krill said:
You make some good points fro, but Gill did vastly improve Buffalo...look at their record after they moved up from I-AA, they won 12 games in 7 years.
I just think this a really bad precedent being set here for 2 years. Unless there are other issues every coach going into a troubled program deserves at least 4 years to recruit a team and see how they do, and Gill was recruiting fairly well all things considered. Take the 4 close games they had with Tech, ISU, Baylor and Mizzou and pretend for a moment they had found a way to win 2 of them. How much different is that team? Not that much...heck they even rolled with OU for a half.
let me first say this, I am not saying Gill can not coach. I am just saying he was over his head in the big12. He did a nice job at Buffalo and I think he can and will again do a nice job at a mid major type school. I just dont think he was ready for the 'big time'.
Also, I am not for cutting coaches after two years. However there are times when frankly I dont think there is a bit of difference between doing it after year 2 or 3. When there is no growth in a program you have to cut bait. You can choose to make a move now or wait another year and fall another year behind. I frankly dont think it would have mattered if ku kept him for 5 more years. I would have been five more years of 2-5 wins. Maybe that still happens, but i think there is no doubt it would have under Gill. ku was not losing closely and this was not the wildcat team Snyder took over. That was the worst program in D-1 by a long shot. So bad that even with everything he has done after all these years they are still 100+ games under .500 all time. (474-612-41) KU is no power house, but you can be compititive and fight to make bowls. But as you implied in those "close" games, if ku had won, he would not have been fired. However, looking closer at those games will only add fuel to the fire than led to him being fired.
#1 he lost by 28 pts on avg in conference this year even with nearly 1/2 of their games be closer.
#2 Mizzou 10-24. Its ku's superbowl. With that said, Franklin threw three straight balls to ku defenders on some REALLY bad throws. Those ints lead to ku's 10 pts. (one returned for a TD, the other lead to a drive that lost yrds but they made a FG). Mu really played pretty poorly, and extreamly poor for an entire half. With that said ku still blew a 7 pt halftime lead and lost by 14 pts. Any decent team would have run MU off the field in the first half. But i was never worried. Why you might ask...well because ku ended with 130 yrds of offence and nearly 50 of that came on their last drive. They could do nothing. NO matter how bad Mizzou played they were going to win.
#3 Texas Tech 34-45. Ku roared out to a 20 pt lead. only to have TT score 45 of the next 52 pts in the game. KU added a late TD with a couple of mins left to get it within 2 scores at the final. BTW TT is 2-7 in conference
#4 Baylor. 30-31. Baylor is a good team, and possible has the best player in all of college football. KU was primed to shock the world with a big upset. Ku lead 24-3 in the 4th qtr and Baylors only pts had come on a kick at the end of the first half. It was then that with just under 13 mins left in the game that Baylor scored 3 tds to get to OT. Those TD drives were: 5 plays, 89 yrds 1:07, 6 plays, 98 yrds, 1:53 & 3 plays, 80 yrds, 0:35. Ku played their best game of the year and let Baylor go for 267 yards in 14 plays in just 3:35 mins. BTW this remains Baylors only road win for the year.
#5 ISU 10-13. Just an overall ugly game. But they were able to keep it close. Nothing really negative about this besides its a loss. Jack Trice can be a tricky place to play and ISU was an up and down team.
He didnt really help himself. Even when teams over looked them (Baylor), when teams played really poorly (Mizzou), when they jumped out to huge leads against bad teams (Texas Tech) & when they found themselves in an somewhat even match-up (ISU) they lost every time. Add that to getting completly wiped off the field by 40+ pts four times this year and showing little to no progression and even could be argued regression from last year and you get fired. If they had kept it close. If they had been compititive in games i think he is still there. But he wasnt, so he isnt.
irafreak said:
Agreed. The jump was too much too soon. I think he is a fine coach and can succeed right now in the MAC, WAC, or Mountain West. Conference USA is a little stronger overall. I have that title game on dvd and you're right. it was back to back fumble returns for a TD but they still won by several scores. I just feel like the chemistry is wrong. Those kids played hard at Buffalo for him....
If i remember correctly the Bulls had like 4 scoring drives that were under 30 yrds. They had those returns and were giving the ball right outside or in scoring postion another 4 times. You would have to check because its been years, but its just one of the games that you see and dont really forget. (I guess I could always search a boxscore also. LOL) Anyway, IMHO GIll came in a tried to change alot of things; including taking players phones away a few days before games and keeping them until after games. Not allowing contact with girlfriends, getting rid of all individualilty for the players and playing ultra nice (cuss jars). Alot of these players were with a gruff, mean old bastard of a coach and now they had a church choir leader. They had someone who was demanding but treated them like men, now they have someone telling them what to do like they are young children and holding their hands. I am sure that effected the older players. As for the younger players, he played alot of them and out of position at that. Some obviously liked Turner, some chose KU cause they had no other options. It seemed like 1/2 the team really went all out for him and 1/2 went through the motions. But agian, that all comes down on the coach.
