Secondary defending against Martinez

Marf

Marf

Banned
No wonder our secondary blows.

Prince, Gomes, Hagg? They had to learn against the man, the myth, the legend; JOE GANZ. That kid would drop dimes all over the field blindfolded.

And our current secondary? Hell, if they're within 7 yards of their receiver Taylor will probably throw it right to them in practice.

Is our 1 defense against our 1 offense promoting soft coverage?

I'm leaning that way...

 
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The secondary doesn't get better by practicing against a great QB, they get better by practicing against great receivers. It doesn't matter where the ball gets thrown, what matters is the one-on-one battle with the guy you're covering.

 
First off, the number one offense often doesn't even practice against the number one defense. That's what the scout team is for.

Second, there is a major difference in the coaching these two sets of players received. I believe that's beginning to show this year.

 
Oh man, I love Ganz to death but you are waaay overstating his throwing abilities, in my opinion.

Not to mention he was only here in '08.

The problem is we lost those guys and we have nobody to fill their shoes. A lot of promising young talent has so far not lived up to expectations and have really fallen quite far from them. That, and Lance Thorell getting so much PT, which is a big what the heck?

 
The best way for a DB to defend against Martinez is to let the receiver run past you. Only after you are three step behind are you in perfect position for a pick. It takes a lot of practice to get beat by just the right amount of steps.

 
zoogies said:
Oh man, I love Ganz to death but you are waaay overstating his throwing abilities, in my opinion.

Not to mention he was only here in '08.

The problem is we lost those guys and we have nobody to fill their shoes. A lot of promising young talent has so far not lived up to expectations and have really fallen quite far from them. That, and Lance Thorell getting so much PT, which is a big what the heck?
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Compared to Taylor? He's Joe Montanya. Or whoever that was.

I thought the secondary was exceptional in 2009, the year after having the Chase Daniel/Sam Bradford/Graham Harrell shows make it rain on them. Obviously Ganz isn't in the same league as that crowd, I was kidding, but he threw a damn good deep ball, and it seemed every time someone threw one up the year after he left it was an interception. Some of that had to have been learned in practice.

2010 the secondary was freakish. One of the best I have ever seen, carried over it seems.

So the #1 O doesn't get ANY time against the #1 D? More proof to our extreme blow-age. That seems silly to me. But oh well.

 
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Marf said:
zoogies said:
Oh man, I love Ganz to death but you are waaay overstating his throwing abilities, in my opinion.

Not to mention he was only here in '08.

The problem is we lost those guys and we have nobody to fill their shoes. A lot of promising young talent has so far not lived up to expectations and have really fallen quite far from them. That, and Lance Thorell getting so much PT, which is a big what the heck?
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Compared to Taylor? He's Joe Montanya. Or whoever that was.

I thought the secondary was exceptional in 2009, the year after having the Chase Daniel/Sam Bradford/Graham Harrell shows make it rain on them. Obviously Ganz isn't in the same league as that crowd, I was kidding, but he threw a damn good deep ball, and it seemed every time someone threw one up the year after he left it was an interception. Some of that had to have been learned in practice.

2010 the secondary was freakish. One of the best I have ever seen, carried over it seems.

So the #1 O doesn't get ANY time against the #1 D? More proof to our extreme blow-age. That seems silly to me. But oh well.
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That's just the way practices are traditionally run. You let your scrubs, your scout teams, go up against your #1 O and D to help them "learn things." You don't practice 1s vs. 1s much because then coaches would have to coach both sides of the ball at once. It's much easier to coach one side of the ball at once. Also, when you run 1s v 1s, you risk injuring a starter much more.

We could probably use some more of it though, to help this team grow some balls.

 
Oh yeah, our secondaries recently have been so good. Actually, in '09 and '10, we had to shuffle personnel to get there. I'm not sure Prince was even starting at the start of '09. We also had some safety shuffling before we got it down four or five games into the season. Rickey Thenarse started several games for us last year if I recall.

But really, I think it has a lot to do with Hagg and Gomes. They were just perfect in this defense and Hagg especially allowed us to do what we did, and do it so well. Prince and Fonzie locked down both corner spots. Matty and Larry developed into very solid safeties in '09, and then last year we ended up with some pretty good play there as well. But everything went back to having both corner spots locked down, and those two absolute rocks in the secondary in Gomes and Hagg.

Fonzie isn't totally healthy yet, so through five games or whatever it's been this year, we have had NONE of those four critical elements to success. And that's a big downer.

I must be mis-remembering, I did not think Ganz even had a deep ball. He was pretty sharp in the offense, though. Also I don't think the #1 O usually gets work on the #1 D during the season. They go against scout teams to prepare for the teams they will face.

 
Corey Raymond should be taking some heat. Our DBs used to have their hands on receivers at the line. Now they're trying to dance with them. How many f***ing times is Andrew Green going to give up inside position on 3rd and medium? Quick slant every f'ing time and it's converted like child's play

 
Our defense practices against the scout team who would likely be quarterbacked by Ron Kellogg, so I have a hard time believing this

 
Jason Sitoke said:
Corey Raymond should be taking some heat. Our DBs used to have their hands on receivers at the line. Now they're trying to dance with them. How many f***ing times is Andrew Green going to give up inside position on 3rd and medium? Quick slant every f'ing time and it's converted like child's play
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Andrew Green can't play bump right now. He did one of the earlier games and got just toyed with.

It's because the papers and players talked about Raymond and his technique change, but really too much is made out of that. This is Bo's secondary and it's all still happening under his direction. Raymond isn't doing anything Bo doesn't want him to do.

Raymond gets an unfair amount of heat relative to other coaches. And he has less to work with, at least so far.

 
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