going to start at left tackle and whether or not a linebacking corp will gel. But, for a variety of reasons, this is a very disappointing situation overall.

 

[NM11046]

So Crusader, do your points change at all if this wasn't publicly posted? I don't disagree with much of what you've said, but am curious about your comment around "be responsible - it's the age of social media". Is it worse that the act was made visible or is the act itself bad enough?

 

[Crusader Husker]

So Crusader, do your points change at all if this wasn't publicly posted? I don't disagree with much of what you've said, but am curious about your comment around "be responsible - it's the age of social media". Is it worse that the act was made visible or is the act itself bad enough?

My intent was that you can't leave youthful indiscretion in your youth when you post it. So everybody understands, this is far beyond youthful indiscretion, this is awful. My point is that if stuff wasn't posted, it doesn't become national news. The act is bad enough itself. The point is without posting it he makes it easier to live an anonymous life.

 

[NM11046]

Got it - thanks.

 

[In the Deed the Glory]

I'm not sure how I feel about this, but can understand both sides. I get the message you are sending of ignoring rape and sexual assault if you keep him, but also wouldn't you be sending a message of no second chances for those that have paid their debt to society if you remove him? He is a walk-on. He is not getting a scholarship. Is that a felony in Ohio? So many questions to ponder.

Yes. Rape is a felony.

I recommend you read about the case.

Wrong, he was tried and convicted as a juvenile. Only an adult can be classified as a felon. Maybe you should read about the Ohio Juvenile system in this .pdf

I should have typed was he tried as an adult, and it was meant to be rhetorical.

This is why this board pisses me off sometimes. I am not siding with the young man, or trying to defend Bo. I just question how, as a society, we can decide to shun a young man who did what he was asked to do by the State and yet still is going to be denied things like this. He screwed up, big time. It is a horrible thing he did.

This is why juvenile offenders become lifetime criminals, this is why the cycle of crime and poverty persists, this is why there is such a struggle with getting young people to believe there is something else out there and they don't have to do what everyone else around them does. If every kid that commits crimes like this is treated like a criminal for the rest of their lives, no matter what they do, they will then look to a life of crime because they won't have another choice.

Maybe football is too much, but acting like a student has been given a second chance because he is PAYING for college is just wrong. He is a consumer at that point.

 

[In the Deed the Glory]

What does "just a consumer" mean? I mean, I think he's lucky just to be on a college campus with that kind of history. That's uncomfortable enough and if I were closer to the situation I'd probably be livid at the schools for allowing this. Also, when and how can a debt of this nature be considered paid to society? I'm not sure I have the answers.

The football thing, fair or not, makes this all the thornier. Sure, it's just as a walk-on, but it's a door that's being opened. The school and the coach have made these efforts to bestow resources and opportunity at least in part because they want what he's got. It feels a bit to me like no matter how questionable your past (up to a threshold that is apparently beyond this), as long as you can play, people will be there to pick you up in life. That's not so much allowing for a second chance as it is going out of the way to offer one. And so, scrutiny on the ones extending their hand.

From society's perspective, I feel it's the survivors who should be rallied around and be given the extra resources and attention -- regardless of their athletic abilities. This feels like that all too familiar refrain where it's the reverse playing out in more ways than one.

The University has a service, the young man is paying for it. That is what I mean by consumer. How is that giving the man a second chance? You can't give a second chance and take his money also.

If he can be on campus, why can't he participate in any other activity? Obviously it does not violate any of his legal proceedings.

Bo probably shouldn't have opened this can of worms, that much I agree with. I just hope the kid finishes school and makes a positive impact on society, I wonder what his major is? Hopefully something where he can help victims, that is, if he is truly sorry for what he did.

 

[Crusader Husker]

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaaf/2017/08/07/youngstown-state-football-team-petition-remove-malik-richmond-convicted-rape/544313001/

"Richmond served close to a year in a juvenile detention center and was released in 2014 before returning to the Steubenville (Ohio) High School football team. As a Tier II sex offender, he will have to register every six months over the next two decades."

Not sure where the young man sits with the given info as far as a felon.

 

[StPaulHusker]

I'm not sure how I feel about this, but can understand both sides. I get the message you are sending of ignoring rape and sexual assault if you keep him, but also wouldn't you be sending a message of no second chances for those that have paid their debt to society if you remove him? He is a walk-on. He is not getting a scholarship. Is that a felony in Ohio? So many questions to ponder.

Yes. Rape is a felony.

I recommend you read about the case.

Wrong, he was tried and convicted as a juvenile. Only an adult can be classified as a felon. Maybe you should read about the Ohio Juvenile system in this .pdf

I should have typed was he tried as an adult, and it was meant to be rhetorical.

This is why this board pisses me off sometimes. I am not siding with the young man, or trying to defend Bo. I just question how, as a society, we can decide to shun a young man who did what he was asked to do by the State and yet still is going to be denied things like this. He screwed up, big time. It is a horrible thing he did.

This is why juvenile offenders become lifetime criminals, this is why the cycle of crime and poverty persists, this is why there is such a struggle with getting young people to believe there is something else out there and they don't have to do what everyone else around them does. If every kid that commits crimes like this is treated like a criminal for the rest of their lives, no matter what they do, they will then look to a life of crime because they won't have another choice.

Maybe football is too much, but acting like a student has been given a second chance because he is PAYING for college is just wrong. He is a consumer at that point.

Rape is certainly a felony. How Ohio chooses to classify it for a juvenile, doesn't change that.

And I don't see anyone saying the kid can't attend college to move on. They (myself included) don't think he should be able to obtain any additional privileges that comes with being a part of a football team. Even though he is a walk on, he will have some collegiate advantages that the average student wouldn't get. And that shouldn't be the case.

 

[In the Deed the Glory]

I'm not sure how I feel about this, but can understand both sides. I get the message you are sending of ignoring rape and sexual assault if you keep him, but also wouldn't you be sending a message of no second chances for those that have paid their debt to society if you remove him? He is a walk-on. He is not getting a scholarship. Is that a felony in Ohio? So many questions to ponder.

Yes. Rape is a felony.

I recommend you read about the case.

Wrong, he was tried and convicted as a juvenile. Only an adult can be classified as a felon. Maybe you should read about the Ohio Juvenile system in this .pdf

I should have typed was he tried as an adult, and it was meant to be rhetorical.

This is why this board pisses me off sometimes. I am not siding with the young man, or trying to defend Bo. I just question how, as a society, we can decide to shun a young man who did what he was asked to do by the State and yet still is going to be denied things like this. He screwed up, big time. It is a horrible thing he did.

This is why juvenile offenders become lifetime criminals, this is why the cycle of crime and poverty persists, this is why there is such a struggle with getting young people to believe there is something else out there and they don't have to do what everyone else around them does. If every kid that commits crimes like this is treated like a criminal for the rest of their lives, no matter what they do, they will then look to a life of crime because they won't have another choice.

Maybe football is too much, but acting like a student has been given a second chance because he is PAYING for college is just wrong. He is a consumer at that point.

Rape is certainly a felony. How Ohio chooses to classify it for a juvenile, doesn't change that.

And I don't see anyone saying the kid can't attend college to move on. They (myself included) don't think he should be able to obtain any additional privileges that comes with being a part of a football team. Even though he is a walk on, he will have some collegiate advantages that the average student wouldn't get. And that shouldn't be the case.

It literally does.

To your second point, I agree. I don't know about how that should look. I guess the blame should fall on Bo here, as he wasn't really trying to play and was trying to live his life. Maybe the kid hasn't learned and all of this is for naught. I don't know. I just don't want a bunch of other people that also don't know much about the kid or the situation making blanket statements about what should happen in all cases, because all cases aren't the same and all rehabilitations are not the same.

 

[zoogs]

The guy is not some victim we are taking things away from. He is someone who victimized someone else -- and yet, because of his latent talent for a sports game, society must witness all the efforts made to rebuild people such as him.

 

[StPaulHusker]

I'm not sure how I feel about this, but can understand both sides. I get the message you are sending of ignoring rape and sexual assault if you keep him, but also wouldn't you be sending a message of no second chances for those that have paid their debt to society if you remove him? He is a walk-on. He is not getting a scholarship. Is that a felony in Ohio? So many questions to ponder.

Yes. Rape is a felony.

I recommend you read about the case.

Wrong, he was tried and convicted as a juvenile. Only an adult can be classified as a felon. Maybe you should read about the Ohio Juvenile system in this .pdf

I should have typed was he tried as an adult, and it was meant to be rhetorical.

This is why this board pisses me off sometimes. I am not siding with the young man, or trying to defend Bo. I just question how, as a society, we can decide to shun a young man who did what he was asked to do by the State and yet still is going to be denied things like this. He screwed up, big time. It is a horrible thing he did.

This is why juvenile offenders become lifetime criminals, this is why the cycle of crime and poverty persists, this is why there is such a struggle with getting young people to believe there is something else out there and they don't have to do what everyone else around them does. If every kid that commits crimes like this is treated like a criminal for the rest of their lives, no matter what they do, they will then look to a life of crime because they won't have another choice.

Maybe football is too much, but acting like a student has been given a second chance because he is PAYING for college is just wrong. He is a consumer at that point.

Rape is certainly a felony. How Ohio chooses to classify it for a juvenile, doesn't change that.

And I don't see anyone saying the kid can't attend college to move on. They (myself included) don't think he should be able to obtain any additional privileges that comes with being a part of a football team. Even though he is a walk on, he will have some collegiate advantages that the average student wouldn't get. And that shouldn't be the case.

It literally does.

To your second point, I agree. I don't know about how that should look. I guess the blame should fall on Bo here, as he wasn't really trying to play and was trying to live his life. Maybe the kid hasn't learned and all of this is for naught. I don't know. I just don't want a bunch of other people that also don't know much about the kid or the situation making blanket statements about what should happen in all cases, because all cases aren't the same and all rehabilitations are not the same.

It literally doesn't. It just says a kid isn't tried as a felon for a felonious crime.

 

[Enhance]

I imagine the proper way to phrase this is rape is a felony but that does not necessarily make the guilty party a convicted felon. It's less about classification and more about conviction. For example, you can be arrested and charged with felony sexual assault, but ultimately later convicted of misdemeanor sexual assault, thus not being a felon.