2017 NBA Finals - Cavs vs. Warriors

[Enhance]

I'm not at all a LeBron fan but you have to respect what he's accomplished. Some detractors will point to the 3-5 record but getting there seven straight years - even in a sub-par East - is pretty impressive. A couple of those time he really didn't have much help - his first with the Cavs and at least one with a hobbled Wade. Of course, he's also one extremely clutch Ray Allen three from being 2-6 so I think it's fair to make him down just a bit for that.

That being said, the Cavs had the highest payroll in the league this year. Now, paying people the most obviously doesn't mean you necessarily have the best players but it's nothing like the first Cavs team he took to the finals.

The Dodgers can attest to that.

 

[wiuhusker]

With all do respect B.B. I don't think LeBron can do anything to 'solidify' his place atop the GOAT list. MJ for some will always be the GOAT and for the time being, rightfully so. I love Lebron and he is probably the most talented player ever. But MJ will always have accomplished more in the minds of many.

This is true in the eyes of many. But if you take a closer look at the series, while Lebron looked very very good on the offensive end (possibly the best we've ever seen him), there were multiple defensive lapses that cost his team. 2 Iggy straight line dunks in game 5 where he had plenty of time to rotate over and try to prevent a bucket (one of which changed the whole complexion of the game), constantly not sprinting back in transition, and other things.

Lebron is by far the best player we have in the league today and this is coming from a Lebron "hater". But if people want to proclaim him the GOAT then I feel like that person should compete for 48 minutes on both ends of the floor regardless of situation, especially in a win or go home game in the playoffs. Lebron has too many passive segments in games for me to consider him the GOAT.

 

[Landlord]

Pretty much agree with that assessment. A pretty high percentage of the plays where GS found a wide open man in the paint or cutting to the rim for an easy dunk were Lebron's guy.

 

[Nebfanatic]

^I wouldn't say a high percentage, but Lebron had defensive lapses no doubt. I didn't call him the GOAT, B.B. did. I was saying no matter what Lebron does he will never be the defacto GOAT at this point. He could rattle off 4 straight championships and Finals MVPs putting up triple doubles each time and still the title of GOAT would go to Jordan for most. Right now, in my mind, Lebron is either the second or third best player of all time. It would take something like I just mentioned for Lebron to replace Jordan in my opinion.

Now as for the lapses, they are inexcusable in a sense. Lebron played some good D in this series at times but he looked completely helpless at others. It was a bad look. He used to be one of the best defenders in the world too, that's what boggles my mind. I understand father time has gotten to him a little but the iggy dunks in particular were just inexcusable. If he would have contested and got dunked on that is one thing, but it's like he didn't really even try.

That being said, I thought Lebron out hustled his team on transition defense. He didn't always get there but I got the sense he was trying unlike his partner Kevin Love among others. I didn't see him loafing in transition that much if at all really, but I may have just missed that.

 

[wiuhusker]

^I wouldn't say a high percentage, but Lebron had defensive lapses no doubt. I didn't call him the GOAT, B.B. did. I was saying no matter what Lebron does he will never be the defacto GOAT at this point. He could rattle off 4 straight championships and Finals MVPs putting up triple doubles each time and still the title of GOAT would go to Jordan for most. Right now, in my mind, Lebron is either the second or third best player of all time. It would take something like I just mentioned for Lebron to replace Jordan in my opinion.

Now as for the lapses, they are inexcusable in a sense. Lebron played some good D in this series at times but he looked completely helpless at others. It was a bad look. He used to be one of the best defenders in the world too, that's what boggles my mind. I understand father time has gotten to him a little but the iggy dunks in particular were just inexcusable. If he would have contested and got dunked on that is one thing, but it's like he didn't really even try.

That being said, I thought Lebron out hustled his team on transition defense. He didn't always get there but I got the sense he was trying unlike his partner Kevin Love among others. I didn't see him loafing in transition that much if at all really, but I may have just missed that.

Wasn't trying to make it sound like you were stating that. Probably should've picked BB's post and not yours.

I completely agree with the bolded part above. I guess the best description for some of his defensive lapses would be him being disinterested? Not sure how else to explain it. One other thing that drove me nuts with him in this series is how stagnant he was when Kyrie had the ball in his hands. All he had to do was look at the team across from him to realize a pin down screen or a back cut could get him or his team an easy layup. Instead he stood and watched like a fan.

 

[Nebfanatic]

^I wouldn't say a high percentage, but Lebron had defensive lapses no doubt. I didn't call him the GOAT, B.B. did. I was saying no matter what Lebron does he will never be the defacto GOAT at this point. He could rattle off 4 straight championships and Finals MVPs putting up triple doubles each time and still the title of GOAT would go to Jordan for most. Right now, in my mind, Lebron is either the second or third best player of all time. It would take something like I just mentioned for Lebron to replace Jordan in my opinion.

Now as for the lapses, they are inexcusable in a sense. Lebron played some good D in this series at times but he looked completely helpless at others. It was a bad look. He used to be one of the best defenders in the world too, that's what boggles my mind. I understand father time has gotten to him a little but the iggy dunks in particular were just inexcusable. If he would have contested and got dunked on that is one thing, but it's like he didn't really even try.

That being said, I thought Lebron out hustled his team on transition defense. He didn't always get there but I got the sense he was trying unlike his partner Kevin Love among others. I didn't see him loafing in transition that much if at all really, but I may have just missed that.

Wasn't trying to make it sound like you were stating that. Probably should've picked BB's post and not yours.
I completely agree with the bolded part above. I guess the best description for some of his defensive lapses would be him being disinterested? Not sure how else to explain it. One other thing that drove me nuts with him in this series is how stagnant he was when Kyrie had the ball in his hands. All he had to do was look at the team across from him to realize a pin down screen or a back cut could get him or his team an easy layup. Instead he stood and watched like a fan.

you know, it does frustrate me as well watching Lebron stand there on the wing as Kyrie dances his way into a bad play/shot especially. I wonder if part of this is on the system they run. Lebron surely in some situations near the end of the game mostly needs to just demand the basketball in some way. But I do wonder if some of that stagnant play on O is him or the system because I see the other cavs players do the same thing when he or Kyrie has the ball in their hands.
You bringing that up really makes me curious how Lebron would fair in say, San Antonio. I think if Lebron could adapt to not being so ball dominant, he would be even more of an efficient force in a system like that for the reasons you just mentioned. Back cuts, pin downs, all of that would be a must do in that offense, while I feel like in the Cavs scheme that may be a bit of freelance play as weird as that sounds.

 

[Landlord]

^I was saying no matter what Lebron does he will never be the defacto GOAT at this point. He could rattle off 4 straight championships and Finals MVPs putting up triple doubles each time and still the title of GOAT would go to Jordan for most. Right now, in my mind, Lebron is either the second or third best player of all time. It would take something like I just mentioned for Lebron to replace Jordan in my opinion.

Well even ignoring that you say there's nothing lebron could do, and then you lay out something he could do, in the same sentence, this isn't true. A good amount of people already think he's better - people that other people listen to. Cowherd is a big one. if he plays another half decade of basketball mostly this good and wins a few rings, there will be plenty of people that consider him the GOAT

 

[wiuhusker]

^I wouldn't say a high percentage, but Lebron had defensive lapses no doubt. I didn't call him the GOAT, B.B. did. I was saying no matter what Lebron does he will never be the defacto GOAT at this point. He could rattle off 4 straight championships and Finals MVPs putting up triple doubles each time and still the title of GOAT would go to Jordan for most. Right now, in my mind, Lebron is either the second or third best player of all time. It would take something like I just mentioned for Lebron to replace Jordan in my opinion.

Now as for the lapses, they are inexcusable in a sense. Lebron played some good D in this series at times but he looked completely helpless at others. It was a bad look. He used to be one of the best defenders in the world too, that's what boggles my mind. I understand father time has gotten to him a little but the iggy dunks in particular were just inexcusable. If he would have contested and got dunked on that is one thing, but it's like he didn't really even try.

That being said, I thought Lebron out hustled his team on transition defense. He didn't always get there but I got the sense he was trying unlike his partner Kevin Love among others. I didn't see him loafing in transition that much if at all really, but I may have just missed that.

Wasn't trying to make it sound like you were stating that. Probably should've picked BB's post and not yours.
I completely agree with the bolded part above. I guess the best description for some of his defensive lapses would be him being disinterested? Not sure how else to explain it. One other thing that drove me nuts with him in this series is how stagnant he was when Kyrie had the ball in his hands. All he had to do was look at the team across from him to realize a pin down screen or a back cut could get him or his team an easy layup. Instead he stood and watched like a fan.

you know, it does frustrate me as well watching Lebron stand there on the wing as Kyrie dances his way into a bad play/shot especially. I wonder if part of this is on the system they run. Lebron surely in some situations near the end of the game mostly needs to just demand the basketball in some way. But I do wonder if some of that stagnant play on O is him or the system because I see the other cavs players do the same thing when he or Kyrie has the ball in their hands.
You bringing that up really makes me curious how Lebron would fair in say, San Antonio. I think if Lebron could adapt to not being so ball dominant, he would be even more of an efficient force in a system like that for the reasons you just mentioned. Back cuts, pin downs, all of that would be a must do in that offense, while I feel like in the Cavs scheme that may be a bit of freelance play as weird as that sounds.

Had a discussion with a guy today at work about what would've happened in this series had you switched Lebron and KD. Not to discredit what KD in this series because it was absolutely fantastic to watch, but if lebron had the likes of Steph, Klay and draymond along with him it would be absolutely terrifying. Lebron going 1v1 while the other 3 set screen after screen and slips and curls and back cuts with lebrons passing ability would be the most unfair thing ever.

I do think all the standing the Cavs do is a product of the system. As good as a passer as James is, it's much easier for shooters to catch and shoot as opposed to constantly moving and getting forced into an awkward catch and shoot situation possibly. I think as long as Lebron has the ball in his hands he would fit into almost any system. It's when the ball is not in his hands that he struggles to grasp different intricacies of the game.

 

[Nebfanatic]

^I was saying no matter what Lebron does he will never be the defacto GOAT at this point. He could rattle off 4 straight championships and Finals MVPs putting up triple doubles each time and still the title of GOAT would go to Jordan for most. Right now, in my mind, Lebron is either the second or third best player of all time. It would take something like I just mentioned for Lebron to replace Jordan in my opinion.

Well even ignoring that you say there's nothing lebron could do, and then you lay out something he could do, in the same sentence, this isn't true. A good amount of people already think he's better - people that other people listen to. Cowherd is a big one. if he plays another half decade of basketball mostly this good and wins a few rings, there will be plenty of people that consider him the GOAT

yea that was kinda my point, Lebron could do that and some people still would take Jordan. I wouldn't but I can already hear the droves of Jordan stans talking about 5 finals losses, going to Miami, this, that and the other. There will be a large section of basketball fans that will never accept Lebron for what he is. The amount of haters Lebron has is honestly unmatched even by Tom Brady.
I mean hell, we had to have the Kobe-Lebron discussion in this very thread, and you and I both know it's not much of a discussion no dis to Kobe.

 

[Nebfanatic]

^I wouldn't say a high percentage, but Lebron had defensive lapses no doubt. I didn't call him the GOAT, B.B. did. I was saying no matter what Lebron does he will never be the defacto GOAT at this point. He could rattle off 4 straight championships and Finals MVPs putting up triple doubles each time and still the title of GOAT would go to Jordan for most. Right now, in my mind, Lebron is either the second or third best player of all time. It would take something like I just mentioned for Lebron to replace Jordan in my opinion.

Now as for the lapses, they are inexcusable in a sense. Lebron played some good D in this series at times but he looked completely helpless at others. It was a bad look. He used to be one of the best defenders in the world too, that's what boggles my mind. I understand father time has gotten to him a little but the iggy dunks in particular were just inexcusable. If he would have contested and got dunked on that is one thing, but it's like he didn't really even try.

That being said, I thought Lebron out hustled his team on transition defense. He didn't always get there but I got the sense he was trying unlike his partner Kevin Love among others. I didn't see him loafing in transition that much if at all really, but I may have just missed that.

Wasn't trying to make it sound like you were stating that. Probably should've picked BB's post and not yours.
I completely agree with the bolded part above. I guess the best description for some of his defensive lapses would be him being disinterested? Not sure how else to explain it. One other thing that drove me nuts with him in this series is how stagnant he was when Kyrie had the ball in his hands. All he had to do was look at the team across from him to realize a pin down screen or a back cut could get him or his team an easy layup. Instead he stood and watched like a fan.

you know, it does frustrate me as well watching Lebron stand there on the wing as Kyrie dances his way into a bad play/shot especially. I wonder if part of this is on the system they run. Lebron surely in some situations near the end of the game mostly needs to just demand the basketball in some way. But I do wonder if some of that stagnant play on O is him or the system because I see the other cavs players do the same thing when he or Kyrie has the ball in their hands.
You bringing that up really makes me curious how Lebron would fair in say, San Antonio. I think if Lebron could adapt to not being so ball dominant, he would be even more of an efficient force in a system like that for the reasons you just mentioned. Back cuts, pin downs, all of that would be a must do in that offense, while I feel like in the Cavs scheme that may be a bit of freelance play as weird as that sounds.

Had a discussion with a guy today at work about what would've happened in this series had you switched Lebron and KD. Not to discredit what KD in this series because it was absolutely fantastic to watch, but if lebron had the likes of Steph, Klay and draymond along with him it would be absolutely terrifying. Lebron going 1v1 while the other 3 set screen after screen and slips and curls and back cuts with lebrons passing ability would be the most unfair thing ever.
I do think all the standing the Cavs do is a product of the system. As good as a passer as James is, it's much easier for shooters to catch and shoot as opposed to constantly moving and getting forced into an awkward catch and shoot situation possibly. I think as long as Lebron has the ball in his hands he would fit into almost any system. It's when the ball is not in his hands that he struggles to grasp different intricacies of the game.

100%. Not sure what to add to that.
Another discussion that intrigues me, who drives the GSW more, KD or Steph? After game 2 I said to a friend Steph was my finals MVP. He said that would never happen only because KD matched up with Bron and it seems the guy who matches up with Bron wins the finals MVP if their team wins.

Now KD definitely deserved the finals MVP when all was said and done, but I am of the opinion Steph makes it all work more so than KD as great as KD is.

 

[wiuhusker]

^I wouldn't say a high percentage, but Lebron had defensive lapses no doubt. I didn't call him the GOAT, B.B. did. I was saying no matter what Lebron does he will never be the defacto GOAT at this point. He could rattle off 4 straight championships and Finals MVPs putting up triple doubles each time and still the title of GOAT would go to Jordan for most. Right now, in my mind, Lebron is either the second or third best player of all time. It would take something like I just mentioned for Lebron to replace Jordan in my opinion.

Now as for the lapses, they are inexcusable in a sense. Lebron played some good D in this series at times but he looked completely helpless at others. It was a bad look. He used to be one of the best defenders in the world too, that's what boggles my mind. I understand father time has gotten to him a little but the iggy dunks in particular were just inexcusable. If he would have contested and got dunked on that is one thing, but it's like he didn't really even try.

That being said, I thought Lebron out hustled his team on transition defense. He didn't always get there but I got the sense he was trying unlike his partner Kevin Love among others. I didn't see him loafing in transition that much if at all really, but I may have just missed that.

Wasn't trying to make it sound like you were stating that. Probably should've picked BB's post and not yours.
I completely agree with the bolded part above. I guess the best description for some of his defensive lapses would be him being disinterested? Not sure how else to explain it. One other thing that drove me nuts with him in this series is how stagnant he was when Kyrie had the ball in his hands. All he had to do was look at the team across from him to realize a pin down screen or a back cut could get him or his team an easy layup. Instead he stood and watched like a fan.

you know, it does frustrate me as well watching Lebron stand there on the wing as Kyrie dances his way into a bad play/shot especially. I wonder if part of this is on the system they run. Lebron surely in some situations near the end of the game mostly needs to just demand the basketball in some way. But I do wonder if some of that stagnant play on O is him or the system because I see the other cavs players do the same thing when he or Kyrie has the ball in their hands.
You bringing that up really makes me curious how Lebron would fair in say, San Antonio. I think if Lebron could adapt to not being so ball dominant, he would be even more of an efficient force in a system like that for the reasons you just mentioned. Back cuts, pin downs, all of that would be a must do in that offense, while I feel like in the Cavs scheme that may be a bit of freelance play as weird as that sounds.

Had a discussion with a guy today at work about what would've happened in this series had you switched Lebron and KD. Not to discredit what KD in this series because it was absolutely fantastic to watch, but if lebron had the likes of Steph, Klay and draymond along with him it would be absolutely terrifying. Lebron going 1v1 while the other 3 set screen after screen and slips and curls and back cuts with lebrons passing ability would be the most unfair thing ever.
I do think all the standing the Cavs do is a product of the system. As good as a passer as James is, it's much easier for shooters to catch and shoot as opposed to constantly moving and getting forced into an awkward catch and shoot situation possibly. I think as long as Lebron has the ball in his hands he would fit into almost any system. It's when the ball is not in his hands that he struggles to grasp different intricacies of the game.

100%. Not sure what to add to that.
Another discussion that intrigues me, who drives the GSW more, KD or Steph? After game 2 I said to a friend Steph was my finals MVP. He said that would never happen only because KD matched up with Bron and it seems the guy who matches up with Bron wins the finals MVP if their team wins.

Now KD definitely deserved the finals MVP when all was said and done, but I am of the opinion Steph makes it all work more so than KD as great as KD is.

If give the choice between those 2 I'm taking Steph for the pure fact that he's the primary ball handler. But I will argue with anyone that the most important player to what Golden State does is Draymond. Like him or hate him he's the guy that makes the engine run for GSW. All those screens that Cleveland blitzed and doubled Steph on? The ball wound up in the hands of Draymond who routinely makes good decisions when put in those situations. He also makes sure that no one on the other teams messes with one of his guys.

 

[Landlord]

yea that was kinda my point, Lebron could do that and some people still would take Jordan. I wouldn't but I can already hear the droves of Jordan stans talking about 5 finals losses, going to Miami, this, that and the other. There will be a large section of basketball fans that will never accept Lebron for what he is. The amount of haters Lebron has is honestly unmatched even by Tom Brady.

I mean hell, we had to have the Kobe-Lebron discussion in this very thread, and you and I both know it's not much of a discussion no dis to Kobe.

....what?

Poor Lebron James! Not unanimously being considered the absolute best in a subjective argument and being so unbelievably popular that not everyone loves him. Must be tough for that guy.

 

[Nebfanatic]

^I wouldn't say a high percentage, but Lebron had defensive lapses no doubt. I didn't call him the GOAT, B.B. did. I was saying no matter what Lebron does he will never be the defacto GOAT at this point. He could rattle off 4 straight championships and Finals MVPs putting up triple doubles each time and still the title of GOAT would go to Jordan for most. Right now, in my mind, Lebron is either the second or third best player of all time. It would take something like I just mentioned for Lebron to replace Jordan in my opinion.

Now as for the lapses, they are inexcusable in a sense. Lebron played some good D in this series at times but he looked completely helpless at others. It was a bad look. He used to be one of the best defenders in the world too, that's what boggles my mind. I understand father time has gotten to him a little but the iggy dunks in particular were just inexcusable. If he would have contested and got dunked on that is one thing, but it's like he didn't really even try.

That being said, I thought Lebron out hustled his team on transition defense. He didn't always get there but I got the sense he was trying unlike his partner Kevin Love among others. I didn't see him loafing in transition that much if at all really, but I may have just missed that.

Wasn't trying to make it sound like you were stating that. Probably should've picked BB's post and not yours.
I completely agree with the bolded part above. I guess the best description for some of his defensive lapses would be him being disinterested? Not sure how else to explain it. One other thing that drove me nuts with him in this series is how stagnant he was when Kyrie had the ball in his hands. All he had to do was look at the team across from him to realize a pin down screen or a back cut could get him or his team an easy layup. Instead he stood and watched like a fan.

you know, it does frustrate me as well watching Lebron stand there on the wing as Kyrie dances his way into a bad play/shot especially. I wonder if part of this is on the system they run. Lebron surely in some situations near the end of the game mostly needs to just demand the basketball in some way. But I do wonder if some of that stagnant play on O is him or the system because I see the other cavs players do the same thing when he or Kyrie has the ball in their hands.
You bringing that up really makes me curious how Lebron would fair in say, San Antonio. I think if Lebron could adapt to not being so ball dominant, he would be even more of an efficient force in a system like that for the reasons you just mentioned. Back cuts, pin downs, all of that would be a must do in that offense, while I feel like in the Cavs scheme that may be a bit of freelance play as weird as that sounds.

Had a discussion with a guy today at work about what would've happened in this series had you switched Lebron and KD. Not to discredit what KD in this series because it was absolutely fantastic to watch, but if lebron had the likes of Steph, Klay and draymond along with him it would be absolutely terrifying. Lebron going 1v1 while the other 3 set screen after screen and slips and curls and back cuts with lebrons passing ability would be the most unfair thing ever.
I do think all the standing the Cavs do is a product of the system. As good as a passer as James is, it's much easier for shooters to catch and shoot as opposed to constantly moving and getting forced into an awkward catch and shoot situation possibly. I think as long as Lebron has the ball in his hands he would fit into almost any system. It's when the ball is not in his hands that he struggles to grasp different intricacies of the game.

100%. Not sure what to add to that.
Another discussion that intrigues me, who drives the GSW more, KD or Steph? After game 2 I said to a friend Steph was my finals MVP. He said that would never happen only because KD matched up with Bron and it seems the guy who matches up with Bron wins the finals MVP if their team wins.

Now KD definitely deserved the finals MVP when all was said and done, but I am of the opinion Steph makes it all work more so than KD as great as KD is.

If give the choice between those 2 I'm taking Steph for the pure fact that he's the primary ball handler. But I will argue with anyone that the most important player to what Golden State does is Draymond. Like him or hate him he's the guy that makes the engine run for GSW. All those screens that Cleveland blitzed and doubled Steph on? The ball wound up in the hands of Draymond who routinely makes good decisions when put in those situations. He also makes sure that no one on the other teams messes with one of his guys.

Oh Dray is vital to their success. I think those 3 core guys (Steph, Thompson, Green) are all irreplaceable for various reasons. It's almost hard to differentiate them. They could put anybody with those 3 and they are the Warriors we know and love (or hate). Take one of those guys away though and it's suddenly no longer the same.

 

[wiuhusker]

^I wouldn't say a high percentage, but Lebron had defensive lapses no doubt. I didn't call him the GOAT, B.B. did. I was saying no matter what Lebron does he will never be the defacto GOAT at this point. He could rattle off 4 straight championships and Finals MVPs putting up triple doubles each time and still the title of GOAT would go to Jordan for most. Right now, in my mind, Lebron is either the second or third best player of all time. It would take something like I just mentioned for Lebron to replace Jordan in my opinion.

Now as for the lapses, they are inexcusable in a sense. Lebron played some good D in this series at times but he looked completely helpless at others. It was a bad look. He used to be one of the best defenders in the world too, that's what boggles my mind. I understand father time has gotten to him a little but the iggy dunks in particular were just inexcusable. If he would have contested and got dunked on that is one thing, but it's like he didn't really even try.

That being said, I thought Lebron out hustled his team on transition defense. He didn't always get there but I got the sense he was trying unlike his partner Kevin Love among others. I didn't see him loafing in transition that much if at all really, but I may have just missed that.

Wasn't trying to make it sound like you were stating that. Probably should've picked BB's post and not yours.
I completely agree with the bolded part above. I guess the best description for some of his defensive lapses would be him being disinterested? Not sure how else to explain it. One other thing that drove me nuts with him in this series is how stagnant he was when Kyrie had the ball in his hands. All he had to do was look at the team across from him to realize a pin down screen or a back cut could get him or his team an easy layup. Instead he stood and watched like a fan.

you know, it does frustrate me as well watching Lebron stand there on the wing as Kyrie dances his way into a bad play/shot especially. I wonder if part of this is on the system they run. Lebron surely in some situations near the end of the game mostly needs to just demand the basketball in some way. But I do wonder if some of that stagnant play on O is him or the system because I see the other cavs players do the same thing when he or Kyrie has the ball in their hands.
You bringing that up really makes me curious how Lebron would fair in say, San Antonio. I think if Lebron could adapt to not being so ball dominant, he would be even more of an efficient force in a system like that for the reasons you just mentioned. Back cuts, pin downs, all of that would be a must do in that offense, while I feel like in the Cavs scheme that may be a bit of freelance play as weird as that sounds.

Had a discussion with a guy today at work about what would've happened in this series had you switched Lebron and KD. Not to discredit what KD in this series because it was absolutely fantastic to watch, but if lebron had the likes of Steph, Klay and draymond along with him it would be absolutely terrifying. Lebron going 1v1 while the other 3 set screen after screen and slips and curls and back cuts with lebrons passing ability would be the most unfair thing ever.
I do think all the standing the Cavs do is a product of the system. As good as a passer as James is, it's much easier for shooters to catch and shoot as opposed to constantly moving and getting forced into an awkward catch and shoot situation possibly. I think as long as Lebron has the ball in his hands he would fit into almost any system. It's when the ball is not in his hands that he struggles to grasp different intricacies of the game.

100%. Not sure what to add to that.
Another discussion that intrigues me, who drives the GSW more, KD or Steph? After game 2 I said to a friend Steph was my finals MVP. He said that would never happen only because KD matched up with Bron and it seems the guy who matches up with Bron wins the finals MVP if their team wins.

Now KD definitely deserved the finals MVP when all was said and done, but I am of the opinion Steph makes it all work more so than KD as great as KD is.

If give the choice between those 2 I'm taking Steph for the pure fact that he's the primary ball handler. But I will argue with anyone that the most important player to what Golden State does is Draymond. Like him or hate him he's the guy that makes the engine run for GSW. All those screens that Cleveland blitzed and doubled Steph on? The ball wound up in the hands of Draymond who routinely makes good decisions when put in those situations. He also makes sure that no one on the other teams messes with one of his guys.

Oh Dray is vital to their success. I think those 3 core guys (Steph, Thompson, Green) are all irreplaceable for various reasons. It's almost hard to differentiate them. They could put anybody with those 3 and they are the Warriors we know and love (or hate). Take one of those guys away though and it's suddenly no longer the same.

I would tend to agree with the first part. Not sure they could put just anyone with those 3 and be fine though. Obviously Durant was a perfect fit for them but I'm not sure they could just plug and play. Would take a certain style of play out of the other two guys to keep their system running smoothly.

 

[HuskermanMike]

I thought in game 3 and 4 I saw a lot more ball movement from the Cavs. In the road games though they were very stagnant at times. Kyrie needs to work in around a little to move the defense, then with 10 or less seconds on the clock do what he does best which is get buckets. During the series Kyrie would not pass the ball and a long miss lead to transition buckets for the warriors, so in a sense the Cavs play better when the ball is moving.

I would bet the Cavs make some moves but this team is still elite, they are 2 min away from a 6 game series and lots of missed shots that can be fixed in the future. Wonder what they will do as they are in luxury tax doom. Someone on the bench needs to step up because Lebron and Kyrie can't play 45 or more minutes every game to win.